Growing a City?

[Patches]

Is the only way to grow a city through bring in Freight and Freight Items?

I stepped up Passenger Trains or/and Mail delivery. They seem to have no effect on growing the city except for opening new Freight items. I've played other games like this one and when your grow the population traveling through your city, some should stay.

Plus this Warehouse problem. I watched youtube, read many comments on how the Warehouse works, etc. I know there's a problem goods going to the Warehouse instead of the Factories in your town. That's a major bug'

The different ways people say to use the Warehouses are hit and miss. I've spent hours trying different ways to my cities to make goods and set-up routes for people down the track to want the same goods. One town it might work a little, another nothing at all and 1 city that worked great making Factory Goods.

I'm done with this game I think until a patch comes out to fix or change the way Warehouses work as it's a cluster at the moment. Making money is not hard, not even receiving 70%. I guess you could raise the track, etc prices also.

enjoy, I'll be back after a patch to try again devs
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[mart95777]

there is a problem with demand-supply, and how it is determined if the train would pickup cargo or not. From discussion in "bug reporting" forum, I know devs are working on that now. So we possibly will have solution to moving goods around problems in some not that distant patch.
And what I found about the problem, I know from my own game playing, so how devs are going to solve the issue, I have no idea. They are aware of this issue.
Warehouses are probably not that of a problem, at least I think so.

[Willow Rivers]

Yes only way to grow a city is supply it's demand for goods. Need 60% fulfillment rate for normal growth and 80% fulfillment rate for accelerated growth. You cannot grow a city with just providing passenger and mail service.

[Patches]

Originally posted by Willow Rivers:

Yes only way to grow a city is supply it's demand for goods. Need 60% fulfillment rate for normal growth and 80% fulfillment rate for accelerated growth. You cannot grow a city with just providing passenger and mail service.

I had an end or beginning city branching out to 2 cities.1 on each side of the mountain. I needed 2500 more people to unlock Furniture. A private party owned the Furniture Factory in the city. I spent hours sending people, mail and and any freight it wasn't already getting.

Got the population to go up 500 people after a few hours and gave up.

This game is lacking a lot if only train freight moves the game forward. I guess the people and mail get's you money. But you don't even need the Expess Items to play the game it sounds like.

thanks guys for the replies
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[jhughes]

Originally posted by Patches:

Originally posted by Willow Rivers:

Yes only way to grow a city is supply it's demand for goods. Need 60% fulfillment rate for normal growth and 80% fulfillment rate for accelerated growth. You cannot grow a city with just providing passenger and mail service.

I had an end or beginning city branching out to 2 cities.1 on each side of the mountain. I needed 2500 more people to unlock Furniture. A private party owned the Furniture Factory in the city. I spent hours sending people, mail and and any freight it wasn't already getting.

Got the population to go up 500 people after a few hours and gave up.

This game is lacking a lot if only train freight moves the game forward. I guess the people and mail get's you money. But you don't even need the Expess Items to play the game it sounds like.

thanks guys for the replies
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It is quite simple. This is a game. The only way the game grows population is to get 60% of the item demands met. It is not a debate, it is a fact. If you want the population to grow, get 60% of the material demands met.

[DD13]

Just look at your supply list and see what the city has under 60% and send that along to the city. I've been playing without warehouses at all and been doing fine.

[Patches]

Originally posted by DD13:

Just look at your supply list and see what the city has under 60% and send that along to the city. I've been playing without warehouses at all and been doing fine.

That's exactly what I'm doing with Warehouses or sending direct from the farms. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. I was going to start a new game and just use warehouses to move single items like sugar. These type items seem to flow through the warehouses with ease.

Sounds like Warehouses are the bug in this game if it works fine without them. I was going to start one that way, but said why? and didn't. That's the same way the 1st one works, just play it.

I like using the warehouses making complicated routes over and under each other. I have a good amount of hours in the 1st version and liked the way the warehouses worked. I also like the idea they are going for here with the warehouses if they can get it work correct.

Plus I've got a gazillion hours in TF and TF2 and games like Sim City. Didn't play City Skylines that much, but the CS 2 looks good.

thanks for the replies.
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[Dray Prescot]

Mail and Passengers have NO Effect on growth of a City's population,

There are some buildings in RE 2 that have an affect, but it is primarily determined by your Satisfaction of Supply versus of Demand of Consumer Goods, i.e. Freight Goods to each City, including whatever is produced by the local Industries.

In RE 1 ONLY Resources and Manufactured Goods Consumed, i.e. Consumer Goods, by the population (citizens) affected growth of the City. (Except for the Library)

Resources/Goods consumed and demanded by Industries had NO Affect on growth of the City. Some Resources such as Grain can be consumed and demanded by the population as well as by an Industry, i.e. a Brewery.

The demand amounts in Carloads per week for Consumer Goods in RE 2 are figured somewhat differently in RE 2 than in RE 1. I am not going to describe how that was done in RE 1, it was more complicated, and does not matter for RE 2.

In RE 2, the 1st 5 Consumer Goods (Grain, Corn, Wood/Lumber, Beer and Meat) all have the same demand amounts. Cattle and Wool are ONLY Industrial Goods, Not Consumer Goods, i.e. they are only used by Industries. Cattle and Wool Consumption and Demand have NO affect on population growth, they act through Meat and Cloth being consumed and demanded by the population.

Those 1st 5 Consumer Goods have twice the Weekly Demand of all other Consumer Goods, but Individual Consumer Goods only start being demanded when the population grows in size, by 5000 population increments. You can see the Demands in the City Info screen, and at what populations they start being demanded. They also depend on the Techs currently available in your game, and therefore on the Date/Era of your game.

The first 7 Consumer Goods (Grain, Corn, Wood, Beer, Meat, Sugar and Cloth) are demanded by ALL Cities, even the smallest.

In RE 1, satisfaction of Consumer Demand was calculated by taking the Total Carloads of Consumer Goods Supplied (i.e. Consumed) and divide by the Total Carloads of Consumer Goods Demanded, on a weekly basis, This is what gives you that N% figure for satisfaction of Demand.

With one last adjustment: it was a weighted average over the last 2 months (60 Days) with old results weighted less than more recent results. Possibly they are figuring the weighted average somewhat differently than they did in RE 1.

If the N% was less than 40% the population shrinks,
between 40% and 60% the population does not change,
between 60% and 80% the population grows,
and over 80% the population grows even faster.

In RE 2 they have not said that they changed how it was figured from RE 1,
So our only reasonable guess it that it is the same or very similar, other than how the demand levels for Consumer Goods are figured, and how the weighting of the average is done.

What it looks like to me is that for example,

at 40k population of a City: Grain, Corn, Wood, Beer and Meat are all demanded at 0.8 Carloads per Week, all other Consumer Goods are at 0.4 Carloads per Week, IF they are demanded at all

at 100k population of a City: Grain, Corn, Wood, Beer, and Meat are all 2 Carloads demanded per Week, and all other Consumer Goods are at 1 Carload per Week, IF they are demanded at all.

or for each 10k of population in a City: 0.2 Carloads per week for the the 1st Five Consumer Goods and 0.1 Carload per Week for the rest of the Consumer Goods (IF they are demanded at all).

From personal observation of Cities in RE 2, allowing for a time lag of the weighted average, to change/update the current N%, RE 2 seems to be following the above way of figuring Satisfaction of Consumer Supply versus Demand. (I suspect the weighted average may be over a shorter time period, or figured somewhat differently than in RE 1)


Remember that they are looking at Total Carloads Consumed (Supplied) divided by Total Carloads Demanded per week of Consumer Goods by the population of the City.

Supply and Demand of Grain By Breweries does not enter the calculations for growth of City population. Other Industrial Goods, such as Cattle Wool, Iron, etc. do not matter either.

Cloth is BOTH consumed by population as well as used as an input good to Industry to produce Clothing.

Wooden Planks are another Consumer Good that is also an Industrial Input Good (for furniture).

Many other Industrial Input Goods can also be Consumer Goods.

Manufactured Goods that are consumed by the population, DO MATTER in this calculation, but not any demands by Industry.

[Bored Peon]

Originally posted by Dray Prescot:

a bunch of good stuff...have a cookie

My only question to this is this:
"How exactly does the Immigration building fit in?"

[Dray Prescot]

I thought he was complaining about not understanding how supply of Freight goods affected growth.

[Patches]

Originally posted by Bored Peon:

Originally posted by Dray Prescot:

a bunch of good stuff...have a cookie

My only question to this is this:
"How exactly does the Immigration building fit in?"

I think it makes your population grow somehow by I believe 15%. And the town has to have over 30K people.

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[Bored Peon]

Originally posted by Patches:

Originally posted by Bored Peon:

My only question to this is this:
"How exactly does the Immigration building fit in?"

I think it makes your population grow somehow by I believe 15%. And the town has to have over 30K people.

g

Well that is what I mean, does it just grow by 15% (can be more with tech) or does it give a bonus to existing growth?

Originally posted by Dray Prescot:

I thought he was complaining about not understanding how supply of Freight goods affected growth.

Nah, from what I saw the OP was wondering how it worked because other games similar would increase population with tourists.

[Patches]

Originally posted by Dray Prescot:

I thought he was complaining about not understanding how supply of Freight goods affected growth.

There's no doubt the Warehouse functions are out of wack as a guy explained. You bring goods in to supply a Factory to your Warehouse. The Warehouse sends the items on down the chain and not to your Factory. It should supply your Factory 1st and ship any extra down the line to make room for the next load.

I found that if you took all items out of the Warehouse that pertained to the Factory. Sometimes I could send the goods straight from the farm to the Factory and they would produce the goods. But sometimes it still wouldn't send any goods to my Town or Factory when it says they have none.

The Dev said we have Warehouses that transfer goods by pre-orders from towns or factories. The Warehouses are not for stocking goods. I think the 1st game was for stocking goods. I like that better.

My other thought was why when you add more people to your town by trains (you know, it's a train game) the town doesn't grow. But I see, you get more goods 1st, then the people show-up. In the business's I've owned or run for someone else as a manager. When the town grows and more people show up, we then buy more goods. (I've done this stuff in real life also, retired now. Furniture Stores mostly as a Manager.)

anyway, thanks for the info Dray also.
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[Patches]

Originally posted by Bored Peon:

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Well that is what I mean, does it just grow by 15% (can be more with tech) or does it give a bonus to existing growth?[/quote]

Look in game under the "?" next to the speed control. That's where I get some of my info.

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[Duffman]

I would suggest not doing warehouses in cities at all. If you are growing a big city you should have maint station and dispatch center (possibly remove maint station late game and have other stations handle maintenance). I start most games building a warehouse at a base good country station (2 base goods even better!) then shipping all base goods there and then to cities. Try to get one of these base good stations every maybe 5-7 cities.

Also fright is only good at growing cities not making real money. Once I am at 5-6 stations I start a express only line at a second station and second track. Express is where you make your real money.

[Patches]

Originally posted by Duffman:

I would suggest not doing warehouses in cities at all. If you are growing a big city you should have maint station and dispatch center (possibly remove maint station late game and have other stations handle maintenance). I start most games building a warehouse at a base good country station (2 base goods even better!) then shipping all base goods there and then to cities. Try to get one of these base good stations every maybe 5-7 cities.

Also fright is only good at growing cities not making real money. Once I am at 5-6 stations I start a express only line at a second station and second track. Express is where you make your real money.

I understand now from reading, watching and asking how they want the game to function. They just have a problem with the Warehouses not doing what the game needs. Like sending logs to a warehouse in a city which makes planks. And the factory making planks gets 1st shot at the logs. If any are left, they can help fulfill an order say in the next city with a need for logs.

Stuff like sugar, salt, veggies, etc. seem to flow through the warehouses fine.

The problem has been reported I've read a couple times. Doesn't seem like a hard fix, I'm sure they're working on the problem. I got other games to play and I'll be back for the full game as intended.

thanks
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