traction etc on/off thing?

[Amorphos_Z]

so as with many games, you turn off traction and stability controls, like its some big secret which everyone knows tho. just have the damn things on for everyone permanently and for everything!
why do games do shiz like this?

[iX-Grimjow-Xi]

keep away from rwd irl cause you suck at driving i dont need no stinking traction control or stability control. Dont force it on anyone if you want it on keep in on weakling. And Git Gud lol

[kireta]

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

what is it that i am not understanding

What traction control actually does. It detects loss of traction of wheels, and slows them down to regain grip. Loss of traction can happen from various reasons, usually combination of slippery surface and driver who doesn't take it into consideration.

So driver adds too much gas, breaks traction, and onboard system detects it and forcefully slows wheels down to restore traction, hopefully before driver loses control.
It will help you keep control over a car, but because it kicks in on slip, it will slow you down regardless if you're in control or not, hindering maneuvers that include purposely breaking traction.

Traction control is only beneficial if car is too fast or too difficult to drive for you. If you have traction control on, when you can handle car without it, you're slowing yourself down for no good reason.

[No suggestions]

Escrito originalmente por kireta:

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

what is it that i am not understanding

What traction control actually does. It detects loss of traction of wheels, and slows them down to regain grip. Loss of traction can happen from various reasons, usually combination of slippery surface and driver who doesn't take it into consideration.

So driver adds too much gas, breaks traction, and onboard system detects it and forcefully slows wheels down to restore traction, hopefully before driver loses control.
It will help you keep control over a car, but because it kicks in on slip, it will slow you down regardless if you're in control or not, hindering maneuvers that include purposely breaking traction.

Traction control is only beneficial if car is too fast or too difficult to drive for you. If you have traction control on, when you can handle car without it, you're slowing yourself down for no good reason.

Spot on.

[Patroh]

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

my objection is thus; yesterday i tried pvp with assists off, kept doing 360's. so i would have to retune some of my vehicles for pvp with traction on [so they dont spin all the time], and then have to retune them with assists off for offline races and festival races [the ones not pvp required].

what is it that i am not understanding?

Well... Since you disabled assists for PvP, you understand that assists don't give you an advantage but merely help you stabilize your car (jn exchange for being slower) because you're having troubles doing it yourself, as evidenced by the results of "keeping doing 360s".

What can be concluded is that you're expecting every car to handle decently on full throttle, which isn't the case even IRL and/or your "assist off" tunes aren't exactly right (weight transfer issues? Differential?). Frankly, I would never attempt tuning cars with traction and stability set to on. That way you will never know your car's limits.

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

maybe i should just keep assists off and retune everything, and contend with the horrible and unrealistic handling?

Yes but not without proper tuning knowledge. Your issues may also come from improper ARB, spring rate, differential and, especially, damping tuning as well as not picking proper parts. Pretty sure thats the case and assists merely correct your mistakes.

I was once in a similar situation with Forza Horizon 4. Through most of my playtime I had "steering" set to "normal". Once I set it to "simulation" I've started experiencing a sudden loss of grip when going uphill or when landing. Guess what - it was the bump setting being set too low. NEVER before had I experienced anything like it because this particular setting simply corrected the issue for me but in exchange of having every car respond slower, which isn't desirable.

I see where are you coming from but assists aren't the only things to consider.

What about input method? Keyboard being the worst one, forcing you to either have traction control on or at least manual shifting if you don't want to have your RWDs spin out. Neither tapping is ideal.
How about those "auto" assists?
Driveline? Braking line being particular useful.
Shifting? Automatic gearbox is by far the worst as it shifts before redline, often hurting your powerband potential, resulting in a slower car.

[Amorphos_Z]

i don't mind, have it on or off, just not both. on is what real racers do as far as i know from google. is there a way to switch it off for pvp too? edit; i mean w/o doing 360 lol

i am a forza noob, ....need to know is all. didn't play fh4

the cars act differently on pvp, no? so surely if you tune with them off then they will handle differently once on pvp ~ with them on.

[kireta]

Driving assists used in racing behave differently from all-purpose assists you find on street cars (and Forza). They are specifically designed for track racing, to be used by race cars and race drivers, who obviously can drive hella lot better than some Mike who just bought S197 Mustang and never drove anything faster than Miata before.

[n3mes1s]

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

so as with many games, you turn off traction and stability controls, like its some big secret which everyone knows tho. just have the damn things on for everyone permanently and for everything!
why do games do shiz like this?

Sorry i dont understand anything at all lol. What is your complain? those are simulation additions for people who want a little more challenge and simulation feeling in the game. Whats your problem?

And NO. They shouldnt be on, because you know, some people like to play with some things turned on and others off. If it bothers this so much, you should stop playing videogames lol.

[Patroh]

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

on is what real racers do as far as i know from google. is there a way to switch it off for pvp too?

Forza Horizon isn't trying to simulate this. Those assists exist with inexperienced players in mind, as they're meant to help where player isn't experienced enough to handle certain steering aspects themselves.
Those assists could potentially benefit selected power builds, but anything regular will be slowed down to adjust for player's erratic driving.

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

the cars act differently on pvp, no? so surely if you tune with them off then they will handle differently once on pvp ~ with them on.

No. No matter what mode you play, the game's driving model remains exactly the same, hence why I mentioned the remaining assist because you can have them enabled in any mode, including PvP. The only thing that changes is Drivatar difficulty in Seasonal Championships.

However, if you opt to use traction/stability assist in PvP, expect very few player-made tunes that take those assists into consideration. Your rivals most likely aren't using assists, so expect to be slower among them.

[No suggestions]

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

i don't mind, have it on or off, just not both. on is what real racers do as far as i know from google.

"real racers" don't have them on in game OR in real life. Not sure which limited edition google you've been using.

[Vimpster]

If you do not like the handling with the assists turned off what is stopping you from always keeping them on? At what point in the game does it ever force you to have them off?

Personally I prefer it off. Not because I think it gives me an edge, in fact I'm sure I would drive better with it on, but I enjoy the feeling and challenge of the car with the settings off. I like to spin my wheels if I want to.

[Staquix]

Traction control is never really off in this game. You can lessen the effect by truing it off but there is always TCC present.

I hate that the game penalizes you for using these assists. It's not realistic to tell a race car driver that there prize money will be less for having assists on. "Get out there and be less safe on the track and we will give you more money" said no one. Most race cars and super cars have TCC on now IRL so why the cut on the prize money?

[Ratch]

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

my objection is thus; yesterday i tried pvp with assists off, kept doing 360's.

what is it that i am not understanding?

How to drive coherently. lmao

[Quillithe]

Wait, do people really play this game with stability control on? Traction control sure, it's much easier to drive high power rwd cards with it on, but stability control? The racing's arcade-style enough that with traction control on you really need to work to lose control of your car that badly and it really slows you down.

[Amorphos_Z]

ah i see, so stability off but traction on! i had both off hence doing a 360.
i don't mind them both off on freedrive, i make my own tunes so its not a problem.

[Quillithe]

Escrito originalmente por Amorphos_Z:

ah i see, so stability off but traction on! i had both off hence doing a 360.
i don't mind them both off on freedrive, i make my own tunes so its not a problem.

You can drive with both off, but if you're driving a RWD you need to be very gentle on the accelerator at low speeds, otherwise the power of your engine breaks traction on the rear wheels and then, well...