Shields or armor?

[RaptorSolutions]

Going on to the Leviathan it's the first ship where it seems I can really start stacking shields. Though it seems energy might then be an issue.
So, what should I go for? I see shields have no resistances, but there is some kind of armor plating which gives resistances and shield recharge or something? Is that what I should be using for shield tanking?
Also shields seem to have some kind of delay before regen or something? Is it delay after last taking hits? Or delay after depletion? Or by using that shield armor thing could I get regen high enough I can just sit there and tank most hits?

[CirceTheSiren]

i always use both just to avoid losings ships when unprotected equipments explode and starts a chain reaction.
i prefer to use the rapid shield variants and hope the engineers do theirs jobs also on my escort bridges to take care about the power.

[DOKA]

Приветствую! По "Левиафану" могу сказать точно - я использую МНОГО щитов (70К+) с упором на быстрые, а на место "шкурки" ставлю броню манны. Защита минимальная (200 ед.) но она есть, а за счет большого количества брони такого типа не возникает проблем с энергией. Но на настоящий момент перешел уже на линейные крейсера. Буду ловить/строить линейный крейсер германцев. Там посмотрим что на нем эффективней. Но бой от щитовой защиты обычно выгодней чем бой от брони. Часто ремонт не нужен от слова совсем!

Greetings! Regarding “Leviathan” I can say for sure - I use a LOT of shields (70K+) with an emphasis on fast ones, and in place of the “skin” I put manna armor. The protection is minimal (200 units), but it is there, and due to the large amount of armor of this type, there are no problems with energy. But at the moment he has already switched to battlecruisers. I will catch/build a German battle cruiser. We'll see what's more effective there. But a fight from shield protection is usually more profitable than a fight from armor. Often repairs are not needed at all!

[RaptorSolutions]

Originally posted by DOKA:

Приветствую! По "Левиафану" могу сказать точно - я использую МНОГО щитов (70К+) с упором на быстрые, а на место "шкурки" ставлю броню манны. Защита минимальная (200 ед.) но она есть, а за счет большого количества брони такого типа не возникает проблем с энергией. Но на настоящий момент перешел уже на линейные крейсера. Буду ловить/строить линейный крейсер германцев. Там посмотрим что на нем эффективней. Но бой от щитовой защиты обычно выгодней чем бой от брони. Часто ремонт не нужен от слова совсем!

Greetings! Regarding “Leviathan” I can say for sure - I use a LOT of shields (70K+) with an emphasis on fast ones, and in place of the “skin” I put manna armor. The protection is minimal (200 units), but it is there, and due to the large amount of armor of this type, there are no problems with energy. But at the moment he has already switched to battlecruisers. I will catch/build a German battle cruiser. We'll see what's more effective there. But a fight from shield protection is usually more profitable than a fight from armor. Often repairs are not needed at all!

Well, I have 2 support ships currently with a total of +16 materials. So I now only pay for fuel.
So 70k, that gives me a benchmark. What kind of recharge are you looking at? Tbh I still don't really understand shields.
And for mana armor, do you mean the one's that boost shields? Or the one that gives recharge?

Originally posted by CirceTheSiren:

i always use both just to avoid losings ships when unprotected equipments explode and starts a chain reaction.
i prefer to use the rapid shield variants and hope the engineers do theirs jobs also on my escort bridges to take care about the power.

But not all equipment needs to be protected right? I don't actually fully understand how resistances work, now do I have a feel for how much the damage negation thing work, like I understand that part, I don't understand it relative to incoming damage.
But coming back to it, basically armor the exploding parts right? I think I might actually be seeing it, I should be going for an All or Nothing armor scheme like in WW2? Armor the actually critical which I guess would be the bridges and explosive parts, then shield the rest?

[RaptorSolutions]

So reading through past threads, it seems I've been doing things wrong.
Do I not need to put all my stuff behind armor like how I've been doing? Feels like I should just be going full shields instead.
Like I just got an Iberian Ibex recently, and noticed all it's engines are exposed at the back. Never thought much of it but perhaps that is intended?
The Leviathan doesn't exactly have a lot of plating only slots, so I guess I can shield tank it too? Then put the mana generation "armor" on the plating slots.

[gigamelon1981]

Shields.
It covers your entire ship, unlike armor.
Also, if you put mechanized storage or Bunkers, they practically almost just as tough as armor.
And if you can put weapon on top of an armor slot, use weapon. Weapon module has damage and has HP, like half the Armor HP. Armor doesn't deal any damage, just a pure wall.
i.e.
Normal compartment like storage, has 1000 HP per tile (not actual number, for the sake of simplification)
Weapons has 500 HP per tile.
Armored weapons 1000 per tile
Bunker and Mech storage 1500 per tile
Mana canvas 300 HP per tile
Light armor 700 HP per tile
Medium armor 1500 HP per tile
Heavy armor 3000 HP per tile
Rapid shield 500 HP per tile, + 1200 Shield HP per tile, but covers the entire ship.

Most people will put Rapid shields or Mana Canvas onto armor slots.
Armor sucks, unless you have a must to protect, a critical component of the ship that could explode. If you don't use volatile engine or power generator, there's no need to armor them. Lesson learned from Cosmoteer, the entire ship explodes when volatiles within the ship explodes.
I always try to have 100K shields and above +1500 surplus energy.

The best armor so far is the Teutonic armor i think. But it so heavy, and protect only a tiny part of your gigantic ship. Heavy, so much you need to put effort into propulsion to counter. And it would probably Teutonic engines, which once again, volatiles.

Also, so far, ship repair effort never catch up with the shield regen.

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

Like I just got an Iberian Ibex recently, and noticed all it's engines are exposed at the back. Never thought much of it but perhaps that is intended?

Ibex doesn't need to move at all if you configure her as a carrier. Practically making her be able to face tank while putting her engines at the safest place it could be.
Reversing is also an option.

[RaptorSolutions]

Originally posted by gigamelon1981:

Shields.
It covers your entire ship, unlike armor.
Also, if you put mechanized storage or Bunkers, they practically almost just as tough as armor.
And if you can put weapon on top of an armor slot, use weapon. Weapon module has damage and has HP, like half the Armor HP. Armor doesn't deal any damage, just a pure wall.
i.e.
Normal compartment like storage, has 1000 HP per tile (not actual number, for the sake of simplification)
Weapons has 500 HP per tile.
Armored weapons 1000 per tile
Bunker and Mech storage 1500 per tile
Mana canvas 300 HP per tile
Light armor 700 HP per tile
Medium armor 1500 HP per tile
Heavy armor 3000 HP per tile
Rapid shield 500 HP per tile, + 1200 Shield HP per tile, but covers the entire ship.

Most people will put Rapid shields or Mana Canvas onto armor slots.
Armor sucks, unless you have a must to protect, a critical component of the ship that could explode. If you don't use volatile engine or power generator, there's no need to armor them. Lesson learned from Cosmoteer, the entire ship explodes when volatiles within the ship explodes.
I always try to have 100K shields and above +1500 surplus energy.

The best armor so far is the Teutonic armor i think. But it so heavy, and protect only a tiny part of your gigantic ship. Heavy, so much you need to put effort into propulsion to counter. And it would probably Teutonic engines, which once again, volatiles.

Also, so far, ship repair effort never catch up with the shield regen.

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

Like I just got an Iberian Ibex recently, and noticed all it's engines are exposed at the back. Never thought much of it but perhaps that is intended?

Ibex doesn't need to move at all if you configure her as a carrier. Practically making her be able to face tank while putting her engines at the safest place it could be.
Reversing is also an option.

How do shields work exactly? The regen part is interesting, but also the part I do not understand.
Do they regen under fire? Or is there a delay? If there is a delay how does it work?
But yeah, I'll probably redo my flagship to full shields. Then if it looks good, my escorts.
I did also note how the Teutonic turrets are basically armored and exposed generally, but I didn't think much of it at the time.

As for the Ibex. I use it as a ghetto carrier/resupply with cargo currently. But I also just added a Meadow Harrier anyway so my cargo needs are met.

[gigamelon1981]

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

How do shields work exactly? The regen part is interesting, but also the part I do not understand.
Do they regen under fire? Or is there a delay? If there is a delay how does it work?
But yeah, I'll probably redo my flagship to full shields. Then if it looks good, my escorts.
I did also note how the Teutonic turrets are basically armored and exposed generally, but I didn't think much of it at the time.

It simply regen when taking damage. And it will continue to do so if your ship has an ample power to spare. It is why I provide with +1500 excess energy.
Shield power consumption when you put the module, only states the shield power consumption when idle or at max strength. When regenerating however, it took much more effort. 1500 extra wouldn't cope with continous heavy barrage. It is like for lukewarmly under fire. You can test your build to check your energy consumption under stress.
Whether you're firing all weapons with a lot of EN consumption or took damage from enemy, or both.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3115354715
My old design before the new updates.
FYI you can put creatures or drones into cargo spaces. Turning cargo spaces into weapons.

[RaptorSolutions]

Originally posted by gigamelon1981:

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

How do shields work exactly? The regen part is interesting, but also the part I do not understand.
Do they regen under fire? Or is there a delay? If there is a delay how does it work?
But yeah, I'll probably redo my flagship to full shields. Then if it looks good, my escorts.
I did also note how the Teutonic turrets are basically armored and exposed generally, but I didn't think much of it at the time.

It simply regen when taking damage. And it will continue to do so if your ship has an ample power to spare. It is why I provide with +1500 excess energy.
Shield power consumption when you put the module, only states the shield power consumption when idle or at max strength. When regenerating however, it took much more effort. 1500 extra wouldn't cope with continous heavy barrage. It is like for lukewarmly under fire. You can test your build to check your energy consumption under stress.
Whether you're firing all weapons with a lot of EN consumption or took damage from enemy, or both.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3115354715
My old design before the new updates.
FYI you can put creatures or drones into cargo spaces. Turning cargo spaces into weapons.

Ah, constant regen then. So with enough regen you can infinitely tank.
Also isn't there a stat in the stat screen which calcs how much shield actively regening needs? Is that inaccurate?
Anyway, I'll give it a shot. Hope the Leviathan has enough slots to make something work.

[gigamelon1981]

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

Ah, constant regen then. So with enough regen you can infinitely tank.
Also isn't there a stat in the stat screen which calcs how much shield actively regening needs? Is that inaccurate?
Anyway, I'll give it a shot. Hope the Leviathan has enough slots to make something work.

At the previous screenshot, it is +1000 shield regen/s. Which you can see within the blue bar at around the top right corner. Or checking each individual shield module, which also tells the power need when regenerating.

[RaptorSolutions]

Originally posted by gigamelon1981:

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

Ah, constant regen then. So with enough regen you can infinitely tank.
Also isn't there a stat in the stat screen which calcs how much shield actively regening needs? Is that inaccurate?
Anyway, I'll give it a shot. Hope the Leviathan has enough slots to make something work.

At the previous screenshot, it is +1000 shield regen/s. Which you can see within the blue bar at around the top right corner. Or checking each individual shield module, which also tells the power need when regenerating.

I'm talking about the energy requirements actually. For the shield regen. Did I misinterpret what you were saying?

[gigamelon1981]

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

I'm talking about the energy requirements actually. For the shield regen. Did I misinterpret what you were saying?

I said you can check that from each individual shield statistics.
Maybe from the Stats tab, but sometimes it doesn't tell accurately.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3146365202
Better screenshot.
Notice the "shield recharge consumption" at the Stat Tab also.

[RaptorSolutions]

Originally posted by gigamelon1981:

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

I'm talking about the energy requirements actually. For the shield regen. Did I misinterpret what you were saying?

I said you can check that from each individual shield statistics.
Maybe from the Stats tab, but sometimes it doesn't tell accurately.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3146365202
Better screenshot.
Notice the "shield recharge consumption" at the Stat Tab also.

Yeah, but aren't the shield recharge and it's energy consumption different things? I get 1.5k shield recharge but it consumes 2.2k or so energy when active.
Also after swapping over it feels kinda disappointing? Like I expected either to become godlike or squishy after throwing out all my armor. It feels the same. Actually even with 70k+ shield and 1.5k recharge my shields still seem to pop fast. Does that have something to do with enemy fighters? I nearly got shredded by those. Too bad the Leviathan only has 2 rear slots. I take the Himmerite airburst for those.

[gigamelon1981]

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

Originally posted by gigamelon1981:

I said you can check that from each individual shield statistics.
Maybe from the Stats tab, but sometimes it doesn't tell accurately.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3146365202
Better screenshot.
Notice the "shield recharge consumption" at the Stat Tab also.

Yeah, but aren't the shield recharge and it's energy consumption different things? I get 1.5k shield recharge but it consumes 2.2k or so energy when active.
Also after swapping over it feels kinda disappointing? Like I expected either to become godlike or squishy after throwing out all my armor. It feels the same. Actually even with 70k+ shield and 1.5k recharge my shields still seem to pop fast. Does that have something to do with enemy fighters? I nearly got shredded by those. Too bad the Leviathan only has 2 rear slots. I take the Himmerite airburst for those.

Yeah those fighters are nasty haha.
I used mines or lasers to cope with them.
And i don't think the Himmelrite airburst is a good option against them.

[RaptorSolutions]

Originally posted by gigamelon1981:

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

Yeah, but aren't the shield recharge and it's energy consumption different things? I get 1.5k shield recharge but it consumes 2.2k or so energy when active.
Also after swapping over it feels kinda disappointing? Like I expected either to become godlike or squishy after throwing out all my armor. It feels the same. Actually even with 70k+ shield and 1.5k recharge my shields still seem to pop fast. Does that have something to do with enemy fighters? I nearly got shredded by those. Too bad the Leviathan only has 2 rear slots. I take the Himmerite airburst for those.

Yeah those fighters are nasty haha.
I used mines or lasers to cope with them.
And i don't think the Himmelrite airburst is a good option against them.

I don't really have much choice other than the basic mana disruptor or w/e it's called. Because I only have two 1x1 slots.
But mines work? I think there might be 2x1 mines. And I doubt the carronade is good. Airburst just seems better.

[gigamelon1981]

Originally posted by RaptorSolutions:

I don't really have much choice other than the basic mana disruptor or w/e it's called. Because I only have two 1x1 slots.
But mines work? I think there might be 2x1 mines. And I doubt the carronade is good. Airburst just seems better.

On paper yes, just remind you each fighter have like 2000 HP, while the airburst doing 50 per shot.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3146457530
This what i've just doing.
Those ships primarily using Shields.
And consider use Boarding options when you're able to. It is much faster to kill the marines rather destroying the ship sometimes. Even if not, lacking crew will give malus to the enemy ship.
I'm using the tactical mine launcher. Yes the 2x1 one. And a collosal mine catapult for an instant fighter deletion.