Spoiler: Feng

[CogDiss]

I think that, at the very least, there should be more dialogue options in interactions with him.

He is a jackass who strings the player character along and makes them go on repeated wild goose chases for him while dangling out the offer to remove their tracker, and ends up asking the player character to do way more than they ever agreed to before he will uphold his end of the bargain. And that's fine, there are people like that in real life. But what I found infuriating is that your character comes across like a complete idiot and you can't even call him out, instead repeatedly having dialogue options that are basically variations on "sure" or "I don't know about this." I found it astounding how after making me run like half a dozen stupid errands Feng had to be the one to say "I haven't forgotten about your tracker, by the way," because my character was apparently too spineless to be the one to raise the issue.

I ended up giving up on helping him out of frustration and feeling like an utter fool, then I ditched the station without completing all of his quests and I hope he got hunted down and killed without my help. So for full disclosure, I don't know how his storyline ends, I just know that I did more than enough for him and I got absolutely nothing in return.

[Shiro]

well, I won't tell you what he found in the end, but the thing is, you have misread. You were not promised to instantly get reward he told about after first part of his quest - he said that this reward is what you get in the end. Before that, skill points is decent enough.

[CogDiss]

Originally posted by Shiro:

well, I won't tell you what he found in the end, but the thing is, you have misread. You were not promised to instantly get reward he told about after first part of his quest - he said that this reward is what you get in the end. Before that, skill points is decent enough.

Nope, this wasn't an issue with my reading comprehension.

He absolutely never specified up front all of the ridiculous steps he ends up demanding of the player, and strongly implied that he would reciprocate the favour far sooner.

On top of that, he goes into hiding without communicating with or helping the player, and expresses surprise when they are able to track him down and asks how they did it (so he didn't deliberately leave the clue for them). This proves that at that point at least he had absolutely no intention of helping the player out (despite already having received favours from them by that point). He pretends to be their friend but he is a snake and using them (keep in mind he also drags the player along as backup to a tense confrontation without telling them what is going on or getting their consent in advance). He's a piece of ♥♥♥♥ who you don't have the opportunity to call out or oppose (or if you do, it comes far too late).

At a certain point I didn't care at all about his tragic backstory or what happened to his parents, because if anyone deserved that it was him.

[Shiro]

single "expresses surprise" is a silly excuse when it is absolutely clear he left the clue deliberately, as this box of gum otherwise has no meaning otherwise, being only placed to be found by Sleeper and not guys who search Feng's workplace..

"drags along as a backup" is a silly excuse when he went there to bait his opposition, which he clearly explained afterwards. Bringing Sleeper there not only was safe (as to keep his reputation, that corrupt executive would avoid leashing on anyone but Feng), but also actually gives more info to the Sleeper about what's going on.

Also obviously Sleeper already has history with corps pwning them, so while neutral humans could be seen as dubious, those of corporate allegiance - such as one Fang specifically opposes - are natural enemies, In this setting, they shed humanity long ago and cannot be trusted. Cheering for them would be as stupid as handing a gun to a guy who is there to hunt you, no matter circumstances.

Overall, it's not so much as Feng being a "snake", as you being boneheaded and failing to notice the obvious. (Here I assume you were honest, of course.) It probably will be of small comfort to you that by escaping the Eye without disabling the tracker, you pretty much just give leisure to corps to track the Sleeper in the future. Maybe in few months, or years.

[CogDiss]

Are you this much of a doormat in real life? If so, I have a few chores I could use getting done around my house. If you lend me a hand I promise I'll return the favour...at some unspecified point in time, possibly after requiring a few more solids from you.

Do you not see anything objectionable at all about Feng using the presence of the tracker to extort the Sleeper (even more disgustingly, and also ironically, someone who is trying to escape slavery) to be his perpetual errand boy? Are you just siding with Feng because "corporations bad," when Feng obviously represents a different form of exploitation?

[Shiro]

Why have you helped anyone else on the station, then? That bloody mercenary clearly does not deserve the trust, is exploiting your mechanical skills and will rob and leave for dead later; meanwhile repairs bay in the Hub is an obvious scam.

Or have you escaped via colony ship? They may be giving ok payment at the start, but we know by now how this will probably turn out. You would have escaped corporate slavery only to become on-board slave, and work till death from lack of serum.

There is literally no possibility of getting everything you want without lifting a finger. Unless you're sheltered and live indefinitely without work, you will have to work for or with someone. You will have to trust people. Including when proposed reward is not as easy to just give as a fistful of coins, which means people won't give reward immediately after first part of your job is done, and yes this means vagueness about whether reward will be given at all.
Luckily, in case of Feng, he does show clearly he can be trusted (unlike yakuza and doctor plot where doctor also is a bit dubious at some point, or pretty much entirety of a bounty hunter plot).

[putty]

i felt the similarly about Feng, OP.
however i did complete his storyline (mostly bc by the time i realised he was going to take forever to remove it i had already sunk too much into his questline to pursue other options). i mostly picked the more sceptical options and felt it did come across in the dialogue that my character was fed up with him (even the action description at one point said smth like 'why are you always waiting for feng? when is it going to be his turn to wait'), like i felt he was intended to come off as inconsiderate with complete tunnel vision on his mission, when i expressed reluctance to help he basically told me well i implicated you along with me when i took you to see harden, so if you dont help you're probably screwed too. which made me feel better about the storyline, the narrative doesnt really try to make you feel too sorry for him from what i saw, like theres a bit about it his parents but he mentions it pretty early on so it doesn't feel like it's supposed to be a redemption moment. i dont mind characters that treat the player badly or have other priorities or wev, it can be refreshing for NPCs lives to not revolve around the PC (imo Feng is not a good example of this tho since he relies on the PC to save his ass so many times) as long as the narrative doesn't pretend otherwise.
IA a 'wait what about my tracker' option was sorely needed; i literally completed his questline with 1 cycle left before i was tracked down and while that was great tension wise, i was really frustrated i couldn't even remind Feng hey i'm also on a timeline, my body is slowly decaying as we speak! also at the end of his storyline he's like i'm glad i have a friend like you, and i wanted to be like dude we're not friends, we're barely colleagues!
felt weird we didn't have the option to tell him to f off but i guess leaving his quest incomplete is the equivalent? would have liked a more explicit way of cutting ties or at least attempting too, like we're given in the mercenary storyline.

it's funny because it's not like he does anything horrendous unlike other characters the mercenary that i felt more sympathetic too, plus he is actually trying to achieve something good.
you're not wrong, Feng. you're just an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

[Prophet_01]

@putty

Yep, that largely sums up my view as well. Tunnel vision indeed.

While he did seem somewhat sympathetic for the sleepers' situation, there's no doubt about his priorities. I was never quite sure if he just doesn't notice the world around him in his zeal or if he would consciously throw anyone under the bus for the greater good. I'm still undecided. His definition of friendship seems to be either careless or quite compromising and conditional.

He's similar to Castor in that he doesn't compromise his ideals for anything. Feng isn't upfront about it though. For me they represent different takes on "the cause justifies the means".

Very plausible characters in the setting and I think each of them adds a lot to the game but they're probably very dangerous friends to have. With that in mind, I would prefer more dialog options for Feng as well.

[MoreEvilSquid]

So in an RPG, there's an NPC who gives you lots of errands, strings you along, and takes forever to give you a reward?

Wow, that's totally never happened in any other game ever before. I guess being a game set in a dystopian future made you think that everyone there would be nice and there'd be no ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥?

Feng possibly only stands out because there are surprisingly few ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ in this game. And he does eventually live up to his end of the bargain, which is better than some NPCs in some other games.

I would have preferred options to include reference to the fact that you're being hunted at this very moment (especially if you've encountered Ethan since the quest started, which is bound to happen somewhere along the line).

But don't you also get something out of it along the way? I recall getting stuff I could sell afterwards after at least some of these sub-quests of his, unless I'm misremembering.

[putty]

Originally posted by Prophet_01:

Yep, that largely sums up my view as well. Tunnel vision indeed.

While he did seem somewhat sympathetic for the sleepers' situation, there's no doubt about his priorities. I was never quite sure if he just doesn't notice the world around him in his zeal or if he would consciously throw anyone under the bus for the greater good. I'm still undecided. His definition of friendship seems to be either careless or quite compromising and conditional.

ia with everything you said
that's a very good point about carelessness/not noticing - since we can't mention we're being closely hunted there's no guarantee he's in any way aware how time critical our situation is, and he's not the type of person to think to ask or be concerned without prompting, not while embedded in his own hunt himself.

feels pretty realistic, ngl if i had lost my job and was facing charges of treason i might not think to ask someone else 'hey you can wait for this to be done before i do that favour right?'. i'm not the type of person to let a virtual stranger help me so much for no return, but some people are pretty shameless. or if they're the type of person to not stand on politeness when it comes to asking or complaining, they assume other people are the same way.

Originally posted by Prophet_01:

He's similar to Castor in that he doesn't compromise his ideals for anything. Feng isn't upfront about it though. For me they represent different takes on "the cause justifies the means".

Very plausible characters in the setting and I think each of them adds a lot to the game but they're probably very dangerous friends to have. With that in mind, I would prefer more dialog options for Feng as well.

ia. feng's blatantly dismissive if you question his ideals or methods, but then kinda blithely assumes you'll still go along with it regardless?
charitable view is he just assumes you wouldn't show up to help him if you had any real concerns or would say if you really needed the tracker off right then.
less charitable view is he knows you don't really have a ton of options but to help and exploits that, with the justification hes not doing anything wrong and he does plan to help you eventually.

Castor is way more clear , he seems older or at least more mature than Feng in general. he's also in a lot less desperate situation than feng, has prob been a info broker for a long time and has other contacts etc. feng is basically a civil servant with a axe to grind lol

Originally posted by MoreEvilSquid:

So in an RPG, there's an NPC who gives you lots of errands, strings you along, and takes forever to give you a reward?

Wow, that's totally never happened in any other game ever before. I guess being a game set in a dystopian future made you think that everyone there would be nice and there'd be no ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥?

Feng possibly only stands out because there are surprisingly few ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ in this game. And he does eventually live up to his end of the bargain, which is better than some NPCs in some other games.

I would have preferred options to include reference to the fact that you're being hunted at this very moment (especially if you've encountered Ethan since the quest started, which is bound to happen somewhere along the line).

But don't you also get something out of it along the way? I recall getting stuff I could sell afterwards after at least some of these sub-quests of his, unless I'm misremembering.

ia.
tbf i prefer his blithe ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ vs the usual "im so sorry your baby is rigged explode in 2 hours but before i help can you please go kill some bandits for me its super important :( sorry would love to help rn but cant :(" you get in games. like the character is not presented as being nice or super concerned about me while simultaneously not helping until i do xyz things for them.
while still not being an outright antagonist or backstabber, which is refreshing.

can't remember about getting stuff from his sub-quests (i mean i got paid for the deliveries i guess)
but he deliver above and beyond with the tracker in the end

[MoreEvilSquid]

Originally posted by putty:

Originally posted by Prophet_01:

Yep, that largely sums up my view as well. Tunnel vision indeed.

While he did seem somewhat sympathetic for the sleepers' situation, there's no doubt about his priorities. I was never quite sure if he just doesn't notice the world around him in his zeal or if he would consciously throw anyone under the bus for the greater good. I'm still undecided. His definition of friendship seems to be either careless or quite compromising and conditional.

ia with everything you said
that's a very good point about carelessness/not noticing - since we can't mention we're being closely hunted there's no guarantee he's in any way aware how time critical our situation is, and he's not the type of person to think to ask or be concerned without prompting, not while embedded in his own hunt himself.

feels pretty realistic, ngl if i had lost my job and was facing charges of treason i might not think to ask someone else 'hey you can wait for this to be done before i do that favour right?'. i'm not the type of person to let a virtual stranger help me so much for no return, but some people are pretty shameless. or if they're the type of person to not stand on politeness when it comes to asking or complaining, they assume other people are the same way.

Originally posted by Prophet_01:

He's similar to Castor in that he doesn't compromise his ideals for anything. Feng isn't upfront about it though. For me they represent different takes on "the cause justifies the means".

Very plausible characters in the setting and I think each of them adds a lot to the game but they're probably very dangerous friends to have. With that in mind, I would prefer more dialog options for Feng as well.

ia. feng's blatantly dismissive if you question his ideals or methods, but then kinda blithely assumes you'll still go along with it regardless?
charitable view is he just assumes you wouldn't show up to help him if you had any real concerns or would say if you really needed the tracker off right then.
less charitable view is he knows you don't really have a ton of options but to help and exploits that, with the justification hes not doing anything wrong and he does plan to help you eventually.

Castor is way more clear , he seems older or at least more mature than Feng in general. he's also in a lot less desperate situation than feng, has prob been a info broker for a long time and has other contacts etc. feng is basically a civil servant with a axe to grind lol

Originally posted by MoreEvilSquid:

So in an RPG, there's an NPC who gives you lots of errands, strings you along, and takes forever to give you a reward?

Wow, that's totally never happened in any other game ever before. I guess being a game set in a dystopian future made you think that everyone there would be nice and there'd be no ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥?

Feng possibly only stands out because there are surprisingly few ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ in this game. And he does eventually live up to his end of the bargain, which is better than some NPCs in some other games.

I would have preferred options to include reference to the fact that you're being hunted at this very moment (especially if you've encountered Ethan since the quest started, which is bound to happen somewhere along the line).

But don't you also get something out of it along the way? I recall getting stuff I could sell afterwards after at least some of these sub-quests of his, unless I'm misremembering.

ia.
tbf i prefer his blithe ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ vs the usual "im so sorry your baby is rigged explode in 2 hours but before i help can you please go kill some bandits for me its super important :( sorry would love to help rn but cant :(" you get in games. like the character is not presented as being nice or super concerned about me while simultaneously not helping until i do xyz things for them.
while still not being an outright antagonist or backstabber, which is refreshing.

can't remember about getting stuff from his sub-quests (i mean i got paid for the deliveries i guess)
but he deliver above and beyond with the tracker in the end

I vaguely recall being able to sell some extra stuff I got as part of his hacking quests? Or perhaps I'm misremembering, and it was actually me obtaining extra stuff irrespective of his quest.

Still, I'm pretty sure that Feng opens up new areas for you to hack due to him providing those keys (or at least, quests to get those keys, which you otherwise wouldn't be able to get). Which I thought was worth it, since that allowed me to hack more stuff which I could then sell.

[Tyrant of Troy]

I'm team Feng all the way! What a legend!

[MoreEvilSquid]

Originally posted by Tyrant of Troy:

I'm team Feng all the way! What a legend!

Fully agree!

Even though he took his sweet time to sort my ♥♥♥♥ out (so in the meantime had a run-in or two with that bastard bounty hunter), he did manage to sort things out before someone worse could find me.

And the resolution of his plans was definitely worth it.