Every time I solve a puzzle, I get spit on

[ioan]

Reached antechamber? Too bad, there's no passage
Got inside antechamber? Here's useless key that opens god knows what
Used basement key? Too bad you drained a fountain instead of going down the elevator shaft, here's a dead end
Lit 4 fires? Here's lore dump, and guess what? Dead end
Solved puzzle in the crypt? Useless piece of map and dead end

[Roan]

Maybe the first one I could see, but you get pretty explicit puzzles / clues from every other thing you listed.

The ones you listed as dead ends are also very much not dead ends, you just don't know what to do yet.

[ffrotty]

The nature of the game is that you don't know what any given puzzle or thing is actually progression towards.

Due to this, it's easy to miss something that leads you to do the next thing and so on. What looks like lore dumps might have crucial clues to something you're not aware of.

Throw in some luck and brute force and you can progress without even knowing how lucky you got or what you were progressing towards.

A common pattern I'm seeing among all the feedback is trying to do too much / everything before antechamber. That yields the results to be confusing, seem useless or poorly paced.

That said there are like 2 or 3 things total that are a bit "unfair," and if you had all the information and knowledge and everything documented nicely in the game there are A->B->...->Z->Solution steps for everything.

If there is anything you have unresolved or haven't figured out, that could be the thing that explains step 1 even though you did part of step 2 and are working on step 10.

So some people getting lucky or fixating arbitrarily on "the right thing" has a much smoother and comprehensible progression than someone else fixating on something else or getting unlucky.

There is no "fixating on the wrong thing" if your goal is to learn and do everything.

There are things to do that are grossly more empowering to your agency than other things.

Out of 100 things I'd say 20-30 will happen by dumb luck, another 20-30 with some amount of brute force due to lack of information/awareness/"getting" the game logic, and the other 50% is raw problem solving with 1/3 to 1/2 of that being interrupted/achieved through RNG.


In all the cases you've listed except for the first one, you could have gotten pretty direct information stating on what the "point is."

For example what 'told' you to drain the fountain? Did you see how without certain things other pump interactions aren't possible?

When you bring up useless key you clearly know that it's for SOMEthing, and your assumption should be that any single unresolved puzzle/clue could be the context or direction needed to solve something.

[Forblaze]

What do you want to happen when you solve a puzzle?

[kunou126]

Originally posted by ioan:

Reached antechamber? Too bad, there's no passage
Got inside antechamber? Here's useless key that opens god knows what
Used basement key? Too bad you drained a fountain instead of going down the elevator shaft, here's a dead end
Lit 4 fires? Here's lore dump, and guess what? Dead end
Solved puzzle in the crypt? Useless piece of map and dead end

4 Fires - Leads to a puzzle with a permanent power that is amazing. Solve it.

Here's my recommendation and it will change your life forever...
1) Always choose root cellar when it is available.
2) When you have root cellar, build to the right wall first and roll for the garden tile that makes all gardens cost zero gems.
3) After solving the puzzle under the 4 fires, choose the king's power and select green at the start of every day.
4) Find a shovel and dig up every dirt spot you can find.
5) If you successfully got #2 on your run, always pick the garden tile.

Do that and you will have more steps, keys, diamonds, and coins than you will ever know what to do with, and increase your chances greatly of getting into that antechamber.

[Plundy]

Plays a puzzle game. game doesn't have a guiding line from one objective to another or yellow paint. "must be a dead end with a useless item in the very obviously important chamber I just reached"

The absolute state of people these days. Don't play a puzzle game if you don't want to do any puzzles or look for clues to figure out what to do. Play slay the spire or something if you just want a roguelike card game.

[ioan]

Originally posted by Forblaze:

What do you want to happen when you solve a puzzle?

Some tangible lead that allows me to progress the path farther. No some 'clue' for the thing I have not even seen yet.

[Celebrim]

Originally posted by ioan:

Originally posted by Forblaze:

What do you want to happen when you solve a puzzle?

Some tangible lead that allows me to progress the path farther. No some 'clue' for the thing I have not even seen yet.

I would say the Basement Key matches those criteria exactly. It is a tangible item leading you to further progress on the path. I didn't know the thing it referred to even existed when I got it so I now knew where to go to progress.

Your other spoilers are similar but for reasons its probably too early in your progress to go into.

[ffrotty]

Originally posted by Celebrim:

Originally posted by ioan:

Some tangible lead that allows me to progress the path farther. No some 'clue' for the thing I have not even seen yet.

I would say the Basement Key matches those criteria exactly. It is a tangible item leading you to further progress on the path. I didn't know the thing it referred to even existed when I got it so I now knew where to go to progress.

Your other spoilers are similar but for reasons its probably too early in your progress to go into.

sorta/kinda since there are multiple doors unlocked with the basement key

[opticcon]

Yea I can't do math at the dartboard because I am an idiot so I lose a lot of stuff. Thankfully I got this game for family member and not for myself so they are enjoying it more then I do. All in good game.

[Forblaze]

Originally posted by ioan:

Some tangible lead that allows me to progress the path farther. No some 'clue' for the thing I have not even seen yet.

Everything you listed is that. Antechamber door is blocked? Well now you know you need to search for a way to open them.

Antechamber has an enigmatic key in it? Well now you need to know you need to search for a use for it.

Used the basement key in the fountain? Well now you know you need to figure out how to reach the boat.

This is really just what puzzle games are like. Puzzles are the reward for doing puzzles. Just like in call of duty, shooting people is generally a way to get to more people to shoot.

[PersonalC0ffee]

Originally posted by Plundy:

Plays a puzzle game. game doesn't have a guiding line from one objective to another or yellow paint. "must be a dead end with a useless item in the very obviously important chamber I just reached"

The absolute state of people these days. Don't play a puzzle game if you don't want to do any puzzles or look for clues to figure out what to do. Play slay the spire or something if you just want a roguelike card game.

Hell yah, not my thing but VERY good roguelike deckbuilder. It is like NL's baby.

[PersonalC0ffee]

Originally posted by ioan:

Originally posted by Forblaze:

What do you want to happen when you solve a puzzle?

Some tangible lead that allows me to progress the path farther. No some 'clue' for the thing I have not even seen yet.

So you take that clue, you note it down, you stash it away in the back of your head for later and press forward.

You are expecting the game to say HEY GO THIS WAY and in some very light ways it does but;

Ohhhh buddy, that AIN'T this game. You the player are expected to think, understand what you've been finding or reading and put it together yourself.

Alzara can help guide you, but ultimately you need to be exploring more and learning more.

You ain't even scratched the surface.

[ffrotty]

Originally posted by ioan:

Originally posted by Forblaze:

What do you want to happen when you solve a puzzle?

Some tangible lead that allows me to progress the path farther. No some 'clue' for the thing I have not even seen yet.

The irony here is how you're literally immersed in puzzles you don't even know are puzzles and they all give you a tangible lead.

The flipside of tangible leads are tangible brick walls, irrespective of order done.

You did X, got blocked by Y. OK, how do you pass Y? Is Y relevant immediately?

You are echoing what a lot of people's distaste for the game in general is: having these puzzles with varying level of immediacy coupled with the RNG aspect of the game.

You did a thing and your immediate roadblack might not be relevant or even doable for a long time.

But you'll just have to take people who've gone through it's word on it: if there are 100 threads/leads they all funnel to the same thing. The main friction is how randomly 10 of those 100 are huge, immediate gains of power/progression and the other 90 might be for a power gain dozens of hours away (or none at all).

Some of the answers are simple: "did you notice/look at/click on X"
others are more annoying: "did you notice/look at/click on X AFTER doing Y,Z,A,B,C++++"

[Badgerlord]

Originally posted by ioan:

Reached antechamber? Too bad, there's no passage
Got inside antechamber? Here's useless key that opens god knows what
Used basement key? Too bad you drained a fountain instead of going down the elevator shaft, here's a dead end
Lit 4 fires? Here's lore dump, and guess what? Dead end
Solved puzzle in the crypt? Useless piece of map and dead end

Reached Antechamber: That was step 1 gratz!
Got Inside Antechamber: That was step 2
Used Basement Key: You seem to have found where it goes so what's the issue?
Lit 4 Fires:Did you just skip past the rooms down there?
Solved puzzle in the Crypt: Again... step 1. You're in a puzzle game, where nearly every room has a puzzle. Perhaps that dead end room is not so dead after all.

My friend, you're in a puzzle game that has puzzles on top of it's puzzles. And you've barely scratched the surface. Getting into room 46 is quite literally just the first big step in a world of layered puzzles. Come back when you're trying to do some of the more ridiculous puzzles later! I'm on day 80 and I am only half way through one of the major meta puzzles that happens AFTER room 46. I have leads on other puzzles as well that I try to follow when the drafting works in my favor.

[br00f]

tfw the intricate puzzle game has intricate puzzles