Is Cloud or Zack stronger?

[Erudite Scholar]

Advent Children Cloud cured of Geostigma vs. Zack from Crisis Core?

[Tr0w]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Sentinel:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

FF titles have always taken from previous entries.

For example: You won't find Kefka in any other mainline game.....Except 14. The reuse of names etc. doesn't count (Biggs, Wedge, etc.)

Kefka isn't in 14, a virtual simulation of Kefka inside Omegas virtual world is. He doesn't have any agency within the story and exists only as a fanservice boss fight, same thing with Exdeath.

[Grizzled Grizzly]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Sentinel:

For example: You won't find Kefka in any other mainline game.....Except 14. The reuse of names etc. doesn't count (Biggs, Wedge, etc.)

Kefka isn't in 14, a virtual simulation of Kefka inside Omegas virtual world is. He doesn't have any agency within the story and exists only as a fanservice boss fight.

Nice reach Stretch Armstrong.

[Tr0w]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Sentinel:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

Kefka isn't in 14, a virtual simulation of Kefka inside Omegas virtual world is. He doesn't have any agency within the story and exists only as a fanservice boss fight.

Nice reach Stretch Armstrong. :singingsheslime:

It's not even close to reaching, the character is literally a VR sim and has no agency, agenda or impact on the FF14 gameworld. And ones from other games like the Primals or Omega are completely rewritten to fit FF14s world and plot.

Also nothing you've brought up has a anything to with FF14s main plot or it's OST.

[Nintendo Gamer]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

In other words Kefka is a Joker ripoff, i did it for teh lulz is not great character writing. And they don't have to be vile to be great villain characters.
If you want to know about the villains in 14, play it, i'm not posting reams of spoilers. All i'll say is one world is wiped out, another two almost wiped out. And that 14 has multiple villains all with their own agendas that at times clash with each as well as the heroes. The writing is deeper and much more interesting.

I mean Irenicus in BG II and Kreia in KoTOR II are better villains than Kefka without having done those things.

*Edit* Just listened to the 6 OST, and while it;s better than the OSTs for I, II, III, and IV, you'd have to be high to think that it's remotely close to being as good as the VII, VIII, IX, X, XII, XIII, XIV, XV, or VIIR OSTs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl43jXjn2Ys&ab_channel=hungrychad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xOOFCltZuc&ab_channel=FINALFANTASYXIV
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsxIXhYCi5Y&ab_channel=dudewhereismyspoon

Yes they do, a villain is judged by his actions & atrocities, that's the only way to gauge if they're a credible threat. Kefka is pure chaos which is far more threatening than someone with a false pilgrimage like Sephiroth. The fact that he's a mere man (albeit magically empowered) makes it all the more impressive what he's been able to do. He's not in it for glory, he doesn't care about sending a message or writing an "unjust wrong" his ancestors suffered or any of that over blown crap, he's pure, unpredictable villainy at it's greatest...& he represents the worst humanity has to offer.

If you're going to "rip something off" as you so crudely put it then you'd might as well rip off from the best...so yeah, thanks for the Joker COMPLIMENT for Kefka. XD

[Grizzled Grizzly]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

In other words Kefka is a Joker ripoff, i did it for teh lulz is not great character writing. And they don't have to be vile to be great villain characters.
If you want to know about the villains in 14, play it, i'm not posting reams of spoilers. All i'll say is one world is wiped out, another two almost wiped out. And that 14 has multiple villains all with their own agendas that at times clash with each as well as the heroes. The writing is deeper and much more interesting.

I mean Irenicus in BG II and Kreia in KoTOR II are better villains than Kefka without having done those things.

*Edit* Just listened to the 6 OST, and while it;s better than the OSTs for I, II, III, and IV, you'd have to be high to think that it's remotely close to being as good as the VII, VIII, IX, X, XII, XIII, XIV, XV, or VIIR OSTs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl43jXjn2Ys&ab_channel=hungrychad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xOOFCltZuc&ab_channel=FINALFANTASYXIV
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsxIXhYCi5Y&ab_channel=dudewhereismyspoon

Yes the do, a villain is judged by his actions & accomplishments, that's the only way to gauge if they're a credible threat. Kefka is pure chaos which is far more threatening than someone with a false pilgrimage like Sephiroth. The fact that he's a mere man (albeit magically empowered) makes it all the more impressive what he's been able to do. He's not in it for glory, he doesn't care about sending a message or writing an "unjust wrong" his ancestors suffered or any of that over blown crap, he's pure, unpredictable villainy at it's greatest...& he represents the worst humanity has to offer.

If you're going to "rip something off" as you so crudely put it then you'd might as well rip off from the best...so yeah, thanks for the Joker COMPLIMENT for Kefka. XD

One thing about Kefka....He's not a monster, he's just ahead of the curve.

[Nintendo Gamer]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Sentinel:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

In other words Kefka is a Joker ripoff, i did it for teh lulz is not great character writing. And they don't have to be vile to be great villain characters.
If you want to know about the villains in 14, play it, i'm not posting reams of spoilers. All i'll say is one world is wiped out, another two almost wiped out. And that 14 has multiple villains all with their own agendas that at times clash with each as well as the heroes. The writing is deeper and much more interesting.

I mean Irenicus in BG II and Kreia in KoTOR II are better villains than Kefka without having done those things.

*Edit* Just listened to the 6 OST, and while it;s better than the OSTs for I, II, III, and IV, you'd have to be high to think that it's remotely close to being as good as the VII, VIII, IX, X, XII, XIII, XIV, XV, or VIIR OSTs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl43jXjn2Ys&ab_channel=hungrychad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xOOFCltZuc&ab_channel=FINALFANTASYXIV
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsxIXhYCi5Y&ab_channel=dudewhereismyspoon

And 14 mostly takes from the other games.....

Indeed, there's a real lack of originality in FF14. You could even say the "political intrigue" parts are ripped straight from FF9 & FF12.

[Tr0w]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

In other words Kefka is a Joker ripoff, i did it for teh lulz is not great character writing. And they don't have to be vile to be great villain characters.
If you want to know about the villains in 14, play it, i'm not posting reams of spoilers. All i'll say is one world is wiped out, another two almost wiped out. And that 14 has multiple villains all with their own agendas that at times clash with each as well as the heroes. The writing is deeper and much more interesting.

I mean Irenicus in BG II and Kreia in KoTOR II are better villains than Kefka without having done those things.

*Edit* Just listened to the 6 OST, and while it;s better than the OSTs for I, II, III, and IV, you'd have to be high to think that it's remotely close to being as good as the VII, VIII, IX, X, XII, XIII, XIV, XV, or VIIR OSTs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl43jXjn2Ys&ab_channel=hungrychad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xOOFCltZuc&ab_channel=FINALFANTASYXIV
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsxIXhYCi5Y&ab_channel=dudewhereismyspoon

Yes they do, a villain is judged by his actions & atrocities, that's the only way to gauge if they're a credible threat. Kefka is pure chaos which is far more threatening than someone with a false pilgrimage like Sephiroth. The fact that he's a mere man (albeit magically empowered) makes it all the more impressive what he's been able to do. He's not in it for glory, he doesn't care about sending a message or writing an "unjust wrong" his ancestors suffered or any of that over blown crap, he's pure, unpredictable villainy at it's greatest...& he represents the worst humanity has to offer.

If you're going to "rip something off" as you so crudely put it then you'd might as well rip off from the best...so yeah, thanks for the Joker COMPLIMENT for Kefka. XD

>I did it for teh lulz = best character writing
Toppest of keks my dude
>Sephiroth
Nobody mentioned him
>It's all about accomplishments
Then Kefka is below Hydaelyn, Zodiark, and the Ascians, difference is they actually have reasons that make sense for what they're doing. And again no it isn't about their accomplishments, i could go into UE and make a featureless wireframe figure and then write all this stuff he'd done and by your logic that would now be the greatest villain of all time. How the villain is portrayed , written, acted, is more important. You can put in text how bad Kefka is but it doesn't come close to the performances given for Niddhog, Thordan, Selch, etc.

[Tr0w]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Sentinel:

And 14 mostly takes from the other games.....

Indeed, there's a real lack of originality in FF14. You could even say the "political intrigue" parts are ripped straight from FF9 & FF12.

>political intrigue
Something almost everything that features different nations has.
Anyway FF12 influence is not something that should be surprising as the dev at Square Yoshi is most a fan of is Matsuno, the guy behind Vagrant Story and FF12.
>Lack of originality
LMFAO compared to what in 6?

[Nintendo Gamer]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

Yes they do, a villain is judged by his actions & atrocities, that's the only way to gauge if they're a credible threat. Kefka is pure chaos which is far more threatening than someone with a false pilgrimage like Sephiroth. The fact that he's a mere man (albeit magically empowered) makes it all the more impressive what he's been able to do. He's not in it for glory, he doesn't care about sending a message or writing an "unjust wrong" his ancestors suffered or any of that over blown crap, he's pure, unpredictable villainy at it's greatest...& he represents the worst humanity has to offer.

If you're going to "rip something off" as you so crudely put it then you'd might as well rip off from the best...so yeah, thanks for the Joker COMPLIMENT for Kefka. XD

>I did it for teh lulz = best character writing
Toppest of keks my dude
>Sephiroth
Nobody mentioned him
>It's all about accomplishments
Then Kefka is below Hydaelyn, Zodiark, and the Ascians, difference is they actually have reasons that make sense for what they're doing. And again no it isn't about their accomplishments, i could go into UE and make a featureless wireframe figure and then write all this stuff he'd done and by your logic that would now be the greatest villain of all time. How the villain is portrayed , written, acted, is more important. You can put in text how bad Kefka is but it doesn't come close to the performances given for Niddhog, Thordan, Selch, etc.

No, only weak minded fools need reasoning behind their actions (mods calm the hell down, I'm referring to villain comparisons & NOT Tr0w so chill out & go away!!), I use Sephiroth as an example because EEEEEEVERYONE has a pathetic boner for that loser. I'll admit I don't know enough about FF14 (& sure as hell don't care enough about MMOs to want to) but I doubt ANY of the FF14 villains have the kind of Resume Kefka has. Please....SHOW ME how ANY of them could possibly top this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oywecZc0kY

And no, you can't use lame reasoning like "the SNES hardware is weaker than pc so it's not as impressive" or any crap like that. You have to be able to understand the differences & NOT try to compare number of NPCs on screen or level of detail. Don't even TRY to be that shallow. IF FF6 was PROPERLY remade before Square WASTED TIME on 7 then it would look vastly different but STILL have the same level of impact on the viewer....what have YOUR villains done that can top the level of destruction & mayhem in this video hmmmm?

[Tr0w]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Tr0w:

>I did it for teh lulz = best character writing
Toppest of keks my dude
>Sephiroth
Nobody mentioned him
>It's all about accomplishments
Then Kefka is below Hydaelyn, Zodiark, and the Ascians, difference is they actually have reasons that make sense for what they're doing. And again no it isn't about their accomplishments, i could go into UE and make a featureless wireframe figure and then write all this stuff he'd done and by your logic that would now be the greatest villain of all time. How the villain is portrayed , written, acted, is more important. You can put in text how bad Kefka is but it doesn't come close to the performances given for Niddhog, Thordan, Selch, etc.

No, only weak minded fools need reasoning behind their actions (mods calm the hell down, I'm referring to villain comparisons & NOT Tr0w so chill out & go away!!), I use Sephiroth as an example because EEEEEEVERYONE has a pathetic boner for that loser. I'll admit I don't know enough about FF14 (& sure as hell don't care enough about MMOs to want to) but I doubt ANY of the FF14 villains have the kind of Resume Kefka has. Please....SHOW ME how ANY of them could possibly top this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oywecZc0kY

And no, you can't use lame reasoning like "the SNES hardware is weaker than pc so it's not as impressive" or any crap like that. You have to be able to understand the differences & NOT try to compare number of NPCs on screen or level of detail. Don't even TRY to be that shallow. IF FF6 was PROPERLY remade before Square WASTED TIME on 7 then it would look vastly different but STILL have the same level of impact on the viewer....what have YOUR villains done that can top the level of destruction & mayhem in this video hmmmm?

I already told you, they destroyed one world which is now a void filled with nothing but darkness and demons, released Bahamut which destroyed a massive chunk of the protagonists world which you saw in one of the trailers i linked, and overloaded another world with light to the point everything was wiped out apart from a couple of villages and one city.

Anyway you should just play through the story and see for yourself.

[Dwolfin]

Cloud.

[Nintendo Gamer]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Typharius:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

I still say Terra from FF6 will kick everyone's ass. Also Kefka>Sephiroth & any FF villain any day. I'm back Mr. MOOOOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FFVI was my first FF and imo the best to date.

Oh absolutely its the best. My first FF game was the original entry on NES. THAT is by far the most difficult one due to just trying to stay alive long enough to level up & to save up enough GP to afford equipment & magic upgrades. It took a ridiculously long time to level up & buy certain things back then. Unfortunately it came out when gaming was considered niche so more people have played FF7 than 6 which is why more people don't understand it's the best in the franchise thus far. Kefka's got a much higher body count & did far more damage than Sephiroth or any other FF villain did honestly. I feel FF6 & FF8 have the best over all soundtrack but music is subjective so no point trying to compare things there heh. I will say that it's a proven fact that FF6 has the fastest & most intense music out of the series with Theatrythm Final Fantasy PROVING this fact with songs like Decisive Battle & the normal battle theme having the highest BPM (Beats Per Minute) out of ANY other FF song up to FF15.

[Nintendo Gamer]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Typharius:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

Oh absolutely its the best. My first FF game was the original entry on NES. THAT is by far the most difficult one due to just trying to stay alive long enough to level up & to save up enough GP to afford equipment & magic upgrades. It took a ridiculously long time to level up & buy certain things back then. Unfortunately it came out when gaming was considered niche so more people have played FF7 than 6 which is why more people don't understand it's the best in the franchise thus far. Kefka's got a much higher body count & did far more damage than Sephiroth or any other FF villain did honestly. I feel FF6 & FF8 have the best over all soundtrack but music is subjective so no point trying to compare things there heh. I will say that it's a proven fact that FF6 has the fastest & most intense music out of the series with Theatrythm Final Fantasy PROVING this fact with songs like Decisive Battle & the normal battle theme having the highest BPM (Beats Per Minute) out of ANY other FF song up to FF15.

Yeah the "event" that occurs halfway through is unprecedented and unequalled in the series. A real jaw dropper especially back then. Kefka is an absolute stand out villain of the ages.

I'd say VI has the best overall OST, Terra's theme is the best character theme in the series for sure but the whole thing is strong. I'd put VII second, IV third. IV & IX are equal for best world map theme imo.

I will admit I do like Jenova's battle theme from 7. The standard battle music & the world map music are pretty grating in my opinion. One Winged Angel is alright but I feel a more epic threat from Kefka's Dancing Mad than a song about a gimped bird person that can only fly around in circles. Here's a hint....physics would never let ol Seph fly in a straight line with only one wing. He'd be spinning out like an out of control biplane.

[Nintendo Gamer]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Typharius:

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย Nintendo Gamer:

I will admit I do like Jenova's battle theme from 7. The standard battle music & the world map music are pretty grating in my opinion. One Winged Angel is alright but I feel a more epic threat from Kefka's Dancing Mad than a song about a gimped bird person that can only fly around in circles. Here's a hint....physics would never let ol Seph fly in a straight line with only one wing. He'd be spinning out like an out of control biplane.

Yeah VII's world map music was a bit depressing, especially post meteor.

"BOUNCY BOUNCY KRANKENHAUS" is how I remember one winged angel lol.

Yes, he literally would just be spinning like a record on a turntable lmao.

Honourable mentions: VIII - Balamb Garden theme, Fisherman's Horizon.

X - Actually had an excellent OST as well. As did XII despite no Uematsu.

Agreed, I'm still trying to save up for a good flight stick so I can play ED more smoothly without getting lost with all the keyboard commands.