Atheism Trait

[luxtizer]

I'm not sure what the devs are going for, but it rubs me the wrong way that atheism reduces a character's intelligence and charisma, and is a purely negative trait. It's a weird jab at a large group of people in an otherwise inclusive game. Maybe call the trait something else?

[Silvi the Bun]

Wait really XD that's a weird one.

[lozza_dearnley]

Especially given the correlation between atheism and intelligence in real life.

[Jay]

As a spiritual atheist (some personal spiritual views, with no god involved whatsoever) myself I found it kind of weird. I sort of assumed the charisma was for the reaction atheists get in religious society. They should replace the intelligence debuff, that's just mean to have in there. I don't believe in god(s), that doesn't mean I'm dim.

Or like you said renaming the trait something else would be a good idea.

[Horatio Hornbag]

Haven't gotten any atheist villagers yet but that's messed up. You could argue being an atheist in a real world accurate medieval game would carry problems but this isn't that kind of game, and to me comes across like an insult.

[Greg Bahm]

It's not exactly a normal trait like "proud" or "shy" or "greedy." It's more of a mood.

You seem to get "atheism" as a first issue if the brothel lacks prostitutes. This then becomes "heretic" then "disbeliever" which lowers all stats and significantly shortens lifespan.

There's a lot of confusing stuff going on in this mechanic. If you have a skilled enough prostitute at the brothel, you get "grateful" instead. So the implication isn't that atheists are stupid and ugly. Rather, the implication is that a lack of whoring may make someone lose their faith in life and get angry and ornery and then die young.

I think it's a joke that translated poorly from French.

[chaleur]

There's also a community service for "faith" that portrays lack of faith as a problem for the community. The pleasure house harms it.

[luxtizer]

Really all I think it would take to fix this is renaming it. Maybe something like "discouraged" or "hopeless" instead of atheist?

The connection between the trait and the brothel also makes for some very weird implications. "No prostitutes available today? Well then, I guess God is a lie. Also, I'm dumber now."

[Whymanen]

Ok, I almost bought the game but this clearly shows it’s not a game I want to support. Thank you for the information!

[Tutsi Noncombatant]

Originally posted by lozza_dearnley:

Especially given the correlation between atheism and intelligence in real life.

yeah like joe rogan.

[lozza_dearnley]

Originally posted by oy Velsnuk:

Originally posted by lozza_dearnley:

Especially given the correlation between atheism and intelligence in real life.

yeah like joe rogan.

Yes like Joe Rogan. And Stephen Hawkins. Richard Dawkins. Lawrence Krauss. Bill Nye. You really want to play this game friend?

Making someone an atheist doesn't make them intelligent and being intelligent doesn't mean you will be atheist. But the correlation clearly exists.

Plus, for a progressive game, with a progressive audience (who are more likely to be non-believers), it seems an odd choice. I don't think the "faith" system was well thought out - the "pleasure house" slows the decay of faith? Huh? If it added to entertainment and took away faith, that would make sense.

[djhwg]

Ok i am definetely not buying this game

[Barranoid]

Originally posted by djhwg:

Ok i am definetely not buying this game

Same. That thing now goes right to my ignore list. There's enough other issues with it but this is just plain rude.

[karinundmaedels]

This game has a couple of problematic unintended(!!) messages (for example "you should arrange same-sex marriages for people with bad traits so they cannot pass on their traits"). That doesn't mean that they are put there on purpose, usually devs are not even aware of them. When a dev creates gameplay, they usually look only on stuff like "what makes sense" and "is it fun", and never realizes that players will think "ok if you combine this mechanic with this mechanic, isn't it obvious what a devious message this creates?" That's something you can only find out in playtests (which the game obviously not had enough).
These unintended messages are problematic and should be criticized, but it wouldn't be fair to say that the devs put them in on purpose.

[Letarsier]

To be atheist in the middle age was not supposed to be clever. By a strange coincidence, the game happens to take place in the middle age ^^

[pitfall]

Originally posted by Letarsier:

To be atheist in the middle age was not supposed to be clever. By a strange coincidence, the game happens to take place in the middle age ^^

Gays were also executed in the middle ages and definitely did not have adoption rights. Lol