Spoilers about characters and a distaste it left me

[KingOfFriedChicken]

So leon and killing him off really irritated me but i accepted it, seriously how you gonna give us a death with no way to prevent it that was just stupid but i kept on.

Then you start removing party members at random and and some of my best for several missions my healers and mages to boot these are characters whom seem to have a significant importance and you just take em away? Yes you get retainers but all of the gear they have the dont return to stock while gone they just keep it with em so i might have some weaker replacements but not the gear they pack for sure.

THEN you go and kill off a second character with no choice in the matter WTH? i spent time on these characters i went thru the effort of training them in horse riding and unlocking skills i made sure no one died in missions spent hours on that and you just kill them off uneventfully... my best units none the less! Its stupid and you shouldn't do it, and in NG+ you should let us keep them on the roster even if they aren't in camp because any playthru i will pass on even using these units at all not even as retainers why bother if they die off its killed the game for me as well im skipping all cut scenes and just beating it now because i dont like it when you take stuff from me without it being my fault.

On top of that every time i face balistar i whoop him in battle then the scenes after were always me being chased off yeah i knocked you out easy not even a challenge and still im the one running away as if he stood a chance. head to head i won every time lol doesn't bother me as much its just funny lol but seriously dont take away characters forever in cut scenes in future games there is a reason games like Fire emblem only do it to non playable characters anymore cuz it kills the mood and a good portion of why a lot of us play. It isnt a powerful scene its just irritating and then i have to seek out a replacement that is behind.

[LukanGamer]

"seriously how you gonna give us a death with no way to prevent it that was just stupid"
lol

[KingOfFriedChicken]

Ursprungligen skrivet av LukanGamer:

"seriously how you gonna give us a death with no way to prevent it that was just stupid"
lol

Its dumb to kill off playable characters in cut scenes they are taking your best units from you the "band of brothers" they basically egg you on to play then take them away. Robin and leon were my best riders thats a skill you cant train fast and no one else was trained in do to lack of horses. Robin was my best sniper, and late game i had to get someone else to fill his shoes who was way lower level.

I plan characters from the start of the game which each profession is considering all the skills they will have, i was lvl 50 before missions were reading lvl 40 on quite a few of my characters, to me thats the fun of the game and others as well, to give me no power over a death is some top tier game killer stuff. This is why fire emblems make important characters like the heros dad in 3 houses non playable that way the death can mean something and you dont lose all your effort from a scripted death.

This means that on my next playthrus i will avoid Leon, Robin, marchelle, gilbert, klara and maybe even albretch as main party, Now only 2 of these are deaths but they also love to snatch away these other members from random mission lengths of time and i wont have them to play with so i might as well put them on retainer status and not touch them if at some point my party becomes no longer a reliable party composition and they take their gear with them when they go out why would i bother with them at all?

[LukanGamer]

lol go play fortnite or anything without story or character and not to mention easy effort to "level max" basically everyone, this not your type of game if this sort of complaints.

[LukanGamer]

The only complaint I would see possible is the rapport system

Which you not even really covering (no surprise given all you said clearly)
But ya.. :D especially for 1st guy as reaching his max, will not only feel bit of a waist given its imo horrible system of limited gifts+talks but you would have to rush far too much to him to reach max.

[KingOfFriedChicken]

Ursprungligen skrivet av LukanGamer:

lol go play fortnite or anything without story or character and not to mention easy effort to "level max" basically everyone, this not your type of game if this sort of complaints.

I have played pretty much every tactical game that comes out, fire emblem fan played nearly all of them I could get my hands on, final fantasy tactics, triangle strategy, disgia, xcoms, valkyria, I even played that voids tactics al game the list goes on... but I love trunk based tactical games they are for me.

But it's rare that a game let's you put in a ton of effort into characters then kills them off in a cutscene, it would be one thing if I lost them in a mission legitimately from my own mistakes but I make an effort in all games like this to never lose 1 unit if I do its something I did wrong and I'll correct that by playing over till I get it right.

But I do agree on the rapport system I was literally a sliver away on Robin like 1 gift from max I was kinda enjoying his chill attitude about carpentry after the war. But I enjoy the gameplay more then the story and destroying my team composition to me is the worst.

[treahnurb]

I honestly get you, specially about Robin. Leon happened quite early in the game, so I guess it was... okayish. And blabla to unlock Eden's powers etc.
But Robin was ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. Not to mention I cried like a baby for 20 minutes or so, that's another story but the game hands you Robin as THE archer and he was MY archer and a very well trained damage source.
I then stood there with a horse in my hands and no archer. Turned Pavlo into one who luckily has for some reason enough horse riding skill to use the special ability but still. Taking Robin away that late in the game really was a heavy blow into my tactical game play (and my emotions...)
You get warriors and mages thrown into your face non-stop, even among the main characters, but no archers. Sure, Klara can be one but she's not there most of the time.

Bigger problem was even Gilbert. Because he took a legendary weapon and a horse with him and I never got them back. Which sucks. Also warlocks don't grow on trees for some reason, I would never take Johanna with me and that left me with Levana who was seriously undertrained at that moment.
(I know now that you can save Gilbert but I was missing like 1 gift for max rapport with him.)

[KingOfFriedChicken]

Yeah i almost missed gilbert but i read somewhere else after robin about max rapport saving him so i did because if i lost another one of my lvl 50s i probably would have quit lol So i gave him every gift till it was max. Its not even about an emotional connection for me its that i wasn't even giving a simple side mission or chance to return robin, it was just him leaving and giving me no choice in his death in a game where i obsess over saving everyone its part of the challenge for me, now lucky me i had the blonde girl as my backup archer and assassin and i had 3 snipers 1 on reserve for the defense missions but robin was gonna be my main sniper after mastering his other classes. So i had to shift everyone around i think it was Leta (the sister to gisip) who ended up replacing him for me.

[LukanGamer]

Can't and shouldn't be able to save everyone, its called war and war war never changes.

(also not like this a rouge like or xcom these are characters with story and some stories well they have to end at some point and some times that has to be sooner to add to some one else's).

[treahnurb]

Ursprungligen skrivet av LukanGamer:

Can't and shouldn't be able to save everyone, its called war and war war never changes.

Not saying it should be possible but there are games like Mass Effect where you have at least the chance, even if it's very hard, to save almost everyone. Or make a choice. (like: between Kaidan and Ash, between Legion and Tali etc) Dunno, if I could, I would've send anyone else into death except Robin. Or if there was a hidden achievement if you had done something (maybe hard to do) that Robin escapes.
Same with Gilbert, okay he is a case that you can save him but if they let me pick between Klara and Gilbert for eg, it would be Gilbert every time for example.

It's so weird because in the battle before that chapter with Robin, I've beaten Balastar's troops with ease. I lost none of my units and it was even Robin who did the last shot against Balastar for his unit to retreat. The goal was to survive 15 rounds but I just beat down every enemy in 14. Stuff like that should make it at least possible to save Robin, aka: main goal is to survive 15 rounds but if you manage to actually beat everyone before that, why not reward it? Leon is already the "dies, there's nothing you can do about it"-brother why does Robin have to follow into that fate :(
(tbh I am also just super sad about his death. Which can also be a good thing, game having you emotional etc but I just wished for a way to save him...)

[LukanGamer]

Ursprungligen skrivet av treahnurb:

you literally beat your own argument down, you cant save all kaidan or ash die . no matter how silly or not it maybe even is.
(along with a few other characters typically and MANY if you deviate from companions in the list of deaths, including that exact sample Ie Cap. K and his team) so ya death happens.
You also talk about most those things when hmmm 2 obvious giant flaws and sort of a 3rd.
1. almost all those are end game not early on
(most even being just ME 2 ending which was not hard at all it was a joke amount easy just do their quests and don't be a moron ie don't send a weak biotic to do a barrier or wait to save your crew ... --> glad and fine it had it but never would call that difficult, unless they had done what they semi shown in ancient trailers of acting like there was a time limit and you can only do so much)
2. you talking about the number 1 company and 1 of the only ones that specializeD in doing story+characters especially to such extent and way, let alone $$.

~3. to some extent they are personal player story and have more of a X is dead so X replaces them to talk where this is not like that and would not be as fitting.

If you wanted to give them a few thousand dollars and some ideas on writting/writting team too up the many routes etc that would be required I bet they maybe would then
(ESPECIALLY for first guy that dies as that is a massive important thing and not just a minor he/she talks here instead or w/e)

[treahnurb]

If you would read carefully what I wrote then you wouldn't miss how I said: "where you have at least the chance, even if it's very hard, to save almost everyone. Or make a choice." so there's nothing about me beating my own argument.
Bioware was not a big company when they did ME1, Kaidan/Ash choice is mid-game so not late game, before that there's also Wrex-problem.
And with Lost Eidolons basically being 50% battle and 50% story (there's no exploration etc), with very awesome voice actors, I don't think it would have been too much to ask for to implement a possibility to save Robin.
But alas the devs decided to kill him off and really turn the knife in the wound afterwards with all the chats with others about him, the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ horse (ofc I named it Robinson), the letter and so on and so forth. Like I said before, I don't say this HAS to be a bad thing. (to stick with ME, you can't save Thane or Mordin from death either in ME3 - BUT AT LEAST THEY ARE NOT IMPORTANT AND TRAINED COMPANIONS.) For example why not kill off Sera? She only contributes to the story but not to the battles.
(on a side not, compared to Robin's death, Leon kinda got a short end. He died in a cut scene - then there was a 2 years later time skip and no one really seemed to care THAT much.)

[KingOfFriedChicken]

Lets be honest Kaiden or ash die early in the game like so early i didnt have a connection to either, and i ended up romancing Liara anyway, so i chose Kaiden with no feels attached. They didnt let me get to lvl 30 then off kaiden, that is a large difference. Which is why leon while annoying i was okay with he was trained but it still happened early enough. But its also not a tactile game if your characters died in Mass effect they revive at the end of the fight as a mechanic or you could medi gel them lol

This game is very much akin to Fire emblem, X com, Final fantasy tactics, and even in Fire emblem 3 houses you lose your dad in the story but he only ever joins you as an Ally unit not a playable character you can train yourself. They made a good plot about it to why he couldn't be in your party, they could have done that in this game made leon and robin a part of different units that sometimes tagged in with us so i don't feel my time was wasted training up units and i would have still "lost a dear friend" for the emotions.

[treahnurb]

Ursprungligen skrivet av KingOfFriedChicken:

Lets be honest Kaiden or ash die early in the game like so early i didnt have a connection to either, and i ended up romancing Liara anyway, so i chose Kaiden with no feels attached. They didnt let me get to lvl 30 then off kaiden, that is a large difference. Which is why leon while annoying i was okay with he was trained but it still happened early enough. But its also not a tactile game if your characters died in Mass effect they revive at the end of the fight as a mechanic or you could medi gel them lol

This game is very much akin to Fire emblem, X com, Final fantasy tactics, and even in Fire emblem 3 houses you lose your dad in the story but he only ever joins you as an Ally unit not a playable character you can train yourself. They made a good plot about it to why he couldn't be in your party, they could have done that in this game made leon and robin a part of different units that sometimes tagged in with us so i don't feel my time was wasted training up units and i would have still "lost a dear friend" for the emotions.

Yep, and I agree fully on that statement. If it's really about "losing someone dear to you" etc then don't make them such a valuable tactical unit that you trained from the beginning of the game and then snuff them out with no chance to rescue almost at the end where you need them the most. I find it unfair that three guys (two if you manage to save Gilbert) bite the dust but all these ladies get to live another day. Klara or Sera or Johanna even would've been perfect for "dramatic sacrifice" because they rarely or not at all are an actual (important even) unit.

Justice for Robin!

[KingOfFriedChicken]

I think from the plan perspective Johanna being a girl wouldn't have worked, *doesnt really look like eden) she is also a romance option and you cant kill her either. As well as Klara or Sera.
However at the very least it could have let me chose who of my units went on a suicide mission, i have a ton of back end men i would have gladly sent off. Even then it would be nice if they listed it as a hard suicide mission and gave me some choice in it, and if lost the units are lost. or no matter what the unit is lost but depending on how well i did it gave a larger advantage/disadvantage to the escape efforts.

[treahnurb]

Not exactly talking about why Robin died but character deaths in general. If they wanted a dramatic character death, they could've picked someone else, too. Klara had more than one chance to die. :D