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Discussions Rules and Guidelines
5 
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1. There is a lot of battle strategy. But like any auto-battler, the strategy is in making your army, not commanding them. You position your units by deciding which units you add to your army. Higher hp/armor units are placed towards the front and the middle, so by adding them you can for example push other units to the flanks.
2. Yes. This means you either want to make an army where everything is Fast, or use Fast units like Knights that are ok with being a bit separated form the rest of your units. Depending on who you are facing and how your army is set up, Fast can either be an advantage or a disadvantage. Against small indy opponents for example, a line of Battlefast Knights is going to perform very well as they will reach and defeat the enemy faster. Another way to deal with it would be adding higher hp units that are not fast, and thus preventing the fast units from rushing ahead.
3. Starvation is still in the game. It's necessary to prevent battles from never ending if both sides are unable to defeat each other. For example two Fire Elementals are unable to hurt each other. Starvation damage is unblockable and that usually means the highest hp unit will "win" the battle. No unit will just get deleted.
4. That was improved a bit, but still can happen. Pathfinding is a complex thing to get right, and the addition of neutral elements on the battlefield did not help. But it shouldn't really be too big of an issue normally.
5. Poison Aura units now do indeed get placed away from non immune allies. But this usually only lasts until the start of the battle and units will just move into the poison cloud to reach the enemy. It's on the Player to separate units into different armies if they would do too much AoE. Especially as a Witch, the only class with access to Hydras that I remember, you want to make one Poison Immune and one Non-Poison Immune army.
6. I don't really know what you are talking about? Unless your leader has a disease, there is no real way for them to die and vanish. Or did you move on a damaging tile? Magma and Thunderclouds damage non fire or electricity immune units on them. Units can also drown, but you get a message for that.
7. F1 gives you a unit list, separated after commanders and locations. Clicking on the Resource symbols gives you a breakdown of all the income tiles you have for that resource. Which means the Gold income is a good "settlement list".
8. Most categories are pretty self explanatory. "Human or Hoburg" for example excludes Dwarfs, Bakemono and Monkey units. Same is true for Animal. There are some exceptions, which is just an experience thing to learn. If you really want to know, download the mod data, where you can check which unit has what tags.
9. You can definitely close the recruitment screen without getting refocused on your starting citadel.
10. Clicking on "Date" will sort the save game list according to dates.
11. That might indeed have improved in 5. Most spells and attacks tell you what their special effect is. There is also a Guide on the Steam page that lists almost all Spells and their exact effect. Here is the link: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=699814638
12. No, but you can enable start of turn auto-save by adding: --autosave to the Steam Launch Options. Or you can make a batch file to start the exe directly with that command line parameter.
13. Nope, but it's very easy to add them via Steam Launch Options. Just right click the game, click "Properties" and you should see it in the "General" tab.
14. Yeah, that's still not in the game. I also don't think it will every be in the game as I think the Developers kind of see CoE as a rogue like and purposefully not added a load button. You can just resign to get back to the main menu, but honestly, just Alt+F4 and a restart is faster. It's not as if CoE takes long to start up at least.
15. Yep. Though the scenario that a ring gets lost should be incredible rare. I have played the game for over 1k hours and never had that happen. Most units have a misc slot and unless your get basically army wiped with only 1 or 2 units surviving with both groups having multiple magical items, you should be fine. Always check potential magical item locations with more than just one commander to be save.
16. Yes, this is not possible in CoE 5. Pressing "i" will visually deselect all units without a magical item.
17. Um, swapping window? I don't remember that. In 5 you can just click on the magical item, then on the unit you want to give that item too. You do the item swapping in the normal troop selection view.
18. Highlighting isn't possible, but you can double click to select all units of the same type. Then you can just "Shift + Click" to deselect half of them. Or you could just "Shift + Click" half your army. "Shift + Click" works by selecting all units between your next two clicks, so you can select one row or all your archers or similar ranges.
19. See 18. "Shift + Click" kind of works that way. You don't really draw a circle, but you can set two points and all units in a rectangle between those points will be selected.
Hope that helps. :)
CoE is a 3X tactical autobattler. It's not a 4X, nor an RPG.
That's its formula for success, over decades. Devs are fine with it, and so are we.
No change in CoE5. Probably no change in the CoE* series, ever.
CoE* is a tactical auto-battler. That's its niche. Devs intend it that way.
Yes. Also, units with Trample, for similar reasons.
Also Pillars of Eternity Monks with Long Stride for +2 Move Speed
Yes.
Yes, it's a designed mechanism, for exactly that reason.
No, it doesn't simply delete your units. It damages all units, on both sides, equally.
Hence the side with the 1 unit with the most HP (or Regeneration) wins.
If you bring all hoomans with 12 HP each, and the other side has 1 guy with 90 HP,
he wins, and you don't.
#4 still happens, randomly. Sometimes units get stuck.
#5 is pilot error. Learn once, shame on game. Learn twice, shame on you.
Veterans know to leave Hydra Bowl behind, for that reason. No shame on veteran
Now you get a start-of-turn message like Aloys died of disease, with a <Goto> button.
Most of this is already available.
- F1 (on map) shows a list of all sites-with-units, even with 0 commanders.
- Right-click (to recruit) shows all of your citadels.
- In top-left bar, left-click your Gold, Iron, or Trade to show summary lists.
It's not perfect, but it suffices for most purposes.Same as before.
I mildly agree that CoE* isn't fully self-documenting. But no other game is, either.
I mildly agree. This is a real QoL lack.
But I already solve it myself, offline, using regular File Explorer.
I already do the same for many other Steam games. File is file, I manage files.
- Find where this game stores its save files.
- Many Steam games save to your AppData.
- The Local/ subset includes DinsLegacy, kenshi, StarTradersFrontiers, etc.
- The LocalLow/ subset includes Fatbot, IronOak, MuHa, Obsidian, etc.
- The Roaming/ subset includes coe5 (aha!), Microsoft, etc.
- Some Steam games save directly to their Steam install folder.
- For each game, I make my own folder tree.
- I give my folders sensible names.
- Every Mid Summer, I save a checkpoint file as "Woedi_Y11-07".
- Drag-and-move all of these to my own folder tree, delete from saves/.
- Then my "Eric's CoE5/" folder tree might have 800 folders x 40 files each.
- But my Roaming/coe5/saves/ folder has only about 8 files.
- Then within CoE5, I have 1-page Load screen, and no clutter.
I already do this for 50+ other games on Steam. It's a chore, but order is beautiful.That means C:Users/$user/AppData/{Local, or LocalLow, or Roaming}/.
That means D:SteamLibrary/steamapps/common/$Game/.../$save/.
For example, "Thea 2 The Shattering"/Thea2_Data/Profiles/$n/save/.
If I start an Enchanter Enormous 7 Marquis on 2025/03/02 named Woedi,
I make 1 folder like "250302 Woedi".
After 20 years, I have 18-22 of these files, each with a different year.
I move-or-delete all of the junk out of it myself. (It's like vacuuming a rug.)
Also, knowing how to do this enables you to (for example) submit a bug report.
File is file, game state is file, email is file, file is email. Knowing file solves bug reporting.
(Corollary: Hence every How to Submit a Bug thread is file path and file.)
No change.
No change.
This is fixed. In Transfer window, 'i' toggles highlight of all units with magic items only.
Also, '?' shows all keybindings for the current window.
Transfer screen has hotkeys for all Horror-marked units, all landlubber units, and more.
No change.
I even mildly agree with all of these.
But I don't want devs to waste lifespan on a graphical lasso. Their time is precious.
Ok so its still the same no changes. I played the game a lot. I just dont like everything is automatic. Letting me make my own army positions would be a great improvement. Then the battle would still be automatic but then If some influence besides army composition.
And the army composition I cannot make many changes in most cases just because you only have 1 army for a while and then you may have second small one and for large battles I have to add all my units again. And lots of my units in many factions are just random because summoning is random.
Yeah but usually I dont have so many fast units to make a own army. I just let them die or park them somewhere. And I dont like the micromanagement of constantly moving some units from one army to another.
Ok thanks I dont like the mechanics. I had battles where my invulnerable wizard just stood there for 60 rounds even if he had a magic weapon. And in round 61 he went to the mushrooms to kill them and it took longer then 13 rounds and then them game decides to reduce hp and a wizard has less than a mushroom so my wizard dies.
If you have a wizard with an invulnerability item and a summon item then he just stand behind his own 1 tile big summon and does nothing and cant find his way around it. Also especially in siege battles this is an issue in CoE4 because my units dont find its way to the entrance if there is unit in the way even if there is space. They all just stand there. This happens mostly with big 5x5 units.
Yeah in normal battles this happens but not in sieges. In sieges in CoE4 it places the units directly inside the aura. Does this happen in CoE5?
You leader can die in battle. And in CoE4 it dont get a message about it. The unit is then just gone. Also other leader units if they die you wont get a message.
I dont get this. Why can the game not just tell me after the battle which of my leader units died?
Thanks a lot! I didnt know this. Its ok for units but the resource breakdown should also highlight where the dwellings are.
Yeah but then you just assume whats what. I had several instances where i thought this unit is an animal but its not like the monster fish.
So this is still the same.
Ok got it. I found out how to do it. Thanks a lot.
Wonderful there is no such thing in CoE4.
Ok great because I never knew what the special effects are and therefore cannot tell which of the spells are really good.
But this an autosave and not a quicksave. Sometimes I have to do stuff quickly and I just want to make a quick save and wait for the next turn.
I find this really bad. Why is there no ingame menu for it? I have several start options in my command line and I switch them a lot.
Well I load the wrong game sometimes and find it very annoying I have to kill the game just after I started it. So it annoys me right after I started the game and its a major thing why I dont play very often.
This happens to me very often because I have little army stacks to cover the area and sometimes I dont even see the enemy has magic items because the icons are so tiny. I always have to put on glasses because otherwise I cant play the game.
You mean in the unit transfer window? Ok thats an improvement because this isnt in 4.
Well if you select transfer units you the unit transfer window. And there you swap items. And if you select an item to swap there are no unit descriptions anymore. Then you just can cancel or give it to another unit. And if you have many units which are the same its there is no way to find out which one I wanted to give it. So I have to select the unit beforehand and then remember its position in the window.
Ok so its still the same. Thanks.
This doesnt work for me very well. If often select then the units didnt want to select for some reason. Maybe I do something wrong but this is just not very good imho.
Thanks a lot :-)
So onto the next answer.
Yeah but this is mostly not about the autobattle. I just want to position my army first and the autobattle should have some resemblence of a real battle not just 2 barbarian hordes storming at each other. In endless its also automatic battles but I can position units. Or at least make a army position setup myself
I dont like these units because they die too quickly.
Yeah I answered before there instance where the game decides for 60 rounds to do nothing and then my units start moving and cant kill the opponents quickly enough. This must be a bug.
I disagree here. If units just stand there doing nothing you cannot predict it and since you have no influence during a battle its always the games fault. :-)
In 4 you wont get any message if one of your commanding units dies. Nothing at all. They are just gone and sometime I dont even realize it until later when I ask myself where one mages is.
I didnt know this. Its just like you say. Not perfect but good enough.
Its just for the spell mostly. I wanna make an informed decision which spells my mages are using.
Well I only make about 10 save files for a game and overwrite them so I often get confused which one is the latest if there is no date in the loading window like CoE4. Most games store saves in my games and I dont like it being in roaming. But this is not my issue. I can live with it.
Okay thanks
This bugs me a lot. You have no idea the amount of magic items I lost because units have no bags for simple ring or staff or would just throw away magic swords. :-)))
Great!
The graphics dont bug me. I just want some highlighting of things. Like pressing a button and then the items have a lighter background.
Thanks to you for taking your time and answer my long post.
Fair. Not everyone likes every mechanic of a game. But CoE is all about that hands off approach and I don't see it ever change from what I have seen from the developers.
As for the rest and the double point 2 about friendly fire, again, this is where all the strategy from CoE comes from.
You decide which units to get and in what army to put them. Yes, there are rituals that summon creatures with a lot of AoE that will kill your own units as well. But often you also have other type of rituals with more non AoE units. You can disable all the AoE spells for caster. You can decide that not adding units to an army is better, even if that means leaving the unit behind. Or adding in a unit that will kill a portion of your own units.
Same with Fast units. You actually don't need many fast units to make a good army. A small Fast army can often just run away from enemies while raiding their income tiles.
I had battles were not bringing more units actually made me take less causalities. Again, this is where all the strategy comes from.
Also, if you really don't like that and don't want to deal with it, there are a lot of classes that don't have much or any friendly AoE fire happening. Or where you either have all Fast/Flying units or few/none.
There are a few classes that I don't really like playing, but there are so many with such diverse play styles that I am still having a lot of fun. Enchanter for example isn't really fun to me. Far too much management. But I can just play all the other classes I like instead.
The issue with your Wizard is a very very specific scenario that should probably not happen all that often. I understand how you don't like the Starvation mechanic and how the pathfinding can be a bit wonky, but in my 1k+ hours of CoE I have run into the Starvation mechanic probably less than 3 times. It's really not something you should encounter regularly.
I agree that the Pathfinding can be a bit wonky, but that is true for almost every game. For siege battles I usually only bring a single line of melee units, unless they can get over the walls. Otherwise I prefer to get more ranged units and casters as well as fliers and wall climbers. Unless you can quickly get through the gates and overwhelm the defenders that way, allowing your ranged units to shoot from a closer distance is usually more effective in my opinion. Again, what unit to bring to a fight is where the strategy from CoE comes from. There are usually very few "one size fits all" armies.
I am unsure. I have never played much with the Witch class, so I have not that much experience with Poison Clouds. It looks to me as if some of the positions for siege are set to always have units. Which kind of makes sense. You don't want the enemies to break the Gate in 2 turns and then only have one unit with the Poison Cloud get surrounded and killed. But some units still do seem to be kept back. Maybe it's a hp threshhold thing? Not sure.
But like I said, I haven't really played much Witch, and thus haven't dealt with friendly Poison Clouds much. There is the Hydra Bowl, but you can just give that to a wounded unit and leave it behind. If you don't ever want to see it again, park the wounded unit on Ice.
Ah, I think you aren't playing with Battlereports enabled? I do that and it will list all the units killed, including leaders. You also have a nice <goto> button that will show you were the stranded units are.
But yeah, without Battlereports enabled you do have to pay attention how the battle plays out the first time.
I kind of agree with you in all these points, but I doubt it will be changed. Honestly, I am somewhat surprised we got a save system at all.
We do have a different playstyle then. I usually don't have too many small armies. At least not small enough to run out of misc slots for items.
I can understand the visual issue. Sadly you can't seem to scale up the unit size. There is only an option to increase the text size. Though the 'i' to show all magical items also works for enemy armies.
Ah yeah, that is still the same.
Yeah, I think it's the same, though I think there are some new commands for unit selection.
As for the "Shift + Click" you click on two units and that defines a rectangle with all the units between getting selected. Or unselected. It takes any previous selection clicks into acount before you press "Shift" as well. So if you already clicked to select a unit, it might do something wonky.
Your again very welcome, and I hope I could help.
They made a pretty big change from CoE3 to CoE4 and there are still guys who prefer 3 because of the totally different battles.
In CoE3 fast was a superb skill because there was no movement in battles. Both sides stood there and attacked each other. The fast units got the first attacks. So fast was a really good and helpful skill. With the changed combat they probably didnt realize they make the fast units just bad imho.
And yeah I get its all about army composition.
But holding a battle line is the most crucial tactic in any melee battle. So for me fast should not move them faster but instead they should just move like every other unit but on battle line impact they should have the first attacks. Flanking is the other crucial battle tactic used for thousands of years. For me this is just missing. They could easily add flank positions to the already existing ranking. Well I can always wish for it. ^^
Also I would rather let units die instead of selecting units for every battle. I make small armies to cover area but I never change the composition of them and may just let them join into a already setup battle. But thats it.
The same reason is why I dont play factions which randomly spawn troops on random tiles. Its too much hassle for me to move a unit around and collect them for the rest of the game. Once its okay but not more often. So Voice of El is out of the question for me and I never do rituals which spawn random units over time like the druid has.
Aoe spells are okay for me and I dont have a problem with collateral fire. I just find it silly bows and bolts dont do collateral damage while every other damage does.
Casters do well mostly when I play. And I very rarely lose one thats why I dont see it if one dies. And I have casters running around alone without support just for enslavement, charm and so on. This is what gives me the most fun converting all the monsters to my cause.
You are absolutely right here. It were very specific scenarios where I had casters with the invulnerability item against mushrooms.
I also had occasions where that mage just killed himself with his own magic fire item repeatedly. And yes I could reproduce this consistantly.
Its some kind of bug I guess.
Maybe the pathfinding isnt a problem. Maybe its intended the units just standing behind another unit even if there is space. It may have to do with the battle line ranking units have.
Its not just witch. You can enslave units with poison aura just randomly. And they work fine and units give them space but not in siege. In siege my mages just stand besides it and die as soon as the battle starts. For some reason the battle line ranking is wrong in sieges for aura units. The mages were not supposed to stand there because they should have been further behind. Also I could reproduce it. I guess this is a bug, too.
And I never encountered the hydra bowl. I usually just get pestered with hades and the stupid cubes on craters.
Yes you are right. I dont have battle reports. I'll try it out.
Cmon without a save I never had bought it. Often I dont have the time for full playthrough so I can only play an hour or maybe two.
Even if you are in school, at university or without an occupation you could have a power loss, PC crashing, my child is crying, my boss calls, my wife is annoying, someone is visiting and so on. I would never risk throwing away my valuable life time for a game without saving.
Well many small armies can quadrouple your income quickly and your loss is negigible if it runs into monsters or opponents.
It makes the game much easier. Also you dont need to move your main stack onto everything. My main stack is always accompanied by at least 3 or 4 tiny armies. And they can join into a fight if necessary. You can cover ten times the area with it in the same time.
Thanks for letting me know.
Yeah I tried this out but I found it not reliable because it wont show if I already clicked on a unit
Yes it was helpful talking to you. I will watch some more footage on youtube. Unfortunately there not many streams on twitch.
Fast and Battlefast isn't a completely negative trait. It allows melee units like Knights to close faster with the enemy. Especially versus small indies this means getting hit less often with ranged attacks. It also gives the enemy less time to buff their units before the units engage.
Neither Poison Cloud nor enslave and charm are that common. Confusion is a bit more common, but even more unreliable than charm and enslave. There are only Hydras and 4 other units with it. One of them being a water only creature and one a stationary guardian.
So if you don't fight a witch, the chances of encountering a poison cloud unit and then having a charm/confuse/enslave spell hit it, then the unit surviving the battle does seem pretty low to me. I can't remember the last time I got a Poison Cloud unit from a battle.
Hydra Bowl is an item that gives the wearer Poison Cloud. That I got from battles multiple times.
Mainly an issue with a select few factions.
Animals and by extension druid/dryad early game kind of need this or else they just die to archers/brigands before they get a turn in melee.
Baron you like your fast moving knights because they can expand as their own army with lance charge taking small fights.
Cloud lord, again you like this but you need to make a melee only army to really abuse it, 1 row of ice clads during winter can take most ports, towns, and even cities.
Kobold king, similar to cloud lord with the melee dragon spawn but up until that point your white and green drakes are??? green drakes can handle it because they are effectively a knight 2.0 but white drakes require you to mass them to not lose them.
Pale ones, literally their own version of this issue, siege tunneling, its very frustrating to have your expensive cavern guard OR EVEN YOUR COMMANDERS??? immediately burrowing at the start of combat only to pop out infront of the enemy walls and get focus fired by archers. 0/10 hate this mechanic it costs me so much gold and iron every game and avoiding this diceroll isn't always viable.
Agree with most points.
Just one exception: Wyvern Knights, the green drakes, are not really Knight material. They only have 1 Armor and no Shield, so despite their 35 hp they quickly die to mass arrows and even mass melee.
To me it feels as if the Storm Drakes actually fare a lot better as they tend to delete whole chunks of enemies with their bouncing LIghtning Breath. You can also support them with Winged White Kobold Archers somewhat.
As for Pale Ones, you have fire elementals and undead that are a far better frontline during sieges as they can just ignore most walls. But yeah, Siege Tunneling is definitely not that great of a trait. Dwarf Sappers are bad at sieges because of that as well.