Deliverance Engine... Holy crap

[Queco Jones21]

Hey all, just wanted to state that the end game big guns, especially the Deliverance Engine, needs to get nerfed a bit. At least have a longer cooldown. The culture hit aint so bad, but hot damn everytime that thing hits any of my planets and some of my ships are there, it converts a ton of my fleet!

Been playing a hard match as the Vasari vs Advent and TEC (both hard). Managed to kill the TEC easily enough, but the Advent star sector (map is a multi system one)... cannot make any headway. They built 3 Deliverance engines and the damn things convert my ships with every shot! Cannot get a beachhead in their system at all without losing most of my fleet in the process.

Wish we could have an in game option to disable the big guns like in Rebellion. It's that, or I need to rush the Advent in every game to avoid them teching up to the deliverance engine!

Loving this so far! But the big guns feel like machine guns with the frequency they can fire.

[Beliar]

It does feel overtuned. Tried to cap advent planet and ALL my frigates(~1200 suplies) got converted 2(!) times(was rebuilding them with vasari mobile factories). Had to start spamming capitals to do anything against them.

[Bartcheeks]

lmao came here looking for this too, playing a custom chokehold 3v3 map and ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, entire game is probably a waste as half of me and allies fleet instantly gets converted after landing, w

[Starmachine24]

Yeah when the AI starts spamming the super weapons like they did in the first game it becomes such a drag, at least the Novalith isn't as devastating anymore since it doesn't block you from capturing the planet again afterwards. But still.... where there is like 10 of those things just blasting everything xD (Luckily i played TEC as well and could get the shield on the starbases that makes planets invulnerable until it is destroyed)

I would also like the option to turn them off, since i never found them to be fun to begin with. Or another solution is to limit how many super weapons can be built.

[Paddy]

Why is there not an option to turn these off? I don't understand why there are more limits to what you can customize?

[BATTLEMODE]

I think those weapons are supposed to be a form of the ol' "Double Win Mechanic". They're there to help the game end when it's time for it to end.

I'll pass this feedback onto the developer, if some people are finding them annoying an option to remove them could be a good idea.

[Naxreus]

Superweapons got over nerfed in Sins 2 to a point they are a waste of resource to buid, I rather spend that money on more ships than building 1

[Queco Jones21]

Originally posted by BATTLEMODE:

I think those weapons are supposed to be a form of the ol' "Double Win Mechanic". They're there to help the game end when it's time for it to end.

I'll pass this feedback onto the developer, if some people are finding them annoying an option to remove them could be a good idea.

But what it does is extend my game indefinitely. I have them locked into their sector, but cannot invade because I lose all my ships due to the Deliverance engines. A longer time between shots would be ideal. I get shot 2-3 times (by EACH D-Engine) in each grav well i try to traverse and lose all my frigates and cruisers :/

Originally posted by Naxreus:

Superweapons got over nerfed in Sins 2 to a point they are a waste of resource to buid, I rather spend that money on more ships than building 1

As they are now, I agree. Some more game options would be nice.

[Donut Steel]

I like having an important strategic target or asset, and 5 out of the 9 mainline Star Wars went with 'stop the superweapon' as the major stake, because it fits.

Someone has a superweapon that they may use: you have to pay attention to them.

Someone has a superweapon that they DO use: you have to stop them.

[Mr.Kill]

Does the engine convert capitals? If not then you might have to go all capitals.

[Queco Jones21]

Originally posted by War Crimes Enjoyer:

I like having an important strategic target or asset, and 5 out of the 9 mainline Star Wars went with 'stop the superweapon' as the major stake, because it fits.

Someone has a superweapon that they may use: you have to pay attention to them.

Someone has a superweapon that they DO use: you have to stop them.

I understand your point. But the way it is implemented, with no build limit and fast cooldown, makes it a nightmare.

In that game it looks like I would need to only move my experiance capital ships and sacrifice them to kill the D-engines.

Even in Star Wars they could only ever have 1 Super Weapon at a time. And they never mind wiped your fleet and instantly converted them to fight against you…

[Bozz 💀]

yeah I agree on this one, I kill every faction in my game until I attacked a planet and they convert my whole fleet, I was like "wtf just happened" seems very poorly balanced

[BATTLEMODE]

I've passed this one onto the designers to take a look at, thanks guys

[Queco Jones21]

Originally posted by BATTLEMODE:

I've passed this one onto the designers to take a look at, thanks guys

Cheers.

From what I see it barely affects my planet in that sector (with just 1 broadcast station and no fort) and it just converts a number of my frigates and cruisers.

At first I was like what the hell is happening?! I killed the enemy fleet but my ships keep turning against me?! Then I released that the D-Engines were the culprit…

Maybe make it so that the effect is not permanent? Or make it have more of an effect vs planets and not the fleet. Also longer cooldowns between shots.

[Donut Steel]

Originally posted by Queco Jones21:

Originally posted by War Crimes Enjoyer:

I like having an important strategic target or asset, and 5 out of the 9 mainline Star Wars went with 'stop the superweapon' as the major stake, because it fits.

Someone has a superweapon that they may use: you have to pay attention to them.

Someone has a superweapon that they DO use: you have to stop them.

I understand your point. But the way it is implemented, with no build limit and fast cooldown, makes it a nightmare.

In that game it looks like I would need to only move my experiance capital ships and sacrifice them to kill the D-engines.

Even in Star Wars they could only ever have 1 Super Weapon at a time. And they never mind wiped your fleet and instantly converted them to fight against you…

The limit is the economics, which is why I intensely dislike difficulty in strategy games being determined heavily by a resource-modifier handicap: game designers practically nullify a swath of strategic idea-space, often without realising it, especially if resources are without an absolute limit.

The Star Wars superweapons weren't limited by anything other than economics either.

There was only one Death Star initially because it took two decades to build, was a secret prototype, and the primary purpose was to give the Emperor the leverage to finally dissolve the galactic senate, which he did off-screen. The second one was designed to destroy the rebel fleet by luring them, and for it to be bigger than the first and be active meant it was started on before the first one was destroyed.

The Trade Federation Mothership controlled their entire drone army, which was all that was needed for enforcing a blockade, invasion and occupation of a single planet. The scheme relied on Naboo receiving no outside help, and tasking any more resources than strictly necessary would attract attention while they are denying it's happening to the senate.

Starkiller Base exists because JJ Abbrams is a hack that has never made a good film, never produced a story with a meaningful ending, and copying better directors is his only talent.

This is why he also decided Star Destroyers can not only be fitted with the same planet-melting fire-power, but so much cheaper that a thousand of them could be done and then buried in infinite loose soil, on a remote planet where manufacturing logistics is likely to be a problem.

Notice how the sequel films completely get the superweapon concept wrong?

So maybe 3 films get it right, out of the 5 that feature them. For the same reasons though: stories and games are just better when they make sense.

[Imperium]

Played vs hard ai team, 3 v 3 v 3 and ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ does deliverence engine ruin the other AIs and my own fleet, I noticed AI had a couple in every sector they owned, it was absurd. The need to be capped like phase gates to like 5 max, so you have to scrap and rebuild them if you want them moved.