What's the point of different exotics?

[SetaX]

So, we have all these exotics. Blue, red yellow...etc. (dunno the names)
I've checked on hard, for Vasari Alliance all costs 240 metal+240 crystal.
So what's the actual point to have 4-5 different one (the green comes later, I'm not sure of the cost of that) if it all the same? None of them are cheaper or harder to get, no rarity, no "mining" involved. It's all created in the same refineries for the same price.
Might as well just have 1 type and be done with it?

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by SetaX:

What's the point of different exotics?
So, we have all these exotics. Blue, red yellow...etc. (dunno the names)
I've checked on hard, for Vasari Alliance all costs 240 metal+240 crystal.
So what's the actual point to have 4-5 different one (the green comes later, I'm not sure of the cost of that) if it all the same? None of them are cheaper or harder to get, no rarity, no "mining" involved. It's all created in the same refineries for the same price.
Might as well just have 1 type and be done with it?

- balance influence by research
- balance influence by looting

[Wuorg]

Regarding the difference: Different exotics are generally used for different things and can be found by surveying different planets. "Red" is guaranteed to come from surveying Volcanics, so if you want to rush your faction's battleship, you'd want to go for the nearest Volcanic planet first. This method will get you exotics for the things you want in the early game much faster and safer than trying to rush refineries.

That said, you aren't the only person to ask this question on these forums. I also feel the way the refineries kind of circumvent the entire point of the mechanic is a bit counterproductive.

[Roderick]

It's a bit of randomness for the start since prospecting planets to get some is a better way if you want some battle ships early on.
But after having enough refineries and resources... yeah, it's kinda useless.

[SetaX]

Originally posted by アンジェル:

Originally posted by SetaX:

What's the point of different exotics?
So, we have all these exotics. Blue, red yellow...etc. (dunno the names)
I've checked on hard, for Vasari Alliance all costs 240 metal+240 crystal.
So what's the actual point to have 4-5 different one (the green comes later, I'm not sure of the cost of that) if it all the same? None of them are cheaper or harder to get, no rarity, no "mining" involved. It's all created in the same refineries for the same price.
Might as well just have 1 type and be done with it?

- balance influence by research
- balance influence by looting

What balance? With colours?
-You get them randomly from survey and wrecks (no balance) All that does is it will (sort of) randomise your 2nd capital ship but only if you want to build it without refinery.
- You will have access to all of of them (except for green) at the same time, the moment you build your first refinery. How's that balancing them?

[SetaX]

Originally posted by Wuorg:

Regarding the difference: Different exotics are generally used for different things and can be found by surveying different planets. "Red" is guaranteed to come from surveying Volcanics, so if you want to rush your faction's battleship, you'd want to go for the nearest Volcanic planet first. This method will get you exotics for the things you want in the early game much faster and safer than trying to rush refineries.

That said, you aren't the only person you ask this question on these forums. I also feel the way the refineries kind of circumvent the entire point of the mechanic is a bit counterproductive.

Valid point.
Feels like an afterthought...

[Summanus]

At the start it serves to time-gate certain research options, Ship and Planet Items, and determines which capital ships you can field for a while. To begin with its fairly successful at this.

By mid & late game they serve almost no purpose whatsoever, because anyone who knows how to play will be running enough refineries to mass-produce what they need well ahead of time.

[SetaX]

Originally posted by Roderick:

It's a bit of randomness for the start since prospecting planets to get some is a better way if you want some battle ships early on.
But after having enough refineries and resources... yeah, it's kinda useless.

It feels like exotics are just justifying the existence of refineries after the first 30mins

[VoiD]

I don't think there are enough of them, they should add 900 extra exotics, it's not enough while they can fit the screen.

[Gauntlet]

I like that different exotics exist and unlock different items or caps.

But agree that they are currently too easy to get any type you want.

Solution?

Different planets produce portions of a type of exotic in raw form, just like metal or crystal.

Then refineries are used to refine the raw into the exotic.

Volcanic planet generates 0.5 red per tick, and for x Crystal/x metal a refinery can take 100 raw red and turn it into the red exotic.

This then limits exotic choices to what is available in your empire

[SetaX]

Originally posted by Gauntlet:

I like that different exotics exist and unlock different items or caps.

But agree that they are currently too easy to get any type you want.

Solution?

Different planets produce portions of a type of exotic in raw form, just like metal or crystal.

Then refineries are used to refine the raw into the exotic.

Volcanic planet generates 0.5 red per tick, and for x Crystal/x metal a refinery can take 100 raw red and turn it into the red exotic.

This then limits exotic choices to what is available in your empire

And it would warrant a better exotics market, you could actually trade them instead of just selling.

[Fendelphi]

The reason why there is not just "1 exotic", is the same reason why we dont have "only credits".
As for exotics feeling pointless late game, well so does credits, metal and crystal.
At some point, you will get enough exotics from your opponents wreckage and you have less and less to spend it on yourself(unless you are constantly buying and losing capital ships).

Anyway, if it was simply called "exotic"(just 1 kind), there would be no nuance. All capital ships cost 3 exotics, and getting them is part of the strategic challenge.
Same with research tech.
It would also be kind of boring if every planet type had the exact same type of exotic material.

The current system means that which planets you take and the amount of surveys you do, matter.
Refineries are an expensive process to get exotics(requires research, which is time and resources, then building it, which is more resources and logistic slots, then produce the exotic by spending more resources), but necessary on certain maps or once you get to around mid game if you want a lot of capital ships(which is not a requirement btw).

If you can deny your opponent a certain type of planet, you might be able to delay the production of certain ships or certain tech.
Same if you raid and destroy their first refinery. That can be a huge setback.


I really, really do not want an "automatic" exotic income just from holding a planet. That takes so much away from the curret interaction and choices a player has to make. Not to mention you end up with waay too many exotics, way too early, which you then sell, and then you have way too many credits too early as well.

[Sakhari]

Originally posted by Fendelphi:

snip

I'm not too bothered by the Exotics system and it's basically a 'whatever' situation to me but I do think you're dramatically overselling the amount of 'nuance' that they add to the game.

Planets, in and of themselves, of all types have plenty of value in resources, build slots, and general tactical advantage. If one is available to take, there's already a very good reason to take it and plenty of reason to deny it to an opponent. There's no value in choosing to leave a free capture on the table if you can avoid it - regardless of what exotics it favors.

For the 'every second counts' PvP types, these minor differences in exotic distribution might make some small difference in the decision-making process during the first couple minutes of the game but for the vast majority of relatively casual players, I suspect they generally stop thinking about the system almost entirely once the refineries hit the field in Tier 2 and they no longer need to,

[Sasha Mason]

The point is that different capital ships, ship items, starbase items, superweapons, titans, and probably a few other things require different amounts of different exotics. When looting ship wreckages or exploring a planet, there are different chances to get different exotics.

So what's the point? The point is that instead of having one, where every time you get an exotic it is ALWAYS going to be one that you need, you have a chance of looting exotics that you may not actually need. Or you end up being able to build certain cap ships and items with the exotics that you have, but not others because you lack them.

It all being one would only make sense if you refining them would be the only way of getting them, but because you can find them on planets or salvage them from ships, the added variety means that you now have to adapt to which things you can build right away with the exotics you have, and which things you need to invest money into to make them.

[Sugam]

Hay op, there is already a good numbered posts about this but the short answer is they add a layer of complexity as they fit different roles for production, upgrades, buildings and even trying to get an alliance. I feel sorry for the people replying in details with repeating of why when a simple glance of effort already has this.

[Sakhari]

Originally posted by Sasha Mason:

So what's the point? The point is that instead of having one, where every time you get an exotic it is ALWAYS going to be one that you need, you have a chance of looting exotics that you may not actually need.

Yes, I understand that RNG can mean you might not get what you 'want' (not necessarily 'need'). Where our opinions seem to diverge is that I don't see why this is inherently a benefit. If I 'want' (not 'need') to build a specific type of cap ship, the net impact on my average game is that I either have the resource already or it'll cost slightly more basic resources to get it. There's little reason to not capture a wreck if it's available. There's little reason not to capture a planet if given the opportunity. So beyond the first few minutes of a game, those decisions generally aren't affected much, if at all.

And again, I don't really care if the system stays as it is since it's so easy to ignore beyond the first few minutes of the game. From my perspective, I just don't feel that it adds much value to the overall experience.