Bad magic system

[LenoirM]

Drova is awesome game, and I really like to play it. Always when I play RPGs I choose a spellcaster class.

In Drova, there are spells and a kind of magic class, but its impossible to play as mage since the begining of the game, and this force the player to spend learning points in skills that are not used by pure mages, or take a really hard time saving all the learning points until the magic became enable.

Additionally, the system of gaining focus through physical strikes also force the player to abandon the pure mage gameplay, and if the plays insistis on not gain focus attaking he gonna need a lot lf base focus and wait a long time until the focus bar are full to cast the powerfull spells.

So even though the game was incredible, the magic system disappointed me. I hope that could be fixed in a future Drova 2.

[Zuvio]

You can pour all your LP into MIND in chapter 1 and get high base focus so you can use skills without having to built focus through attacking. This also plays into building a mage in chapter 4.

[slowpeter]

Like other games with a focus on melee, full ranged and full magic are closer to challenge runs for those already experienced with the game.

Full mind is still viable even early with a dagger build too.

[Sgt.JESUS]

Its only doable if you have previous knowledge of the game, i think Drova is a world where magic is rare, hard to achieve and to use, the druids are the only teachers and so on, its very powerfull, i used a single scroll of that fire pillar spell to clear the wolf cave early game, died a lot trying to get all the doggos in the spell area.

So i like the idea that spells are powerfull and only acquired late game, some runes like lightning storm are so powerfull it would break the game if avaiable too early, so that makes scrolls valuable too.

[a small rabbit]

So i wanted to do a "magic" build my first time playing, and i decided to save all my points until i could unlock a mind trainer. I went with a spear as my weapon for the reach + focus on hits thinking it would work out nicely. I knew from a little checking without too many spoilers that the earliest mind trainer was the ruin raiders after finding the stones since i didnt want to skip act 1 or do the forest stuff.

You need 5 stones to unlock the mind trainer at the ruins and you can get those 5 without really having to cheese enemies. I also wanted to do as much exploring as i could in act 1. Practically what this meant was that i played the majority of the game with a spear build and using a couple scrolls sometimes, even unlocking the mind trainer only served to let me boost my prowess to equip better spears and use spear skills.

By the time i actually unlocked the runestone and could use magic i felt like i had pretty much already fought all there was to fight with a spear and did it just fine. In that regard, finally getting the runestone was kind of a letdown since up to that point there were enough scrolls for some of the harder fights and it didnt feel like much of a boost to finally not need them. especially with how slow your focus regens anyways.

I think it would have been fine to have the basic magic missile spell unlocked much earlier.

Ive done 3 runs now, classic spear/magic which was my first, an insane/hardcore bow run and an explorer axe run (for the acheivments) and the spear combat followed by the axe has been my most favorite. Magic felt like a letdown, and the bow combat feels bad with limited arrows if you miss or dont get a strong bow fast and it takes too many shots to kill someone, not to mention the lack of aoe.

[LenoirM]

Originally posted by Zuvio:

You can pour all your LP into MIND in chapter 1 and get high base focus so you can use skills without having to built focus through attacking. This also plays into building a mage in chapter 4.

Its true and its a nice way to reach act 4 without spending LP on STR. But the only usable abilyties this way are Wound and Charge (duo to the amount of focus required), and playing like this doesnt seam to play as a mage. So the feeling that the game dont have a mage class (at least the begining) remains.

[LenoirM]

Originally posted by Sgt.JESUS:

Its only doable if you have previous knowledge of the game, i think Drova is a world where magic is rare, hard to achieve and to use, the druids are the only teachers and so on, its very powerfull, i used a single scroll of that fire pillar spell to clear the wolf cave early game, died a lot trying to get all the doggos in the spell area.

So i like the idea that spells are powerfull and only acquired late game, some runes like lightning storm are so powerfull it would break the game if avaiable too early, so that makes scrolls valuable too.

The games lore is awesome, but I believe that could be possible made some gameplay adjustments without break the suspense about mythic magic (ex.: having an iten, lika a staff or a wand, with a minor trick charges).

[Zuvio]

Originally posted by LenoirM:

Originally posted by Zuvio:

You can pour all your LP into MIND in chapter 1 and get high base focus so you can use skills without having to built focus through attacking. This also plays into building a mage in chapter 4.

Its true and its a nice way to reach act 4 without spending LP on STR. But the only usable abilyties this way are Wound and Charge (duo to the amount of focus required), and playing like this doesnt seam to play as a mage. So the feeling that the game dont have a mage class (at least the begining) remains.

Absolutely right! The devs said themselves there isn't a pure mage class. Magic is a strong addition to the world.

[Ananym]

"I can't play exactly the way I decide I should be allowed to play, therefore the system is bad"

[LenoirM]

Originally posted by Ananym:

"I can't play exactly the way I decide I should be allowed to play, therefore the system is bad"

This Steam Forum is an important tool for developers to know players' opinions about the game. I respectfully expressed my opinion, with reasons, about something in the game that makes my experience less funny. Yours response is more of a provocation than a logical counterpoint. I don't see any point in doing this.

[Zuvio]

Well, there is no magic class. There are no classes actually. Just you the adventurer. You spent learning points to get better in certain areas. You learn skills based on what weapon you want to wield. Being able to use magic at all is deeply incorporated in how this world works. So your critique, although valid, is kind of misplaced for this game.

EDIT: also, the title of your post, "bad magic system", is a very strong wording of finding a fault in this game when the game never pretended to have what you are critiquing in the first place.

[slowpeter]

I recommend you check out their latest behind the scenes video, "How do we approach balancing Drova."

https://youtu.be/KT5S5UmK86c?t=541

There is a section on "Why we decide against being able to play only with ranged weapons?"

The ideas there are also applicable to magic.

[a small rabbit]

Originally posted by Zuvio:

Well, there is no magic class. There are no classes actually. Just you the adventurer. You spent learning points to get better in certain areas. You learn skills based on what weapon you want to wield. Being able to use magic at all is deeply incorporated in how this world works. So your critique, although valid, is kind of misplaced for this game.

EDIT: also, the title of your post, "bad magic system", is a very strong wording of finding a fault in this game when the game never pretended to have what you are critiquing in the first place.

The game DOES have a magic system though. One of your 3 main stats is mind, and its reasonable to assume that you would be able to raise it and play using magic given you find scrolls early and fairly often and their is dialogue talking about getting your own runestone.

The flaw is that without prior knowledge, players won't know that mind trainers cant be found until the later acts, and getting your own spells doesn't happen until over halfway through the game.

In that regard i would have to agree with the OP that it IS a bad magic system or at least somewhat poorly implemented. The devs appear to have wanted the player to focus on the weapon combat given the talents etc which is fine, but mind being one of your prowess stats can reasonably lead players to assume that they could play a "caster" style instead when its really more of a supplement to the weapons.

[Zuvio]

Originally posted by a small rabbit:

Originally posted by Zuvio:

Well, there is no magic class. There are no classes actually. Just you the adventurer. You spent learning points to get better in certain areas. You learn skills based on what weapon you want to wield. Being able to use magic at all is deeply incorporated in how this world works. So your critique, although valid, is kind of misplaced for this game.

EDIT: also, the title of your post, "bad magic system", is a very strong wording of finding a fault in this game when the game never pretended to have what you are critiquing in the first place.

The game DOES have a magic system though. One of your 3 main stats is mind, and its reasonable to assume that you would be able to raise it and play using magic given you find scrolls early and fairly often and their is dialogue talking about getting your own runestone.

The flaw is that without prior knowledge, players won't know that mind trainers cant be found until the later acts, and getting your own spells doesn't happen until over halfway through the game.

In that regard i would have to agree with the OP that it IS a bad magic system or at least somewhat poorly implemented. The devs appear to have wanted the player to focus on the weapon combat given the talents etc which is fine, but mind being one of your prowess stats can reasonably lead players to assume that they could play a "caster" style instead when its really more of a supplement to the weapons.

MIND also raises base focus which is useful for using skills and indeed, for using scrolls which can blow up most difficult encounters early on.
There is a MIND stat for various reasons, but there is no magic class, there are no classes in the game, so my point stands.

[a small rabbit]

Originally posted by Zuvio:

MIND also raises base focus which is useful for using skills and indeed, for using scrolls which can blow up most difficult encounters early on.
There is a MIND stat for various reasons, but there is no magic class, there are no classes in the game, so my point stands.

I mean you keep focusing on a magic "class" which isn't the issue being raised, so no, your point really doesn't stand.

Originally posted by Zuvio:

You can pour all your LP into MIND in chapter 1 and get high base focus so you can use skills without having to built focus through attacking. This also plays into building a mage in chapter 4.

You literally said in your first response you could build to play as a mage so you seem to be contradicting yourself. The problem is that the game doesn't let the player know that they won't unlock their own spells into much later in the game, nor can they easily find a mind trainer without prior knowledge of the game and that that it would be nicer if players had earlier access to both of these.

It's not an attack on the game, the OP even said they thought the game was incredible, but you seem super upset that there is feedback about how magic was implemented.

[Zuvio]

Originally posted by a small rabbit:

Originally posted by Zuvio:

MIND also raises base focus which is useful for using skills and indeed, for using scrolls which can blow up most difficult encounters early on.
There is a MIND stat for various reasons, but there is no magic class, there are no classes in the game, so my point stands.

I mean you keep focusing on a magic "class" which isn't the issue being raised, so no, your point really doesn't stand.

Originally posted by Zuvio:

You can pour all your LP into MIND in chapter 1 and get high base focus so you can use skills without having to built focus through attacking. This also plays into building a mage in chapter 4.

You literally said in your first response you could build to play as a mage so you seem to be contradicting yourself. The problem is that the game doesn't let the player know that they won't unlock their own spells into much later in the game, nor can they easily find a mind trainer without prior knowledge of the game and that that it would be nicer if players had earlier access to both of these.

It's not an attack on the game, the OP even said they thought the game was incredible, but you seem super upset that there is feedback about how magic was implemented.

"plays into building a mage" does not equal "having a mage class in the game", my point absolutely stands and there is no contradiction.

OP literally said "~snip~ I choose a spellcaster class. In Drova, there are spells and a kind of magic class, but its impossible to play as mage", so that is exactly what this discussion is about: disappointment that there is not a magic class in the game even though the game does not pretend to have a magic class.

I have no stake in this game, despite the fact I love it. But criticizing anything based on a trait/perk that is not even intended to be in the game is weird, you could even say, it super upsets me.