Disciples II: Rise of the Elves

Disciples II: Rise of the Elves

KolPom May 15, 2019 @ 5:31am
So... with upgrades should I pick?
Hello guys and girls
Im kinda new to the game and I need little advise on units and upgrades. For example with fighter unit of Undeads.
Is it a good ideat to pick a shorter upgrade route in any case? I prefer Templar and Dark Lords for elements wards but Im not sure if picking a Zombie upgrade is not better choise as I will eventualy get (in teory) a much stronger units like Skeleton Champion.
Originally posted by QWEEDDY2:
Shorter stronger, especially in skirmish\online with low XP available on scenario map.

Longest tier units strong only on last levels. Zombie do not have any special abilities. And that abilities always better than just HP\DP. - and Zombie (same for orher factions) do not advance in HP so much. And require more XP.
Undead last level warrior - Phantom Sceleton Warrior have 3-turn (usually) 50% chance Paralyze hit. This is his features and not - cause against AI it abusing\cheating.

For Empire superior warrior is Defender of Faith on 5 lvl. Armor more important for surviving, and hole gameplay about surviving and XP farm. Also destroying Capitals. So 2nd powerfull warrior for Empire - Grand Inquisitor 4lvl, cause Immune almost same as Armor allow to survive longer in battles. Also 4 lvl Inquisitor have less XP to upgrade that 3lvl and more less that any other 4 lvl Empire units. So Angel with his Damage Point - most useless unit. Inquisitor 4+1 lvlv more powerfull. And only Paladin 4 lvl stronger, cause - again - armor.

For damage you can choose Holy Avenger - 2x300 better than 1x300 and even 2x75 is MORE than 1x150. But Disciples game about surviving - especially for tanks, so choose Defender\Inqusitor\Paladin.

The Elven Alliance have most stronger front warriors. Especially in campaign, where you have existed unts in Capital. Hire another Centaur and choose another way for him. And you have two (fast upgraded both) different tanks - one with Armor, and another against armor units (Critical hit most effective against that units). Armored Centaur better, again -cause armor and less XP requirement. Unfortunatly, the Rise of the Elves expansion released "too fast" and have a lot of bugs, even with new playable Elves units. Armored Centaur do not upgrade his armor with new levels (all old units did it - up to 10 lvls, so neutrals can have +9 armor).
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Showing 1-15 of 16 comments
strigvir May 15, 2019 @ 6:07am 
Strong doubt enough girls play this game to visit this particular thread on these particular forums in this particular time.
You can pick shorter upgrades until the longer upgrades get unlocked.
Generally it depends on the unit though.
The author of this thread has indicated that this post answers the original topic.
QWEEDDY2 May 15, 2019 @ 7:41pm 
Shorter stronger, especially in skirmish\online with low XP available on scenario map.

Longest tier units strong only on last levels. Zombie do not have any special abilities. And that abilities always better than just HP\DP. - and Zombie (same for orher factions) do not advance in HP so much. And require more XP.
Undead last level warrior - Phantom Sceleton Warrior have 3-turn (usually) 50% chance Paralyze hit. This is his features and not - cause against AI it abusing\cheating.

For Empire superior warrior is Defender of Faith on 5 lvl. Armor more important for surviving, and hole gameplay about surviving and XP farm. Also destroying Capitals. So 2nd powerfull warrior for Empire - Grand Inquisitor 4lvl, cause Immune almost same as Armor allow to survive longer in battles. Also 4 lvl Inquisitor have less XP to upgrade that 3lvl and more less that any other 4 lvl Empire units. So Angel with his Damage Point - most useless unit. Inquisitor 4+1 lvlv more powerfull. And only Paladin 4 lvl stronger, cause - again - armor.

For damage you can choose Holy Avenger - 2x300 better than 1x300 and even 2x75 is MORE than 1x150. But Disciples game about surviving - especially for tanks, so choose Defender\Inqusitor\Paladin.

The Elven Alliance have most stronger front warriors. Especially in campaign, where you have existed unts in Capital. Hire another Centaur and choose another way for him. And you have two (fast upgraded both) different tanks - one with Armor, and another against armor units (Critical hit most effective against that units). Armored Centaur better, again -cause armor and less XP requirement. Unfortunatly, the Rise of the Elves expansion released "too fast" and have a lot of bugs, even with new playable Elves units. Armored Centaur do not upgrade his armor with new levels (all old units did it - up to 10 lvls, so neutrals can have +9 armor).
Originally posted by strigvir:
Strong doubt enough girls play this game to visit this particular thread on these particular forums in this particular time.
Girls? I am confused, sorry.

By the way, QWEEDDY2's post is pretty good help. I would also say to just pick what you like, if you play single player, just to make it more fun. In campaigns I would often pick 1 upgrade on chapter 1, then another upgrade on chapter 2.
I think that, unfortunately, there are a lot of upgrades that are just a lot better than their counterparts, which removes choice, cause you can always pick the best. For example, if you ever play the Empire, picking mass healers who heal the entire party is almost always better than picking the single unit healer. Also, picking the ones that level fast is a secure choice in both long and short levels, unless it's REALLY difficult.
QWEEDDY2 May 17, 2019 @ 1:26am 
2 lvl (first upgrade tier) healer better for 1-target. Especially in campaign, when you have only 4(+1 later) total leadership and do not have next upgrades.

Another unit: Clan archidruid (or alchimist? im not sure...). He (she?) always better, cause allow attack twice. x75 Is always better than 1x150. You even can set Defend - but only for next round (druid have 10 ini). On high level your Clans units already have about 200 dmg and more - so +100% damage boost actually be only 80%. And that boost work for single target...
Or wait, last upgrade for that Clans unit boost work to the end of battle. Still +1attack (or defend) is better even for Mage.

Empire Holy Avenger cant attack and then set Defend. But still he can attack two different targets. Angel always be useless.

Some units have weak special ability or non of them. Sometimes that units even do not have increase HP of damage. That units must have lowest XP reuirements. But Strategy First experiments with balance after Dis1 (and new tier units for each race) make some units really abslutely useless. Some upgrades give only few HP\DP but require MORE XP. Some units do not have anything but still have even more XP for no reason. I remember at least two units for Clans, and one for Demons...
- Incubus. He (actually Incubus & Succubus both not male or female - demons) have very low accuaracy and high random chances for EACH enemy TURN that enemy go back to normal. And Fat\Imp still can attack. And Incub have more XP than regular mage (but almost same with Succubus)
Very Hard especially work "harder" for units with paralyze\Imping and etc. For player that units missed more often than others.
Alwer May 17, 2019 @ 5:55am 
Buy werewolves and win.
Last edited by Alwer; May 17, 2019 @ 5:56am
strigvir May 17, 2019 @ 6:05am 
Alchemist as a must-have is sketchy. "Attacking twice" is useless when the second attack goes after everyone, including supports, made their turns. Sometimes can even go after a healer too. It's far better to buff a high initiative unit at the start of the combat, than have some residue damage. Even at the very end game scenario (all other units are single tile ones doing capped damage) Alchemist provides at best 20% more damage, if she doesn't get disabled beforehand.
Clans are the worst in terms of useless upgrades. There is no reason to go the spellcasting tree for Giants since the end product is a 2 tile caster with the lowest initiative for caster units. Meanwhile melee branch sports the highest initiative in the Clans and cold DoT on top.
The generic melee tree is better off going into Hermit and do AoE damage instead, not to mention their XP threshold is pretty low too. 20 ini melee units which require a lot more investment is just a bad joke.
Last edited by strigvir; May 17, 2019 @ 6:09am
QWEEDDY2 May 17, 2019 @ 6:18pm 
strigvir
As im remember, Clan have units with 50 ini. And tat units have most damage points.
+1 attack ability allow one of most wounded unit sty in Defend for next round. And still attack.


Defender of Faith with 30 armor ---- 70 ini
King of the Clan(?) with 20 armor -- 20 ini
So, ole Clan faction is a bad joke. All of them have increased HP than others factions units. And for that they all have same -same time - low ini and increades XP. For Empire - that most weak at the start - (but have healer) - they have lowest XP requirements.
"There is no and never be balance in duel" (c) - no balance in 1vs1. And still if we try compare 1vs1 factions - Mountain Clans always be weakness.

1,2 place - Empire or The Elven Alliance
3 place - Legions of the Damned
4 place - Undead Hordes
5 place - Neutrals
999(9) place - Mountain Clans

For 2vs2 match Dwarf must be allied with Empire(\Elves as alternative) or - better for magic balance - with Demons.
Alliance Undead+Dwarf never can collect much XP and resource to compete with Demons+Elves(\Empire). Demons\Empire upgrade theyr units too fast... very fast.
Most important things - how fast your parties can upgrade and how fast you collect resources. Empire\Elves and Demons do it much faster than Undead and more much faster than Mountain Clans.
HidesHisFace May 19, 2019 @ 9:54am 
Depends on situation.

For example - early in Empire's campaign, where you do not have access to full leadership yet, cleric (single target, stronger heal) line is likely to work better.
Again, with Empire - Grand Inquisitor line is underrated - it is absolutely fantastic against undead and demons due to mind immunity and fire ward, while requiring very small amount of xp to level up - Grand Inquisitors become powerful very, very quickly.
Angel is also useful for shorter games or where you do not have access to level 5 units yet. Angel is stronger than Paladin in direct combat. Though keep in mind - armour of Paladin synergises better with healers.
The choice between Defender of Faith and Divine Avenger is mostly a matter of preference, but Divine Avenger gets the edge in very long games.

For Clans - Wolf Lord is almost never worth it. Hermit is actually a fantastic unit and levels up quickly.
The longer line is also good, but given Clan's large xp requirements, it is a significant investment. From this line, the Rune Master is generally superior.
Between Druidess and Alchemist line - Druidess is better in most cases, because the damage buff lasts the entire battle AND Druidess has high initiative, meaning that even if she gets sniped, she will buff at least a single unit.

For the Undead - Dark Lord line is good for shorter games and before you get access to Phantom Warrior. It levels super quickly, and works fairly well against armies with ton of elemental damage, like Elves, or Clans.
For Mages - Death and Wight line are actually very viable and annoying to deal with when compared to more standard mages.

For Demons - Incubus and Succubus lines - you sacrifice damage for utility in their cases. Incubus is basically a better version of Undead Shade unit. Succubus lacks accuracy BUT polymorph has certain advantages - units morphed into imps lose immunities and wards, as well as any natural armour they had.

For Elves - shorter path with archers is actually often the better option - elemental damage. Especially if you are facing Undead. In fact, the last physical damage path upgrade - the Marauder is pretty bad, because previous unit, the Brigand when locked, levels up far quicker and after 6 level ups catches up with damage whie having MORE health.
QWEEDDY2 May 19, 2019 @ 11:23pm 
Why you need Angel if u have Grand Inquisitor? They on same levels. Cause faster upgrade inquisitor always be +1 level. Angel can be useful for damage in Disciples 1, where units not upgraded to 99 levels (and no Grand inquisitor upgrade) (inquis. for immune ability or Paladin for armor still better choice)

Elven Maradeur - another bugged unit. Developers missed string and that unit require more XP with each level - before 99 he req. >15k! But HP not increased properly before 10 level.
HidesHisFace May 23, 2019 @ 5:10am 
Originally posted by QWEEDDY2:
Why you need Angel if u have Grand Inquisitor? They on same levels. Cause faster upgrade inquisitor always be +1 level. Angel can be useful for damage in Disciples 1, where units not upgraded to 99 levels (and no Grand inquisitor upgrade) (inquis. for immune ability or Paladin for armor still better choice)

Elven Maradeur - another bugged unit. Developers missed string and that unit require more XP with each level - before 99 he req. >15k! But HP not increased properly before 10 level.

Angel in Disciples 2 is useful in a very small, specific niche - that is in games that are short enough to get to level 4 units, but not long enough to level anything further.
Other than that, after around 2-3 level ups, Grand Inquisitor becomes far superior in basically any case.

Honestly, to be useful, Angel would need some sort of gimmick. For example, if it had "life" (or anything else, really) as source of attack, it would make it viable against Undead and would give Empire some other unit with non-physical attack. Let's face it, relying on relatively weak White Wizards and mage hero is not really viable if the enemy decides to spam Death or Wight units.
W|KINg Jul 24, 2020 @ 1:46am 
Originally posted by QWEEDDY2:

Another unit: Clan archidruid (or alchimist? im not sure...). He (she?) always better, cause allow attack twice. x75 Is always better than 1x150. You even can set Defend - but only for next round (druid have 10 ini). On high level your Clans units already have about 200 dmg and more - so +100% damage boost actually be only 80%. And that boost work for single target...
Or wait, last upgrade for that Clans unit boost work to the end of battle. Still +1attack (or defend) is better even for Mage.
i really think second option with +100% boost damage its much better. First you have CURE what is somehow the only option as healer in clans. And what is more important - your unit put second attack per round per 1 unit. Till my unit will put 2x stronger attack in 1 round for 1 unit and in second round 2x stronger attack for 2 units. Your units can beat my unit in boost damage in about + 0-5 damage from "crit" but in second round my unit beat your for RAW damage of boosted unit....
Too be honest i compared lvl 3 unit vs lvl 4 but in case druid vs alchemist its just +25% + 0-5dmg plus for alchemist in first round BUT in second round its again very better druid with 2 units with +75% boost.
What need to mention is also a fact that druid/archdruid has one from the highest initiative what can be handy if there is possibility to run away from battle for another round or just to survive long enought to do anything in first round (and to the end of the battle if that boosted unit survive to the end).
What is true is fact that if you are going with king's guard and 2x sons of ymir than mostly in late game your archdruid is less usefull with time and for your hero will be absolutly better alchemist.
But 2 round in battle and your ymir sons has 300 damage like your hero mean 3x 300 damage (+ some frostbite) and with alchemist its still 300x2 from hero and 150x2 from 2 ymir sons what is same and to the top you are sure to cure your units from nasty things what can avoid your armor.
But this scenario is the one where you can pick alchemist with first round stronger opposite to archdruid and if there is tons of exp for even level up your ymirs sons = better alchemist. But its in time when not really matter what boost you have = you kill everything anyway ;p
W|KINg Jul 24, 2020 @ 2:01am 
Originally posted by QWEEDDY2:
strigvir
As im remember, Clan have units with 50 ini. And tat units have most damage points.
+1 attack ability allow one of most wounded unit sty in Defend for next round. And still attack.


Defender of Faith with 30 armor ---- 70 ini
King of the Clan(?) with 20 armor -- 20 ini
So, ole Clan faction is a bad joke. All of them have increased HP than others factions units. And for that they all have same -same time - low ini and increades XP. For Empire - that most weak at the start - (but have healer) - they have lowest XP requirements.
"There is no and never be balance in duel" (c) - no balance in 1vs1. And still if we try compare 1vs1 factions - Mountain Clans always be weakness.

1,2 place - Empire or The Elven Alliance
3 place - Legions of the Damned
4 place - Undead Hordes
5 place - Neutrals
999(9) place - Mountain Clans

For 2vs2 match Dwarf must be allied with Empire(\Elves as alternative) or - better for magic balance - with Demons.
Alliance Undead+Dwarf never can collect much XP and resource to compete with Demons+Elves(\Empire). Demons\Empire upgrade theyr units too fast... very fast.
Most important things - how fast your parties can upgrade and how fast you collect resources. Empire\Elves and Demons do it much faster than Undead and more much faster than Mountain Clans.
You compare bad three option vs best three option. Lets think about setup : kings guard in middle of first row, behind him archdruid. And 4x hermit or if you need fire damage for any reason (water immune units or so) can use 1-2 flame casters in back. But if you use 4x hermit you have 4x 55 damage with lower initiative chance and possibility to boost single target unit 2x damage or even made hermit do double damage. after first round is maybe 1 hermit death but enemy empire / elven team has second row death and in first row at least 1 death and 2 units at half hp. And with this setup you can even after some battles just switch hermits from first row with second and continue and with that HP they have and warrior lord you are healed if it wasn't really hard battle.
W|KINg Jul 24, 2020 @ 2:10am 
For my opinion best race is undead till they don't find clans.
With immunity death can made jokes vs any undead unit that using death as source and can be found on the map. Secondly with immunity weapons cant even fighters do anything against them.
So what left ? Only mages and dragons with tons of HP to survive first wave of attacks. And if you have 1 or 2 shades in second row with lich queen then you can beat anything. Well except my setup with 4x hermit and archdruid with i mentioned up ;p
And empires with weakest mages and archers with useless poison and weapons = they are just bad joke vs them.
But i am playing it mostly in solo games where are enough xp for my setup.
And still my units are lower end lvl so no need too much coins and lvl 3 units lvl up faster to boost hp to survive even worst enemy.
Last edited by W|KINg; Jul 24, 2020 @ 2:17am
QWEEDDY2 Jul 24, 2020 @ 3:05am 
Still Clans req. too much XP fr they stats, and warriors trhee have one unit swapped from 4->5 lvl (after D1) but with old stats - only increased is XP again. Clans have one pros (HP) and two-three cons (in D1 they slowest even on strategic map - 15 move points!).
And XP is most important thing, not HP and ini. And strategic map advantages (magic\summons, move points\flying). Units stats is less important.

I saw a lot of comments that Undead is imba, piece of cake, "i can beat everyone on the map". And then humor comics about Undead where main hero (lich queen) wine that they cant save new 1 lvl warrior after +1 leadership (cause of Shade misses - that the main line in this comics). And a lot of comment after that comics "yeah me too always have troubles with 1 lvl units of Undead, pain-pain".
Most important unit upgrade for all factions is 1->2 lvls. And only Empire\Alliance do not have troubles with that. Even with Ghost and Werewolf units Undead is too weak on 1 lvl.
P.S.
http://vk.com/wall-16538983_42817
Last edited by QWEEDDY2; Jul 24, 2020 @ 3:09am
Originally posted by QWEEDDY2:
I saw a lot of comments that Undead is imba, piece of cake, "i can beat everyone on the map". And then humor comics about Undead where main hero (lich queen) wine that they cant save new 1 lvl warrior after +1 leadership (cause of Shade misses - that the main line in this comics). And a lot of comment after that comics "yeah me too always have troubles with 1 lvl units of Undead, pain-pain".
Most important unit upgrade for all factions is 1->2 lvls. And only Empire\Alliance do not have troubles with that. Even with Ghost and Werewolf units Undead is too weak on 1 lvl.
P.S.
http://vk.com/wall-16538983_42817
after leadership upgrade, you get werewolf :steammocking: then it survives :csdsmile: ! Or just put lich in front and warrior in the back. :lunar2020horrifiedrat:
Why do you say empire doesn't have trouble with lvl 1? Because of healer? Their level 1 are weakest of all!
By the way, thanks for showing me comics! Haha! I didn't know anyone made comics for Disciples, it's not very popular. I guess it is popular in Russia. I don't know Russian very well, but I know a little, just because of so many Russians in games that I like. Heroes of might and magic, disciples, dota...
Last edited by ︵djolaf; Aug 7, 2020 @ 10:45am
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