The Mountain Clans- How best to play?

[cbinetti]

To me, the Mountain Clans are really fun to play but I am very bad at playing them. The low initiative is really hurting me. The spells are great but I cannot usually afford the really good ones. On a level playing field, how do I beat the Legions? Are Druidesses/Archdruidesses or at least Alchemists mandatory in each unit? Yetis work well. Locked Dwarves work well. Hermits are often hard for me to get. Sons of Ymir are amazing but hard to get. Kings Guards seem like a good hero but do I not need the Mage Lord to be effective? Warrior Lords could be effective if I have an army of squads but that is not always an effective strategy.

[QWEEDDY2]

unit can be locked at any moment.

yeah clans t1 is bad joke since Disciples 1. Too weak each unit and whole squad. Even Legions got more useful support on t2 but Clans have it on t1 get useful only on t3(/t4)(and t4 worse).
They have more HP so ok low ini. But why huge XP cap...

Dwarf King just t4 units from Disciples 1 replaced to t5 and initially got REDUCED STATS. Devs fixed that in patches forblast 2.02 and a bit more in subj D2ROTE 3.01 game.
In ROTE he at least not so bad. Bad Rune master are better probably. For x2 attack.

5 hermit is good and you even can get them just from front line warriors. Best advance of Clans Unit Tiers Tree. We should count which unit from last grade we can get. So Alliance and Empire still perfect armies. Not just for healers, but for their back line archers got from archers, support from support, mage getting from mage. Their t1 are stronger for that.

Clans on t5 is 3rd one. Not because units are finally much stronger, but because we upgrade our squad in a easier "soft" ways.

Hordes are 4th. Legions 5th.

But Hordes have Weight dealing with every High Tiers. At same time it is Hordes who Number#1.

And there is scale for t1 where Aliiance, Empire, Hordes/Legions and Clans much lower of them all in combine. On t1 they most weakest. Very hard to get t2 and keep fast temp.

In general it is get some balance. For units stats Clans stronger. Someone who are better at temp and turns managing can try to play as non-Alliance/Empire and win those player who slower.

There is no META units. They only what to mention is Elder One (thunder air AOE 2block size unit opposite to Son of Yamir) have no advantages over Yeti. Yeti is much powerfully and low at XP and Gold cost.

Archdruide is no go in MP as it is very rare benefits and even rarest in more faster matches of multiplayer games.
Alchemist??? If you want to have it - get it on t1 squad mandatory. You need ulgrade ASAP and start to get overlevels too. Just like every support units. Without this its useless. Although+75% of druid and almost-100% of Archdruide still less useful (Cure is useful but low Clans ini and high Druid ini reduce efficiency of it).
Alchemist make it worth for every battle when you get her. I mean wortless (ZERO worth) until get Tier3 grade.

Shorter the Tree - stronger the unit. Always. So no go for Dwarf King and Rune Master for MP or small SP skirmish scenario maps.

Wolf Lord is interesting unit as chose between AOE in front or warrior in front. In fast* matches Spirit of Fenrir is good enough. But ideally it is two units, one in back and do regular AOE job. i dont think its a good idea in fast/+MP matches...? Hermit are better.

[Mirror System X]

The Son of Ymir is superior from the giants group, while the Elder ones are something I mainly would take if I already have other poison-type of effect or I can get a Son from rare shops. Usually I take just one, while taking two can make some other units uncomfortable, and, yes, without a loremaster it is not always convenient to play that way.

The fighters group have good options, but I mainly take Hermit just because I use the rod-planter most of the time as I go adjusted to that personally and I can handle the extra difficulty pretty well. However, should you take Loremaster, you might prefer Rune master or Dwarf king. The Rune master can hit for up to 2 x 300 damage, which can make him easily the better choice in average and heavier maps, unless you need the other fighter's extra armour. With a Banner of fortitude you can actually achieve 90 armor somewhat easily when needed if you bother much about the protection.

The shooters group has that nice little engineer that doesn't have much damage, but can upgrade it particularly well over time, while also having fire ward and area-of effect. The high-damage shooter is not a big deal most of the time.

The support-oriented group has the Archdruidess and the Alchemist. They are both options that can work, at least in short and average quests, but I usually prefer to lock a Warrior or a shooting dwarf instead and move on.

The Yeti can be partially helpful, but it's not a big deal, it is very inferior to the Hermit (even a bit too much), so I just use the extra unit to protect empty owned cities.

Best banners here are banner of fortitude and the initiative banner, while the rest are a bit inferior. Best artifacts - paralyse/petrify, bethrezen's claw or ring of the ages, enchanted circlet. You don't need the polymorph artifact much here due to abundance of damage type sources. Best boots might be the water-boots (of elements), but, well, boots of seven leagues are great most of the time anyway. Tome of XP bonus is almost always the best.

You can put in the rod-planter as a leader and play on very hard as and extra difficulty adds in for making it more interesting, but also this way you would have the oportunity to get rods quickly with him (oh yeah, there is that spell that returns all move points, even potentially double it if you have the magical perk) and keep him as the only game leader in all maps, just getting thieves at times. The loremaster is just like all mage-leaders - strong and effective. And can make the game too easy, ofc. The other two leaders are also strong, but with that low initiative of theirs, they are still mediocre.

[QWEEDDY2]

you suggest sometimws take another attacking unit instead of Tenderfoot type, right? Yeah me too get to that idea after i tried Disciples 1 in-depth (and return to Disciples 2). For how long i played Dis2 its not cross mine mind unit kinda recently.

But i disagree about mid-/early-stages/short map. They useful only in last grades with maybe overlevels for last Tier grades for them and whole party +overlevels.
Even if you mean Archdruide. Which start to lose to Alchimist. Tenderfoot-Druid +25%->75%->barely+100% is have 0 use in early stage. Tenderfoot +25% in Tier1 party? Any Tier1 warrior (axe thrower) deal more damage. You agree i suppose.
What next? Tier2 party and Tier2 tenderfoot +50%? Same. Tier2 level 2 axe thrower do the more damage. Entire first mission of campaign.
Then it goes mid-stage. Druidess+75% or Alchemist +1. +1 is almost equal to have another unit. Only after Dis1 i released its not always useful as i thought. Sometimes have another unit is better (10 ini you perfectly know). But sometimes it give advantages. Even "Cure" better than Archdruides real Cure. Sometimes.
For dot-effect affected unit getting regular turn and get regular dot effect damage. But it count as regular turn also to reduce duration of affect. So Alchemist can "Cure" 1-turn paralysis and make gone faster for dot effect/long-turn paralyze.
Dot-effect did not mean anything. It is still additional turn for unit which is always better.

But normal Cure is even better - if not 70 initiative. Archidruidess Cure is useless against Phantom Warrior, Abyssal Devil, Overlord, Tiamath (this one just not cured by Cure). She effective only against low-ini (without huge ini boost) support-controllers Shade, Incubus/Succubus, Medussa.

Comparing to others supporters it is very weak one. Cure potentially better than +1 but still not worth spent gold and XP on whole Tenderfoot tree. Hard choice take it or not and which path.

I decide for larger maps to take, and decide to prefer Alchemist for destroying Capitals. Nor Cure nor +100% has effects against Capital Guardians. So i decide Alchemist as main path. Shortened path also always better for skirmish/MP - always better. Always more overlevels less XP and gold cost. Archidruidess for few campaign only missions. And no tenderfoots for smallest maps or Tier-locked maps or two first missions of Dis1/Dis2 campaigns.

This unit most reliable on his(her in D2) Tier upgrades. Few else units are less reliable on it, and some else entirely not reliable on it. If no last grades available or able to get it - better indeed take another unit. Regular fighter damage dealer.
If you decide skip tenderfoot entirely, you agree with me Archidruidess are useless in half of battles +Capitals/5lvl cities.

Im not sure i get you, Mirror X, right for lock type. You mean two dwarf warriors - one locked at warriror stage and another goes to hermit-mage? Interesting idea.
For one of them i dont get which is better. Rune Master better than Dwarf Clan King since 2 attacks is not alternate possible while armor always available in alternate ways (with Alchimist or Sphere of Rage Rune master still do x4 turns which still count as x2 more than regular available unlike armor).
Its what i prefer in early play-through experience. Rune Master (and Holy Avenger for Empire). But up to today for whole warrior tree, forr Clans i still not decide preferred one in warriors. Chosing between warrior-mages and Master. Largest maps are for hermit, what about Wolf Lord on small maps? I dont know wich one i want as main variant. Including Capitals. Rune is like ice cream for me "i want it, i want it!" for Capitals while WolfLord/Hermit for regular battles.

Very based on who is main hero? At first though yes. But what units for second hero? If main is Engineer still another archer(shooter) in archer path needed for second loremaster/warrior(/rod planter?) and still there is alternate front line warriors so no need for tank-role to pick Rune Master(neither DwarfKing) but Mountaneer(Hermit/WolfLord) path instead.

I prefer have at least one 2-sized unit as main tank defender. Son of Yamir or Yeti (instead of Elder One). For regular battles Yeti even better than SonofYamir cause of much overlevels, low cost (=more overlevels for him - and entire party cause [+] units still take experience), +90% stats grows to 10 level, Level1 Tier 2 unit (2-sized) as base for 90% stats grows. Even Titan of Empire are best frontline fighter cause of all that pros. But worst of special units (second worst is Alliance).
So Son of Yamir win only by Frostbite effect and as Capital crusher. Just like Rune Master win Hermit for that.

Its non-rarest hard choices of this game. For regular battles ones units are better, for some battles it is another one.