VEHICLE POST #500

[FasterRiver]

Why would an interplanetary, science fiction military force insist on traversing a desert planet infested with giant sand worms on foot? The lack of vehicles from this game makes no logical sense, let alone game play sense.

EDIT: People who've read the books are weighing in here, saying that the book explains why vehicles can't be used. HOWEVER, isn't there a vast variety of powerful flying vehicles which are also mentioned in the lore? the combat drones are cool and all, but what about some endgame gunships? I find fuel to be a somewhat underused resource. Accounting for the fuel bonus from special areas, I think it could be a dynamic design choice to demand players fight harder over special areas lategame in order to access powerful late game gunships. Support ships such as those that give units bonuses within radius, ships that can transport units quickly (allowing players to demolish airstrips late game), resource stealing ships which can enter an enemy village's radius and quickly loot its resources, etc.

I find that these matches go on for long periods of time. I've sat down with a match and ended up playing for well over 3 hours. Despite this, I acquire the end game units maybe an hour into the match, meaning I'm stuck with those same unit types for a longer period of time than it took me to acquire them. Since these matches go on for so long and successful players often attain resource surpluses which are restricted by manpower limitations, a late game S tier unit to strive for will surely pay off. There are so many asymetric possibilities.

Harkonnen: Massive battle cruisers which wreak havoc with aoe
Artreides: Long ranged glass cannons that obliterate single targets and give nearby units passive bonus
Smugglers: Fast firing, fast moving gunship which can loot enemy villages
Fremen: Gains control of one Sandworm and are able to employ it as an ambushing beast of terror

Bene Gesserit: Mind controlling vessels which can initiate revolts

IDK... im way out of line with this one.

[jbaker1]

Medieval warfare was the norm. The author went to a lot of pains to outline this. I won't bother asking you what a 'War of Assassins' is either, you'd need to read the original material.....

[videomike_Ultimate_Plushie]

I was gonna say: Dune is inhabited by worms that can devour every vehicle instantly, youd have limited ability to use them outside veyr few situations

[glythe]

Let's say we go against the source material. What would happen?

Tanks would be used to guard rock outcrops. But then as a game mechanic that would be so boring.

[Mansen]

Originally posted by Lynch.P!N #26:

Why would an interplanetary, science fiction military force insist on traversing a desert planet infested with giant sand worms on foot?

Because any kind of vibration on the desert sand is like dangling a big old lure to any worm within hundreds of miles. If a single person's movements can attract a worm, how do you think a tank (or a battalion of them at that) would fare?

Outrunning a worm is NOT easy - the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ are fast. There's a reason why the harvesters have carryall planes on standby the second a worm is sighted. They will eat you, they will outrun you.

And in case someone asks the obvious "Why don't you just shield them?" cause the shields don't really help against a worm that can swallow you whole - also the frequencies then shields produce kind of make worms go berserk.

(Why not just shoot them? Cause they're the reason you're there - they produce the spice which you mine on this hell hole of a planet. It'd be like shooting your cattle)

[Angry Obnoxious Goose]

Originally posted by Lynch.P!N #26:

Why would an interplanetary, science fiction military force insist on traversing a desert planet infested with giant sand worms on foot? The lack of vehicles from this game makes no logical sense, let alone game play sense.

Because vehicles makes excessive levels of noise and vibrations and get eaten...w hy do you think carryalls exist?
And there IS vehicles for that... Ornithopters. Or the Airfield Shuttles that can transport your units from one village to another (or to your stronghold).

Also have you ever seen the amount of maintenance it takes to keep a vehicle functional in a Desert? let alone the most hellhole world of Desert Planets like Arrakis?

Also there's the fact that stuff like warmachines such as tanks, APCs, etc. etc. are all more or less outdated concepts for warfare since a Personal Shield will easily deal with the impact, explosion and confussive effect of a tankshell and still keep functioning.
Sure, shields aren't really used outside strongholds on Arrakis cuz 'angery worms go very angery at holtzman effects that shields, foldspace-events, etc. causes when active.'

[Angry Obnoxious Goose]

Originally posted by Mansen:

Originally posted by Lynch.P!N #26:

Why would an interplanetary, science fiction military force insist on traversing a desert planet infested with giant sand worms on foot?

Because any kind of vibration on the desert sand is like dangling a big old lure to any worm within hundreds of miles. If a single person's movements can attract a worm, how do you think a tank (or a battalion of them at that) would fare?

Outrunning a worm is NOT easy - the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ are fast. There's a reason why the harvesters have carryall planes on standby the second a worm is sighted. They will eat you, they will outrun you.

And in case someone asks the obvious "Why don't you just shield them?" cause the shields don't really help against a worm that can swallow you whole - also the frequencies then shields produce kind of make worms go berserk.

(Why not just shoot them? Cause they're the reason you're there - they produce the spice which you mine on this hell hole of a planet. It'd be like shooting your cattle)

actually it's the sandtrout during their maturation periods that produces a sort of fungal-esque substance that more or less ferments until it goes 'BOOM' and a Spice Blow happens, scattering the proto-spice into the open air and essentially transforms into The Spice Melange from the Oxygen Contact.... I think. It's at least not the worms themselves that makes the spice.

[Mansen]

Buddy... sandtrouts are worms, not a different animal. It's part of their life cycle.

[Angry Obnoxious Goose]

Originally posted by Mansen:

Buddy... sandtrouts are worms, not a different animal. It's part of their life cycle.

True, but it's still a misnomer that it's the Sandworms, cuz they are essentially two different organisms until a Sandtrout matures enough.
And I just re-checked and it's excretions from Sandtrouts getting into contact with water that causes the whole event of spice blows.

But sure, same species overall. But it's like saying a catterpiller and butterfly being the same species when such a creature comes into existence through ltieral metamorphosis.

[Bomoo]

Originally posted by Lynch.P!N #26:

Why would an interplanetary, science fiction military force insist on traversing a desert planet infested with giant sand worms on foot? The lack of vehicles from this game makes no logical sense, let alone game play sense.

It makes perfect sense, and you'd know this if you'd read the books. They have vehicles in this setting, but none of them are appropriate for this particular planet. Machinery breaks down very quickly, and even when it doesn't it attracts worms. The way they transport troops around is by air, which is already represented in the game through airports.

The only ground vehicles that get used on Arrakis are the spice harvesters, and even those have a carryall on standby at all times to pick them up at a moment's notice when a worm is spotted. Not if, but when. And that's a civilian vehicle.

There also really isn't any practical reason to deploy heavy military assets like tanks or APCs or whatever. In this fictional setting pretty much all the warfare on Arrakis is, for a variety of reasons, low intensity "bush" warfare.

[Will]

Shouldn't all the infantry be doing the sand walk

[andreacelaj32]

+1

[Ghostlight]

Originally posted by Mansen:

Originally posted by Lynch.P!N #26:

Why would an interplanetary, science fiction military force insist on traversing a desert planet infested with giant sand worms on foot?

Because any kind of vibration on the desert sand is like dangling a big old lure to any worm within hundreds of miles. If a single person's movements can attract a worm, how do you think a tank (or a battalion of them at that) would fare?

Outrunning a worm is NOT easy - the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ are fast. There's a reason why the harvesters have carryall planes on standby the second a worm is sighted. They will eat you, they will outrun you.

This all falls apart when you point out that currently in the game, our foot soldiers are running across long distances of bare sand without incident. Worms only appear if they stand still and fight and even then, not always. Vehicles in the context of how the game currently interprets the worm lore would be absolutely fine.

[ArchAngelOsis]

Originally posted by Mansen:

Originally posted by Lynch.P!N #26:

Why would an interplanetary, science fiction military force insist on traversing a desert planet infested with giant sand worms on foot?

Because any kind of vibration on the desert sand is like dangling a big old lure to any worm within hundreds of miles. If a single person's movements can attract a worm, how do you think a tank (or a battalion of them at that) would fare?

Outrunning a worm is NOT easy - the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ are fast. There's a reason why the harvesters have carryall planes on standby the second a worm is sighted. They will eat you, they will outrun you.

And in case someone asks the obvious "Why don't you just shield them?" cause the shields don't really help against a worm that can swallow you whole - also the frequencies then shields produce kind of make worms go berserk.

(Why not just shoot them? Cause they're the reason you're there - they produce the spice which you mine on this hell hole of a planet. It'd be like shooting your cattle)

the only shielded area was arrakeen as the shield wall prevented worms from going HAM on the city other than that...using a shield on arrakis was basically like laying a mobile thumper circle on yourself

[Flushing]

Each faction should have at least one military vehicle, I agree. Putting aside the source material, it simply looks stupid in this game without them.

[Mach234]

Yep as other posters have mentioned I don't think you could really get away with land vehicles, that being said I think you could get away with highly mobile aerial combat units, would definitely be within the lore and think it would make the strategic game play a lot more dynamic ..