Ammo

[The Seraph of Tomorrow]

Speaking bluntly, the fact weapons use more than one bullet to fire rather than just making ammo more scarce so you don't have to carry a ton of it is really annoying.

At the end of the day, I get why the devs did this as a balancing mechanic. Though to be fair, ammo consumption (Non-Artillery) is a rather unneeded aspect of the game for the player characters gun, even if they do want to keep it for the turrets.

[Black Raven]

Originally posted by The Seraph of Tomorrow:

Speaking bluntly, the fact weapons use more than one bullet to fire rather than just making ammo more scarce so you don't have to carry a ton of it is really annoying.

At the end of the day, I get why the devs did this as a balancing mechanic. Though to be fair, ammo consumption (Non-Artillery) is a rather unneeded aspect of the game for the player characters gun, even if they do want to keep it for the turrets.

It much more of a energy meter than a bullet count

[The Seraph of Tomorrow]

Originally posted by Black Raven:

Originally posted by The Seraph of Tomorrow:

Speaking bluntly, the fact weapons use more than one bullet to fire rather than just making ammo more scarce so you don't have to carry a ton of it is really annoying.

At the end of the day, I get why the devs did this as a balancing mechanic. Though to be fair, ammo consumption (Non-Artillery) is a rather unneeded aspect of the game for the player characters gun, even if they do want to keep it for the turrets.

It much more of a energy meter than a bullet count

I was referring more to the player than the turrets, the fact that one shot costs 10 to 30 ammo is pretty absurd.

[HalyconShade]

Originally posted by The Seraph of Tomorrow:

Speaking bluntly, the fact weapons use more than one bullet to fire rather than just making ammo more scarce so you don't have to carry a ton of it is really annoying.

At the end of the day, I get why the devs did this as a balancing mechanic. Though to be fair, ammo consumption (Non-Artillery) is a rather unneeded aspect of the game for the player characters gun, even if they do want to keep it for the turrets.

I see no issue here. Early/Mid it's annoying, late its a non-issue. But then again, I've been told I'm using the wrong gun, so who knows :D

[Schalimah]

Actually the current implementation is much better balanced.
If you make ammo rarer and make any shot only cost one ammo, it would make high damage per round builds even better and high fire rate builds worse.
I'll gladly take it...
Chain only costing 1 instead of 130 would be very welcome.
Heavy with mods costing 1 instead of 30+...
But you could say goodby to Light, Spray or Focus.

Just don't look at the ammo display in the UI.
Instead use the counter on the back of your gun.

[HalyconShade]

Originally posted by Schalimah:

Actually the current implementation is much better balanced.
If you make ammo rarer and make any shot only cost one ammo, it would make high damage per round builds even better and high fire rate builds worse.
I'll gladly take it...
Chain only costing 1 instead of 130 would be very welcome.
Heavy with mods costing 1 instead of 30+...
But you could say goodby to Light, Spray or Focus.

Just don't look at the ammo display in the UI.
Instead use the counter on the back of your gun.

Although I have chain on my 2nd for the never yet happened "oh ♥♥♥♥" moment, my primary one shots everything on c5 - obviously not the bosses etc but everything on the maps.

I have no issue with the gun mods as they stand, but perhaps I am missing something?

[The Seraph of Tomorrow]

Originally posted by Schalimah:

Actually the current implementation is much better balanced.
If you make ammo rarer and make any shot only cost one ammo, it would make high damage per round builds even better and high fire rate builds worse.
I'll gladly take it...
Chain only costing 1 instead of 130 would be very welcome.
Heavy with mods costing 1 instead of 30+...
But you could say goodby to Light, Spray or Focus.

Just don't look at the ammo display in the UI.
Instead use the counter on the back of your gun.

As many users I have read say, ammo acquisition is not really an issue in the game. It's more so just a micro-management aspect of the game that eats time up until the late game. I do not believe any balancing is really needed for ammo consumption except for higher costs based around special features such as the Alt-Firing modes that add explosives, multi shot attacks, and the sort. Your basic semi-auto sniper build is balanced around the slow fire rate, and the full auto builds do less damage.

In summary, I do not think ammo should be factored into balancing and ammo costs should be realistic. Though I can see a few exceptions in terms of special fire modes where it should for the player.

[The Seraph of Tomorrow]

Originally posted by Legion:

Originally posted by The Seraph of Tomorrow:

Speaking bluntly, the fact weapons use more than one bullet to fire rather than just making ammo more scarce so you don't have to carry a ton of it is really annoying.

At the end of the day, I get why the devs did this as a balancing mechanic. Though to be fair, ammo consumption (Non-Artillery) is a rather unneeded aspect of the game for the player characters gun, even if they do want to keep it for the turrets.

I see no issue here. Early/Mid it's annoying, late its a non-issue. But then again, I've been told I'm using the wrong gun, so who knows :D

It's not exactly an issue since ammo is plentiful, it's just something I have found to be annoying. Kinda grinds my gears that a gun costs ten ammo or more to fire, just on the principle of it.

180 rounds at 10 a shot is 18 rounds, which screws with the math of knowing what is in my mag if the number is not even.

[HalyconShade]

Originally posted by The Seraph of Tomorrow:

Originally posted by Legion:

I see no issue here. Early/Mid it's annoying, late its a non-issue. But then again, I've been told I'm using the wrong gun, so who knows :D

It's not exactly an issue since ammo is plentiful, it's just something I have found to be annoying. Kinda grinds my gears that a gun costs ten ammo or more to fire, just on the principle of it.

180 rounds at 10 a shot is 18 rounds, which screws with the math of knowing what is in my mag if the number is not even.

Totally agree with this when u can load a turret with 1k from the same box. Seems kinda dumb.

[Elvi]

I know it wll sound offensive, even if not meant to be, but if you think ammo is unimportant aspect of the game, you just didn't play enough of the game just yet.

Anyhow, with the PC you always have the choice between plentifull shots or few powerful or "special" shots. Both works, honestly.
It goes 1:1 to the minigun, 1:20 to make 30mm ammo, 1:? when it comes to player. Rapid small caliber takes 1:2, firing magnetic rockets might take 1:50. I think it makes sense as compared to having dozens of ammo types you have to get.

[Riktor87]

Originally posted by Elvi:

I think it makes sense as compared to having dozens of ammo types you have to get.

This, this is the whole reason why I actually like the universal / modular system in place over "do I have enough 9mm, am I almost out out of 7.62, did I remember to bring my rockets for my launcher". While on the outside it might seem kind of "dumbed down" since yeah a rifle wouldn't in reality just magically shoot a rocket, I look at it more as a "gamey" aspect, which at the end of the day it's a game, it doesn't have to be grounded in realities physics. Only thing I have to ask myself in this one is ,do I have bullets? if yes I can shoot, if no, go find bullets. If I need to know how many shots are left in my magazine for the weapon / skill im using, I use the indicator on the gun, and use the lower hud counter to know If I need to go grab another box of rounds or not.

[Elvi]

Originally posted by Riktor87:

Originally posted by Elvi:

I think it makes sense as compared to having dozens of ammo types you have to get.

This, this is the whole reason why I actually like the universal / modular system in place over "do I have enough 9mm, am I almost out out of 7.62, did I remember to bring my rockets for my launcher". While on the outside it might seem kind of "dumbed down" since yeah a rifle wouldn't in reality just magically shoot a rocket, I look at it more as a "gamey" aspect, which at the end of the day it's a game, it doesn't have to be grounded in realities physics. Only thing I have to ask myself in this one is ,do I have bullets? if yes I can shoot, if no, go find bullets. If I need to know how many shots are left in my magazine for the weapon / skill im using, I use the indicator on the gun, and use the lower hud counter to know If I need to go grab another box of rounds or not.

I know, especially with how modular the weapons are (especially the character's). You can have quick-fire mashine gun that hans 500 round per box, or maybe you want to have that ".50mg" rifle that just devastate whatever it touches at 40 round a box? And the best part, you can have both at the same time. It just makes sense to make it X per box, where box is 100 resources.

Ammo types makes sense in, say, survival games or Fallout, but in a game where you go through thosands every minute, modular ammo is the way to go, unless you want to make it very annoying,

I mean, sure we can argue whether 30mm shell is really the 4 times 5.56mm or 5 times the 5mm ammo and such, but ultimately, what is the alternative unless you want this to go full 4X game with establishing factories and logistical routes to deliver for that 1 oout of 75 turrets you have? No, just produce a ammo material box and split it into points per bullet.

[Black Raven]

Originally posted by The Seraph of Tomorrow:

Originally posted by Black Raven:

It much more of a energy meter than a bullet count

I was referring more to the player than the turrets, the fact that one shot costs 10 to 30 ammo is pretty absurd.

So was I, it like a energy meter as opposed to a bullet count.

Different fire modes draw different energy for different fire modes.

would made more sense if they called them power packs rather than ammo packs etc, do to design of the game.