is this game p2w? is it f2p? what does that mean

[Hormesis]

the answer is no to both and here's why

in order for a game to be considered p2w it would need to fulfill the winning condition for all players through monetary transactions. however not everyone has the same winning conditions. as a consumer i choose to purchase a game based largely on the entertainment value i'll receive as a result of said transaction. the more time i'm entertained by the use of that purchase, the greater the value. furthermore, the metric by which i measure if i'm "winning" exists independent of other players. so if i'm ahead or behind other people in the pursuit of their winning conditions, is irrelevant. for me to "win" in a game i need only receive sufficient cognitive stimulation over a sufficient period of time. by purchasing items that can be received through normal game play i actually decrease the value the game can offer thereby creating a losing condition.

so no, this game is not p2w for me and as a result the game ITSELF cannot be considered p2w. but for those out there competing in a pissing contest w/ random nerds online, it very well could be.

it's also not f2p, and no game is actually free. sure in a monetary sense a game can be considered free, however it will cost you time, the most precision resource you'll ever be given or you'll ever spend. the people who think they are playing this game for free, are deluded.

[wespe___o=/;;;:*]

TLDR: you need money for 1-time-purchases and monthly subscription to enjoy (as other F2P)

[Rikki-Tikki-Tavi]

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

it's also not f2p, and no game is actually free. sure in a monetary sense a game can be considered free, however it will cost you time, the most precision resource you'll ever be given or you'll ever spend. the people who think they are playing this game for free, are deluded.

Totally agree with you

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

for me to "win" in a game i need only receive sufficient cognitive stimulation over a sufficient period of time.

So if you pay for a pet or inventory space and enjoying the game, then it' P2W according to your criteria, right? :)

[Taiji]

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi の投稿を引用：

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

for me to "win" in a game i need only receive sufficient cognitive stimulation over a sufficient period of time.

So if you pay for a pet or inventory space and enjoying the game, then it' P2W according to your criteria, right? :)

Just like going to the cinema is P2W

[Rikki-Tikki-Tavi]

Taiji の投稿を引用：

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi の投稿を引用：

So if you pay for a pet or inventory space and enjoying the game, then it' P2W according to your criteria, right? :)

Just like going to the cinema is P2W

Exactly!

But if seriously, I think that term "P2W" just doesn't make sense in such context, it's a term only from competitive point of view. And well, it has P2W elements due buying legendary items from auction (which usually cost really a lot, by the way) or buying resistance orbs, for example. But I think it still can be more or less competitive, you don't really need legendary items for claiming high in the ladder, skill still matters a lot in boss fights.

[Noobgtx980]

You wanna soil your pc with funky rootkits ? Go ahead. Oh and its also major p2w.

[Taiji]

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi の投稿を引用：

Taiji の投稿を引用：

Just like going to the cinema is P2W

Exactly!

But if seriously, I think that term "P2W" just doesn't make sense in such context, it's a term only from competitive point of view. And well, it has P2W elements due buying legendary items from auction (which usually cost really a lot, by the way) or buying resistance orbs, for example. But I think it still can be more or less competitive, you don't really need legendary items for claiming high in the ladder, skill still matters a lot in boss fights.

I think this game is either competitive, because a player decides they want to compete, or not competitive at all.

And yeah, the leaderboards are just for folks who want to compete over an abstract measure and on an uneven playing field. Serious gamers would compete over boss killing times with the same gear - Because they ONLY care about skill.

[😎Astran😾]

The game isn't f2p because cosmetic costumes are so good that you cannot play without buying at least one.

[Hormesis]

wespe___o=/:* の投稿を引用：

TLDR: you need money for 1-time-purchases and monthly subscription to enjoy (as other F2P) :D:

you clearly didn't read (or comprehend) it, unless your point was to illustrate your prejudice on what constitutes a reasonable monetary investment to maximize the value you get from the game. in which case you nailed it

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi の投稿を引用：

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

it's also not f2p, and no game is actually free. sure in a monetary sense a game can be considered free, however it will cost you time, the most precision resource you'll ever be given or you'll ever spend. the people who think they are playing this game for free, are deluded.

Totally agree with you

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

for me to "win" in a game i need only receive sufficient cognitive stimulation over a sufficient period of time.

So if you pay for a pet or inventory space and enjoying the game, then it' P2W according to your criteria, right? :)

it's an investment, much like everything. if you feel you save 5 minutes of time every hour by having a pet and you play the game for 100 hours then you've saved 500 minutes of time, or about 8 1/3 hours. now how much do you value an hour? pets go for 400 rubies i believe. that's 8 dollars. do you value your time at 1 dollar an hour or more? if so then it's an investment that increases the value of the game greater than the initial investment and therefore is NOT a p2w mechanic. it's what we call, a wise investment. if any game that required any investment of time or money would be considered p2w, then every single game every created is pay to win. it's that relationship between cost and return that ultimately determines if a game is p2w. unless ofc you place no value on your time whatsoever and are just waiting to be lying on your deathbed regretting the way you lived your life.

Taiji の投稿を引用：

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi の投稿を引用：

So if you pay for a pet or inventory space and enjoying the game, then it' P2W according to your criteria, right? :)

Just like going to the cinema is P2W

again. if any investment of time or money is considered a p2w mechanic, why even bother bringing it up to begin with. it has to be that relationship between what you as a person value and the cost it requires to fulfill it that ultimately determines if it's p2w. if my goal is to beat all 10 acts faster than everyone else and i'm competing against other like-thinking people then you've created a p2w scenario. only way i'll fulfill the requirements i've manifested as a variable to win, is through large quantities of cash flow. but that's on me, expecting everyone to have those same values, leading me to label the game as p2w is prejudicial.

Taiji の投稿を引用：

Rikki-Tikki-Tavi の投稿を引用：

Exactly!

But if seriously, I think that term "P2W" just doesn't make sense in such context, it's a term only from competitive point of view. And well, it has P2W elements due buying legendary items from auction (which usually cost really a lot, by the way) or buying resistance orbs, for example. But I think it still can be more or less competitive, you don't really need legendary items for claiming high in the ladder, skill still matters a lot in boss fights.

I think this game is either competitive, because a player decides they want to compete, or not competitive at all.

And yeah, the leaderboards are just for folks who want to compete over an abstract measure and on an uneven playing field. Serious gamers would compete over boss killing times with the same gear - Because they ONLY care about skill.

this

Astran の投稿を引用：

The game isn't f2p because cosmetic costumes are so good that you cannot play without buying at least one.

lul. for me getting a new pet was a must. watching that chubby thing following me around all the time was pretty irritating.

[wespe___o=/;;;:*]

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

...you nailed it

I know
As a Casher myself, I really hate players that lie about the advantages. There is no real competition between Cashers and F2P (exceptions are below 1% and involve "grey methods" as a bare minimum)

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

...it's an investment that increases the value of the game greater than the initial investment and therefore is NOT a p2w mechanic. it's what we call, a wise investment. if any game that required any investment of time or money would be considered p2w, then every single game every created is pay to win. it's that relationship between cost and return that ultimately determines if a game is p2w...
...
again. if any investment of time or money is considered a p2w mechanic, why even bother bringing it up to begin with. it has to be that relationship between what you as a person value and the cost it requires to fulfill it that ultimately determines if it's p2w. if my goal is to beat all 10 acts faster than everyone else and i'm competing against other like-thinking people then you've created a p2w scenario. only way i'll fulfill the requirements i've manifested as a variable to win, is through large quantities of cash flow. but that's on me, expecting everyone to have those same values, leading me to label the game as p2w is prejudicial.

Your logic has flaws - as few as swiss cheese

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

...Serious gamers would compete over boss killing times with the same gear - Because they ONLY care about skill.

WHAT? So millions of gamers are not serious? seems you never played any big MMORPG in last 20 years..

[Taiji]

wespe___o=/:* の投稿を引用：

Your logic has flaws - as few as swiss cheese

Ah yes, Swiss cheese, famous for it's 'flaws'

[Hormesis]

Taiji の投稿を引用：

wespe___o=/:* の投稿を引用：

Your logic has flaws - as few as swiss cheese

Ah yes, Swiss cheese, famous for it's 'flaws'

there's a language barrier. i've recognized it several times. he seems bright enough, i just think either his grasp of the language or his translator needs a bit of work.

[wespe___o=/;;;:*]

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

Taiji の投稿を引用：

Ah yes, Swiss cheese, famous for it's 'flaws'

there's a language barrier. i've recognized it several times. he seems bright enough, i just think either his grasp of the language or his translator needs a bit of work.

maybe you shouldn´t have stopped after highschool.. well, I´m sorry If you´re hispanic, otherwise not. You´re grasping at straws.. trying hard to make a case, yet fail

[Lady von Titz]

After playing for 4ish hours I bought one entry level pack at 78% percent discount [8.99GBP], I got more loot space, access to single outfit, head gear and weapon skin, loads of in game crafting bells and whistles and that's enough for me, so far I've got 11hrs+ of enjoyment out of the game I've done the same with PoE, Star Trek Online, Lost Ark throwing a few quid at it for getting me several hours of game play out of them thankfully this game doesn't reek of p2w also this game throws gear/item rewards at me for: game time, completing objectives, 100% map/area exploration, daily and monthly sign in.

Gotta say.... the the number of folks being banned for simply buying in game gems/currency then being blanked by the devs like a pariah when trying defend themselves seems to occur with worrying regularity.

[Hormesis]

wespe___o=/:* の投稿を引用：

iTriHard の投稿を引用：

there's a language barrier. i've recognized it several times. he seems bright enough, i just think either his grasp of the language or his translator needs a bit of work.

maybe you shouldn´t have stopped after highschool.. well, I´m sorry If you´re hispanic, otherwise not. You´re grasping at straws.. trying hard to make a case, yet fail

i apologize. wasn't trying to be mean. guess it's just a difference in where we grew up. some of the things you write seem foreign to me so i assumed a language gap.

y no, soy no latino, pero comprendo much en espanol y un poco en portuguese.

[gamingmikan]

The definition of P2W has changed or evolved in the past 15 years.
Back then, anything that gave extra stats or had an advantage over others that sold in the cash shop would instantly be called P2W.

But that's not the case now.
Now everyone has their own definition of P2W, especially young generation gamers.
Instead of P2W, they called it pay for convenience or pay to fast.

As for whether is this game P2W or not, is solely up to the individual to decide.