V Rising

V Rising

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DJ Deckard Cain 20 MAY 2023 a las 6:29 a. m.
Why do we never actually get stronger?
Isn't it fun progressing in a game to never actually get stronger? I feel like I'm playing Destiny 2 all over again. You LOOK stronger, but you never actually GET stronger.
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Mostrando 31-45 de 80 comentarios
James 20 MAY 2023 a las 9:41 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:
You shouldn't expect to walk into a new zone and godmode it.

right, not in this game anyway. Because you don't get stronger relative to the game as you progress.
Leiraion 20 MAY 2023 a las 9:42 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por James:
Not sure why you are saying I said anything about not having options. You get plenty of sidegrade options in this game, but your relative power goes down the further into the game you get.
You just keep saying this but not demonstrating it.
As I progressed I found it easier to be more reckless (fight more enemies at once). I never felt like I had to go from "I can handle 3 guys at my gear level" to "I will have to very carefully pull only 1 enemy because I absolutely can't fight 3 people at my gear level now"

If you walk into a new zone and you are lvl 45 and the enemies are all 50+.... yeah you might have to play safer. That's not because you got weaker, that's because they are higher gear level than you.


Publicado originalmente por James:
Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:
You shouldn't expect to walk into a new zone and godmode it.
right, not in this game anyway. Because you don't get stronger relative to the game as you progress.
What RPG do you play where you are level 50 and walk into the next zone at lvl 55+ and just start AOE pulling?
That's not even to say you can't do that... you can, including in this game, you just have to play safer and expect to take more damage when you make a mistake.
Última edición por Leiraion; 20 MAY 2023 a las 9:44 p. m.
James 20 MAY 2023 a las 9:46 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:
Publicado originalmente por James:
Not sure why you are saying I said anything about not having options. You get plenty of sidegrade options in this game, but your relative power goes down the further into the game you get.
You just keep saying this but not demonstrating it.
As I progressed I found it easier to be more reckless (fight more enemies at once). I never felt like I had to go from "I can handle 3 guys at my gear level" to "I will have to very carefully pull only 1 enemy because I absolutely can't fight 3 people at my gear level now"

If you walk into a new zone and you are lvl 45 and the enemies are all 50+.... yeah you might have to play safer. That's not because you got weaker, that's because they are higher gear level than you.

We have different experiences then I guess because I felt unstoppably powerful until I got to the forest bosses and and started being able to die.
Leiraion 20 MAY 2023 a las 9:52 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por James:
We have different experiences then I guess because I felt unstoppably powerful until I got to the forest bosses and and started being able to die.
Did it occur to you that the problem might be your tactics?
The game gives you a lot of options because you are suppose to be dynamic.

For example, Ward of the Damned is amazing against Ungora the Spider Queen... but it is relatively useless against The Duke of Balaton. So don't use that spell against him. Switch to something more useful like Death Knight. Both of them it's useful to use Spear or Crossbow (when you can't get in close)... but for Foulrot the Soultaker you might want to use Scythe so you can capitalize on the moments he's stationary with the E and then knock him back with Qs when needed.

If you just want to brute force the mace all game and not weapon swap yeah I could see that as an issue as well.
Or if you're refusing to swap spells to suit your needs. Blood Fountain and/or Bloodrage can do wonders if you need sustain on fights.
Or try hunting down a 30+% brute so you can have physical life steal and some atk spd.
Última edición por Leiraion; 20 MAY 2023 a las 9:54 p. m.
James 20 MAY 2023 a las 9:56 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:
Publicado originalmente por James:
We have different experiences then I guess because I felt unstoppably powerful until I got to the forest bosses and and started being able to die.
Did it occur to you that the problem might be your tactics?.

I mean, that wouldn't really be my character getting more powerful, that would be me playing better (to make up for the fact my character is getting weaker).

Again, not saying this is a bad way to handle progression, but you are expected to pick up the slack for your ever increasing weakness as a character by learning to outplay the game. In a game with no rpg elements this would just be a standard difficulty curve.
Leiraion 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:07 p. m. 
It is your character getting more powerful though... you have new spells and skills to use and you are opting to not use them. You don't only grow in power when your ilvl goes up. That's true in most RPGs even, getting a new spell can be just as potent as getting a big weapon upgrade in most games.
The only way to fix what you are talking about would be to remove power from alchemy, blood types, spells, etc and put it into raw stats and auto attacking.

If you want to see this linear style of progression you would need to expect the player to refuse to use the tools given to them and instead start removing spells or skills and go to raw stats.

I wonder if you would make this same argument in world of warcraft when you spend talent points in a tree and unlock stronger, say, healing spells.
Do you actually get weaker as a healer in later levels because you have to use more of your skills to keep up with incoming damage?


EDIT: Sorry but I'm a little shocked you have 350+ hrs in Elden Ring with this thought process.
Does your character in Elden Ring get weaker as the game goes on because the bosses get more challenging?
Última edición por Leiraion; 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:12 p. m.
アゼム 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:08 p. m. 
What are you smoking? You LITERALLY get stronger, there's no scaling.
James 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:13 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:
The only way to fix what you are talking about would be to

It isn't something that needs fixing, it is deliberately how the game is designed.

Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:
I wonder if you would make this same argument in world of warcraft

world of warcraft has a pretty traditional MMO style power curve where you stay pretty similarly powered to enemies at your level (with gear drops making large changes to your relative power) as you grind to max level. At which point you reach a low point in power as you switch from a leveling grind to an end-game grind where you get gradually stronger.

The reason this game makes you feel weaker as you progress is that your power is dictated almost entirely by boss progression. Not a lot of rpgs hard gate your progress like this (mostly survival games and whatever you would classify something like Terraria as)
weirdee 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:14 p. m. 
Your character level is based off of your gear level. In that sense, you can't just keep killing random enemies to get stronger, you have to progress by unlocking better gear.

in terms of power fantasy....I agree that the human heroes seem a bit nuts compared to the average vampire, but once you gain their blood, if you're not facerolling the minor bosses, that's just a skill issue
Última edición por weirdee; 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:16 p. m.
Leiraion 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:15 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por James:
The reason this game makes you feel weaker as you progress is that your power is dictated almost entirely by boss progression. Not a lot of rpgs hard gate your progress like this (mostly survival games and whatever you would classify something like Terraria as)
Could I not say that World of Warcraft gates my progress the same way because I have to kill bosses in order to get the gear you are referring to?
James 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:17 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:
Publicado originalmente por James:
The reason this game makes you feel weaker as you progress is that your power is dictated almost entirely by boss progression. Not a lot of rpgs hard gate your progress like this (mostly survival games and whatever you would classify something like Terraria as)
Could I not say that World of Warcraft gates my progress the same way because I have to kill bosses in order to get the gear you are referring to?

I guess it depends on where you are doing your gearing. You don't have to fight bosses at all and there are a lot of different ways to do endgame grinds, but in general you start super weak and get relatively stronger.
Leiraion 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:33 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por James:
I guess it depends on where you are doing your gearing. You don't have to fight bosses at all and there are a lot of different ways to do endgame grinds, but in general you start super weak and get relatively stronger.
So is the issue that you have to continuously face bigger challenges to get stronger?

This is true in any game realistically. But, just like in V Rising, you aren't struggling in any of these games against enemies that are relatively close to your gear level.

If I'm fighting max level mobs at 250il in Dragonflight right now it's going to be wildly different from fighting them at 420il.

If I'm soul level 150 in Elden Ring ng it's going to feel a lot easier in any area of the game than it would be if I was sl 50.

If I'm gear level 60 in Silverlight Woods it's going to feel a lot different than gear level 84.


To gear in Dragonflight, you need to kill bosses. Whether in keystones or in raids.

In Elden Ring sure you can just grind, but at a certain point you'll need to fight into the end-game areas where each mob has multiple mechanics and can typically obliterate you if you make a mistake (Revenants are a great example) in order to get the ancient smithing stones to get stronger.

In V Rising you need to do both. You need to progress into areas in the world to gather materials and you need to kill bosses to gain new spells or access to new technologies.

I'm having a lot of trouble understanding how this is an issue.
James 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:37 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Letsatsi:

I'm having a lot of trouble understanding how this is an issue.

I've stated several times it isn't an issue. I just enjoy different difficulty curves than this in my rpgs. There isn't anything wrong with how its done though and it isn't strange for a game to work like this.
Última edición por James; 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:37 p. m.
weirdee 20 MAY 2023 a las 10:47 p. m. 
It's not really much of a curve. I think the biggest early game gap is Octavian, but with our new spell kits, it's not as much of an issue.
Tanyon 21 MAY 2023 a las 12:28 a. m. 
I never feel weaker.. I think the enemies get more difficult.. it is always challenging when you first get to a new zone but that isn't because "I am weaker" it is because I am in a new area where my opponent is stronger then the guys I was just fighting. I feel like your entire conversation is just some crazy BS to just get all all to comment.. and it's working.. here I am..

When I played vanilla WoW.. and went from Ashenvale to Felwood.. the enemies went from 35 to like 55.. they were skulls.. I did not get weaker.. they are a lot stronger..
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Publicado el: 20 MAY 2023 a las 6:29 a. m.
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