Honestly pretty disappointed so far

[Nerva Matapan]

I like that the game doesn't suffer from memory issues like the first one - it feels a lot more stable than the original. However, I'm leaning towards it being an overall inferior product for a ton of different reasons, a few of which I am just going to list off.

- I hate that you have to use multiple civilian slots to increase trade. We should be able to build one station per planet and, if desired, upgrade it - not devote the whole orbit to trading.

- I am not a fan of the 'crippled' HP mechanic. Ships should just die upon reaching zero HP - there shouldn't be a 'super secret probation' level of HP that they can then fall to.

- I don't like exotics... at all. They're an unpredictable resource, and while that may encourage aggression (I assume that was the point), they're a significant headache on smaller maps with few chokes.

- The tech trees themselves are just too large. I like upgrades; I like the trees, and enjoyed that element in the OG. But I don't need 100+ options to populate.

- The music and voice acting seem to be of lower quality than the original. And that wasn't a high bar.

- The fact that we didn't even get ONE new faction is kind of appalling.

- I don't like of how the zoom-in works, and how far you have to zoom to actually see the ships and the combat.

- The random spawning of 'hired NPC fleets' into your rearward planets after about 2 hours is completely unwelcome. I may have missed something, but I want to turn this off. At least the pirate factions in the first game had to fly to attack you - these sudden pop-up armadas are ridiculous.

- I want to disable auctions. I just don't want them to be a part of my games.

- The loss of planet specializations, and the overall neutering of archaeological finds have robbed conquest of a lot of its spice.

- Planetary defenses feel overtuned right now compared to the power of fleets - even fleets with Titans.

Unfortunately, I feel like I could carry on for about 30 more lines, but you get the picture. It isn't one thing with SOASE II that makes me dislike it - it's the collective experience. Yes, things will undoubtedly improve and change with time. But, as they stand right now, I can't recommend this game - it's just an inferior version of the original.

[Spectre]

i agree with you on the auctions, at the start of the game they sell really useful items that'll help in a pinch but late game when you have your fleets maxed out and are swimming in resources it get annoying how they remind you "you didn't bid on this pocket change you fool" makes me want to play the game on mute.

[Mitora]

Pretty good write up there.

I myself was leaning towards getting this game, but the more i watch and the more i read i get that feeling again that this is just a remaster of rebellion with even less features than it's predecessor.

The taming down of diplomacy

The use of ai for it's ui and from what i am gathering it did a really poor job and it only had one job and that's make icons representative of the abilities that they activate and or have you learn.
Multiple reports of how it failed really bad and the icons lead people to confusion everytime they play so you have to constantly look up the descrips of what they even do.
This should not be a thing.
Plus why is the game un-discounted or even discounted so expensive if they used ai for a lot of the game's basic functions.

There are issues where settings are tucked away in not so easy to find locations though they did say they heard and will patch this, but i wonder why it took a year on epic for them to even reach this stage when it should have been day one.

Looking at the skill trees, i feel less would have been more.
Too many people think that bloat leads to an increase in depth or difficulty, the difficulty is often tied to the confusion and overwhelmment of so many toggles for different things and sometimes this leads to just flat out overlap or just flat out bloat.
We don't need 20 skill ups for +1's or 2's for days on end when simply making it more difficult to reach the next skill up will do.

I feel they also played it far too safe with the ships and went too far overboard with some of the fx like shield hits looking like fireworks constantly going off regurlarly.

I do like the idea of tall ship combat which others do not with ships standing still and just trading punches, that's very realistic.
Tall ships shouldn't be zooming around, that's what fighters do, show me an aircraft carrier that moves like a Porsche.

I also like the fact the game has a new engine for newer hardware and the gfx in general are looking ok.

Also i like just crippling a ship it's a new dynamic that adds a bit of realism especially if we can capture said ships which i am not sure of tbh with sins2 or if the enemy can pull their crippled ship back into action.
That being said it's a nifty new mechanic.

I really don't know what to tell people since we don't have a demo for people to try that i have seen, other than to wait on a few patches, even if that means you miss this sale, let's see what they do with the game as there are just too many why didn't they do this sooner and why does soo much look the same also why was some of the cool things from rebellion left out.

I am not saying the game is trash at all no way, just that it's a very much wait and see game right now to see if they address many of the concerns listed here and elsewhere before a purchase feels worth it.

So i will stick with rebellion and the mods for the time being and watch where this game goes, i may yet get it in 6 months or a year if it grows into that game i was hoping for once it has some good mods and more patches.
Again if you like it, that's fine, it's just not for me, at least yet and i am going to give them a chance to address my complaints.

[SaltyClownShoes]

Originally posted by Nerva Matapan:

I like that the game doesn't suffer from memory issues like the first one - it feels a lot more stable than the original. However, I'm leaning towards it being an overall inferior product for a ton of different reasons, a few of which I am just going to list off.

- I hate that you have to use multiple civilian slots to increase trade. We should be able to build one station per planet and, if desired, upgrade it - not devote the whole orbit to trading.

- I am not a fan of the 'crippled' HP mechanic. Ships should just die upon reaching zero HP - there shouldn't be a 'super secret probation' level of HP that they can then fall to.

- I don't like exotics... at all. They're an unpredictable resource, and while that may encourage aggression (I assume that was the point), they're a significant headache on smaller maps with few chokes.

- The tech trees themselves are just too large. I like upgrades; I like the trees, and enjoyed that element in the OG. But I don't need 100+ options to populate.

- The music and voice acting seem to be of lower quality than the original. And that wasn't a high bar.

- The fact that we didn't even get ONE new faction is kind of appalling.

- I don't like of how the zoom-in works, and how far you have to zoom to actually see the ships and the combat.

- The random spawning of 'hired NPC fleets' into your rearward planets after about 2 hours is completely unwelcome. I may have missed something, but I want to turn this off. At least the pirate factions in the first game had to fly to attack you - these sudden pop-up armadas are ridiculous.

- I want to disable auctions. I just don't want them to be a part of my games.

- The loss of planet specializations, and the overall neutering of archaeological finds have robbed conquest of a lot of its spice.

- Planetary defenses feel overtuned right now compared to the power of fleets - even fleets with Titans.

Unfortunately, I feel like I could carry on for about 30 more lines, but you get the picture. It isn't one thing with SOASE II that makes me dislike it - it's the collective experience. Yes, things will undoubtedly improve and change with time. But, as they stand right now, I can't recommend this game - it's just an inferior version of the original.

Then play with mods. You can create your own mods or wait for someone else to solve your problems for you. I use mods to get around all sorts of stuff.

Game is fine, it's gonna get better too. No re-make is flawless. Old sins needed an overhaul and it's not a bad one. Plenty of games out there did a poorer job than this does.

[SaltyClownShoes]

Originally posted by Mitora:

Pretty good write up there.

I myself was leaning towards getting this game, but the more i watch and the more i read i get that feeling again that this is just a remaster of rebellion with even less features than it's predecessor.

The taming down of diplomacy

The use of ai for it's ui and from what i am gathering it did a really poor job and it only had one job and that's make icons representative of the abilities that they activate and or have you learn.
Multiple reports of how it failed really bad and the icons lead people to confusion everytime they play so you have to constantly look up the descrips of what they even do.
This should not be a thing.
Plus why is the game un-discounted or even discounted so expensive if they used ai for a lot of the game's basic functions.

There are issues where settings are tucked away in not so easy to find locations though they did say they heard and will patch this, but i wonder why it took a year on epic for them to even reach this stage when it should have been day one.

Looking at the skill trees, i feel less would have been more.
Too many people think that bloat leads to an increase in depth or difficulty, the difficulty is often tied to the confusion and overwhelmment of so many toggles for different things and sometimes this leads to just flat out overlap or just flat out bloat.
We don't need 20 skill ups for +1's or 2's for days on end when simply making it more difficult to reach the next skill up will do.

I feel they also played it far too safe with the ships and went too far overboard with some of the fx like shield hits looking like fireworks constantly going off regurlarly.

I do like the idea of tall ship combat which others do not with ships standing still and just trading punches, that's very realistic.
Tall ships shouldn't be zooming around, that's what fighters do, show me an aircraft carrier that moves like a Porsche.

I also like the fact the game has a new engine for newer hardware and the gfx in general are looking ok.

I really don't know what to tell people since we don't have a demo, other than to wait on a few patches, even if that means you miss this sale, let's see what they do with the game as there are just too many why didn't they do this sooner and why does soo much look the same also why was some of the cool things from rebellion left out.

I am not saying the game is trash, but it is a bit disappointing from what i am seeing and reading and i am going to just wait around awhile personally to see if they make it into that successor that i thought it should have been more worthy of having a 2 behind it when in the areas i was most looking forward to seeing were either left the same or just flat out not done to toned down.

Up to you, but I am enjoying the hell out of it and if I didn't pay attention to the forums I would never know anyone was complaining at all.

HOWEVER

The Developers are actively supporting the game and have already "eaten their hats" so to speak, on a number of issues and are hard at work correcting the most egregious problems. I backed it on Epic but that smallish group that supported it in Beta is nothing like the savagery the Devs now face on Steam. Give it time, it might just be the best damn game or the best game on a modern engine available.

I can't wait for the Star Wars and Star Trek mods to be ported over and reworked for Sins II. Modding is where its always been for this game.

[Slaig]

Sorry the experience is not what you were expecting. We have some plans to make the research screen easier to parse. The music composer and voice acting studio are the same as the original.

[SaltyClownShoes]

Originally posted by Slaig:

Sorry the experience is not what you were expecting. We have some plans to make the research screen easier to parse. The music composer and voice acting studio are the same as the original.

The fact that you even respond to people is enough reason to buy the game and have a little faith. Thank you for this, been waiting a long time to play Sins on a modern engine on my insane PC with crazy sized maps. I am loving it!

[Imperium]

Same, but Stelaris spoiled me with immeasurable depth. I have some faith that the game will be very good down the line after expansion or two.

[Mitora]

Originally posted by Slaig:

Sorry the experience is not what you were expecting. We have some plans to make the research screen easier to parse. The music composer and voice acting studio are the same as the original.

Thanks to the devs for chiming in, i know it's not easy to see complaints about something you all worked on,
Hopefully you all don't stop communicating even after the game has been out a while, too many devs do that.

[Kimbo]

Originally posted by Nerva Matapan:

I like that the game doesn't suffer from memory issues like the first one - it feels a lot more stable than the original. However, I'm leaning towards it being an overall inferior product for a ton of different reasons, a few of which I am just going to list off.

- I hate that you have to use multiple civilian slots to increase trade. We should be able to build one station per planet and, if desired, upgrade it - not devote the whole orbit to trading.

- I am not a fan of the 'crippled' HP mechanic. Ships should just die upon reaching zero HP - there shouldn't be a 'super secret probation' level of HP that they can then fall to.

- I don't like exotics... at all. They're an unpredictable resource, and while that may encourage aggression (I assume that was the point), they're a significant headache on smaller maps with few chokes.

- The tech trees themselves are just too large. I like upgrades; I like the trees, and enjoyed that element in the OG. But I don't need 100+ options to populate.

- The music and voice acting seem to be of lower quality than the original. And that wasn't a high bar.

- The fact that we didn't even get ONE new faction is kind of appalling.

- I don't like of how the zoom-in works, and how far you have to zoom to actually see the ships and the combat.

- The random spawning of 'hired NPC fleets' into your rearward planets after about 2 hours is completely unwelcome. I may have missed something, but I want to turn this off. At least the pirate factions in the first game had to fly to attack you - these sudden pop-up armadas are ridiculous.

- I want to disable auctions. I just don't want them to be a part of my games.

- The loss of planet specializations, and the overall neutering of archaeological finds have robbed conquest of a lot of its spice.

- Planetary defenses feel overtuned right now compared to the power of fleets - even fleets with Titans.

Unfortunately, I feel like I could carry on for about 30 more lines, but you get the picture. It isn't one thing with SOASE II that makes me dislike it - it's the collective experience. Yes, things will undoubtedly improve and change with time. But, as they stand right now, I can't recommend this game - it's just an inferior version of the original.

I would like to add some crazy balance/changes I have noticed.

There is no ingame map editor like there was in SINS1

Each map is LOCKED either with or without wormholes/minor factions etc so you never get a choice

Most maps with wormholes have one positioned 2-3 jumps from your Capitol

The majority of planets in a galaxy have multiple connections(planets can move if you select that option) causing the game turning into a bunch of little battles all over the place because of the travel time/lack of map diversity/option to create our own

Shields no longer regenerate IN COMBAT but armor and hull does which feels and plays bad. Why play Advent again?

TEC get free 1k fleet supply (garrison) on top of the already limiting 2k max fleet supply.
Strike craft are limited by faction. You are pigeonholed into selective fleet compositions.

Tons of UI elements are just missing from the first game

Multiple capitol ships abilities do not *auto-cast*

They have destroyed the orbital structure mechanic from the first. You will only be able to build 1/3 the defensive structures as you could from the first causing any fleet that is built with a brain to break any planet. In the first game every faction could build a *cadia* with enough time and resources, not in SINS2

Honestly SINS2 feels like they want to turn this into some Esport title with a lot of these decisions which is such a shame

I wonder how many of the people who worked on SINS2 worked on SINS1 because a lot of these changes lead me to believe that not very many of them did

[Fyst]

Originally posted by Mitora:

Originally posted by Slaig:

Sorry the experience is not what you were expecting. We have some plans to make the research screen easier to parse. The music composer and voice acting studio are the same as the original.

Thanks to the devs for chiming in, i know it's not easy to see complaints about something you all worked on,
Hopefully you all don't stop communicating even after the game has been out a while, too many devs do that.

No worries we are used to it. We just take notes and make lists of what is actionable and if so, on what time frame. For reference on our communication and support, we put out a patch for Sins1 last fall and it launched in 2008.

[Siarnaq]

Originally posted by Fyst:

Originally posted by Mitora:

Thanks to the devs for chiming in, i know it's not easy to see complaints about something you all worked on,
Hopefully you all don't stop communicating even after the game has been out a while, too many devs do that.

No worries we are used to it. We just take notes and make lists of what is actionable and if so, on what time frame. For reference on our communication and support, we put out a patch for Sins1 last fall and it launched in 2008.

What I hate the most is that they removed QOL options from SOSE Rebellion. I mean, just look at the graphics settings, the options are prolly 1/4 of what once was like the toggle for skyboxes and low/medium/high choices. I mean, sure make the gameplay nice and smooth but wth are the reasons for not including basic settings first and foremost?

[Nerva Matapan]

Originally posted by Slaig:

Sorry the experience is not what you were expecting. We have some plans to make the research screen easier to parse. The music composer and voice acting studio are the same as the original.

I wasn't trying to crap on you. I think there's promise here, I just am not wild about where it is right now. You might note that I never said "refunded" - I've gotten like 100x my money's worth out of the original; I am prepared to hang around and wait to see what you guys do with this moving forward. Because, like I said, the game is just so much more stable than the original - I've had zero technical complaints.

[Fyst]

Originally posted by Siarnaq:

Originally posted by Fyst:

No worries we are used to it. We just take notes and make lists of what is actionable and if so, on what time frame. For reference on our communication and support, we put out a patch for Sins1 last fall and it launched in 2008.

What I hate the most is that they removed QOL options from SOSE Rebellion. I mean, just look at the graphics settings, the options are prolly 1/4 of what once was like the toggle for skyboxes and low/medium/high choices. I mean, sure make the gameplay nice and smooth but wth are the reasons for not including basic settings first and foremost?

I answered this in a number of places so I should probably just pin an answer. I'll quote it again for convenience:

"Edit post mortem. It didn't take long but the larger sampling pool has already showed us we need to expose more options. So I will eat my hat and get to solving the problem as best we can.

The are lots of options you can find using CTRL-SHIFT-S but I know that won't cover all the cases we've collected from users over the last couple days. We are working on getting some of those exposed to the less hidden option screen and implementing as many of the ones we are missing as possible."

[Siarnaq]

Originally posted by Fyst:

Originally posted by Siarnaq:

What I hate the most is that they removed QOL options from SOSE Rebellion. I mean, just look at the graphics settings, the options are prolly 1/4 of what once was like the toggle for skyboxes and low/medium/high choices. I mean, sure make the gameplay nice and smooth but wth are the reasons for not including basic settings first and foremost?

I answered this in a number of places so I should probably just pin an answer. I'll quote it again for convenience:

"Edit post mortem. It didn't take long but the larger sampling pool has already showed us we need to expose more options. So I will eat my hat and get to solving the problem as best we can.

The are lots of options you can find using CTRL-SHIFT-S but I know that won't cover all the cases we've collected from users over the last couple days. We are working on getting some of those exposed to the less hidden option screen and implementing as many of the ones we are missing as possible."

Just tried the CRTL SHIFT S and holy kol i wouldn't dare touch those number thingies no offense. It's obviously for advanced gamers/rammers to tweak. Hoping the easier and visible version will appear.

[Kimbo]

Originally posted by Nerva Matapan:

Originally posted by Slaig:

Sorry the experience is not what you were expecting. We have some plans to make the research screen easier to parse. The music composer and voice acting studio are the same as the original.

I wasn't trying to crap on you. I think there's promise here, I just am not wild about where it is right now. You might note that I never said "refunded" - I've gotten like 100x my money's worth out of the original; I am prepared to hang around and wait to see what you guys do with this moving forward. Because, like I said, the game is just so much more stable than the original - I've had zero technical complaints.

Same here. Over the years I must have over 1k hours in SIS1. I think there is a lot of people in the same boat as I am with playtime and are frustrated at the lack of features that are/were not ported over to SINS2. I bought the Premium in reference to the first like a lot of other people did I imagine