Follow up to Mimimi Games.

[リアンダ]

Heyo does any of you guys know whether or not the minds behind Mimimi games have started working up on a follow up project? Maybe a kickstarter or a new studio? I'm starved for RTT.

[Bertie]

No, however you may wish to check out Sumerian Six or Commandos Origins if you want something similar.

[リアンダ]

Originally posted by Bertie:

No, however you may wish to check out Sumerian Six or Commandos Origins if you want something similar.

Damn shame. Just continued to play Shadow Gambit yesterday and I was hoping they would do something similar on a smaller scale. I downloaded the Commandos Origins demo (haven't tried it yet) but I was completely unaware of Summerian Six (which looks absolutely dope). Thanks a ton for the recommendation! <3

[Hollow]

I'd recommend the Thief 1 + 2 games. They're graphically dated BUT the gameplay is really good. They're not like Shadow Tactics etc., as you play only one character in ego perspective but they're essentially also games about taking out guards, avoiding alerts, avoiding being noticed and trying to stay hidden. Thief 1 sticks more to mystic content than the thief theme and the difficulty is higher than in Thief 2, which sticks much more to the thief theme and can be played without spoiling or requiring any story from Thief 1. If you can forgive the graphics then you get 2 gems to play. I'd recommend to check the forums because the community has built patches and tools that supply the games with some improvements.

For games like the Mimimi ones there's also Commandos 2 (avoid the HD version - it's a bad modernized version of the original game with technical flaws no one cares to fix, removed content and removed gameplay features) and Desperados (the first one). Especially Commandos 2 offers a ton of gameplay options which need to be learned first (keyboard hotkeys), including structure interiors, vehicles and an inventory for each character for a set of items they can use or just transport for another character.

Some games that no one ever talks about:
On topic - stealth & taking out enemies:
Mark of the Ninja - 2D side-scrolling game: sneak around, take out enemies (ninja style)
Attack of the Earthlings - turn-based missions in which you've to take out enemies

Off topic - unique game:
The Talos Principle - 3D puzzle game (solutions are about understanding, timing, object arrangement; in case you get stuck there are youtube videos for everything); story (existential debate) entirely optional, multiple endings and easter eggs; comfy world and music; some 3D puzzles can't only be solved in the intended way but also allow for some outside the box tinkering

Off topic - exploration, story, crafting, character upgrades:
DEX - pretty immersive dystopian cyberpunk game that gets somewhat bad towards the end but otherwise good
Aquaria - a big, big world, some resource gathering and boss fights that you won't win with button-mashing but by understanding and handling the boss mechanics right (watch a youtube video if you get stuck); mostly for exploration; has some difficulty spikes

Off topic - Immersive horror games:
Alien Isolation - lacks proper anti alias; some people have an issue with the rubber-banding of the Alien (always close by) against which a the "unpredictable alien" mod was created, others prefer it that way
Mortuary Assistant - an indie title with a lot of work put into it; you're working in a mortuary, trying not to get possessed by a demon that causes more and more reality break-down; find the possessed body and burn it but to do so you also need to discover the demon's name and place it in the right symbol-sequence for the object you attach to the body before the burning

Off topic - challenging city builders:
They are Billions - start in the middle of a zombie-invested map that you have to clear to get access to vital resources and build space, but don't be too loud or you'll attract many more zombies than you can fight off (early game); after some time single zombies and than ever-increasing amounts will swarm from outside the map towards your base, so you'll ALWAYS need to secure the entrances with towers, guards and ideally also some scouting ahead; has a campaign in which you unlock tech bit by bit by earning teach points by completing missions of which 3 types exist: regular map with regular gameplay; hero missions in which you only control your hero through a zombie-infested area and need to find artifacts and zombie swarm attack missions in which you need to defend your single tower with your army against zombies coming from all directions; also has community maps, challenge maps, randomized maps as alternative to the campaign and A LOT of diffilculty settings ranging from very easy to apocalyptic difficulty
Against the Storm - an extremely challenging game designed for very long progress; lots of resources and the catch is that you get random structures each mission, which you need to make use of and convert resources into what you need; there are also 3 races of which you get 2-3 randomly per mission, with their primary difference being how joyful or fearful they are and that when working at certain structures they either grant a chance to increase production or become more joyful; has after-mission rewards that can be used to unlock permantent bonus effects, many of those tiny bonus effects that keep stacking up, others gameplay defining unlocks
For both of these games maps can take hours.

Off topic - space combat and good story (only available on GoG):
Wing Commander 3 & 4: Both solid games that allow you to adjust your difficulty and even cheat any time you want to. Story decisions are often meaningful. Graphically a bit dated but otherwise okay. Flying with mouse or keyboard is not recommended though. There are also youtube videos about both games because they had more story cutscenes in them than some movies have.

[superdamokles]

Destructive Creations just released 63 Days. I really liked the patched War Mongrels. With two stealth games now they seem to have evolved from their Hatred/IS Defense trolling phase to become the next Mimimi (and if that is important for you: they will never hire SBI).

[Bertie]

I don't think Destructive Creations will become the next Mimimi - the games just aren't polished enough. War Mongrels was a buggy mess, but by the time they fixed it they'd lost any traction (seem to remember it was about a year). 63 days is better, but it's still not great and still sometimes feels like you're fighting against the game. It's only been out 3 weeks and the player count has already dropped to almost the same level as the first game. Add that to the fact that the genre is dying (unless Commandos Origins does something special) and I can't see them releasing another game in the series.

[リアンダ]

Originally posted by superdamokles:

Destructive Creations just released 63 Days. I really liked the patched War Mongrels. With two stealth games now they seem to have evolved from their Hatred/IS Defense trolling phase to become the next Mimimi (and if that is important for you: they will never hire SBI).

That's interesting, I didn't know they worked on hatred. I figured they were probably quite the edgy boys considering the character designs and general feel of the game. I've already downloaded the demos to give them a try.

[リアンダ]

Originally posted by Hollow:

I'd recommend the Thief 1 + 2 games. They're graphically dated BUT the gameplay is really good.

I played thief one just two weeks ago but unfortunately it didn't really hook me. It just felt too clunky for me to enjoy. But if you enjoy stealth and smoother controls maybe check out Blood West if you haven't.

Originally posted by Hollow:

Commandos 2

Commandos 1 was my first RTT game ever. Love at first sight.

Originally posted by Hollow:

Mark of the Ninja - 2D side-scrolling game: sneak around, take out enemies (ninja style)
Attack of the Earthlings - turn-based missions in which you've to take out enemies

The latter looks realyl fun.

Originally posted by Hollow:

The Talos Principle - 3D puzzle game (solutions are about understanding, timing, object arrangement;

I stillc an'tz believe that the guys working on Serious Sam of all things have also created this masterpiece of a puzzle game. Need to check out the sequel on of these days.

Originally posted by Hollow:

Off topic - exploration, story, crafting, character upgrades:

I ususally don't care about graphics at all but when it comes to exploration I generally enjoy more elaborate setpieces like you'd see in Subnautica for example. What makes Dex/Aquaria special in your mind?

Originally posted by Hollow:

Alien Isolation

The only stealth horror game I like more than this is Amnesia The Bunker.

Originally posted by Hollow:

Mortuary Assistant

This one made me scream like a little girl more than once. It's a masterclass of how less if more. One of the creepiest games I have ever played (the creepiest is probably "From the Darkness"

Originally posted by Hollow:

They are Billions -

Would love to play this one but it barely ever seems to be on sale. Is it worth the 30 USD price tag?

Originally posted by Hollow:

Against the Storm

I have wishlisted this one for ages. I think I was waiting for it to leave Early Access. A roguelike citybuilder sounds likea fantastic concept.

Originally posted by Hollow:

Wing Commander 3 & 4:

I'm unfortunately not a fligth sim guy. The only "flight sim" I play is Subnautica if you want to call it that. oh and rogue squadron back in the late 90s.

Thanks for the many fun suggestions you made and taking the time to type them all out. You have a great taste in the games you enjoy.

[Hollow]

Dex / Aquaria:
Aquaria has lots of area to explore and travel and unravels the story slowly. Its resource- and powerup system is designed around singing (activates special effects or allows interaction with certain beings of the sea) and cooking (gather items, cook into useful bonus items via recipes you learned). The bosses are special, as they need to be understood, not button-mashed to death.
Dex has a really good atmosphere, although the gameplay becomes somewhat bad during the end (probably rushed). Many modern games build their world but don't really use it but Dex makes really integrates it into the game, on a gameplay and story level. You get a lot of freedom in this and there's much to find (items and story), plus its DLC is free (3 extra suits for late game with special powers to adapt to a specific playstyle you prefer). You can upgrade your body with extra implants that you can swap in and out to make use of certain features when you need them, but that's mostly relevant for exploration and combat.

They are Billions: It's a challenging "claim areas for build space and resources from zombies and then defend them against incoming random (unannounced) and announced zombie waves game. It has a campaign, randomized maps, community maps. Ignore the price and buy on a sale IF it interests you. There's also a map editor (Steam version only, GoG version lacks it). Imo if it interests you then it's hard to make a wrong choice with this: If you don't like the campaign you can play the random maps. If you don't like those you can play the challenge maps. If you don't like those you can play community maps. If you don't like those you can use the map editor to create your own maps and alter unit stats. What's fun about it is trying to create the perfect fortress against a final zombie swarm on a given map and all the zombie swarms before. Ideally you want to expand fast to the resources you need but also keep things guarded against random incoming zombies, either alone or in waves. The various unit types and defense structures all have their special use. Only mutants feel like a player trap, as they're overpriced, underpowered and only good at things other units already cover. Energy is a problem in the game's economy, as you can only build "wind mills" to gather that, and those need to be in a certain distance from another (in all directions). They're the main limiting factor when building advanced houses that provide more workers and taxes but also drain more energy. What the campaign doesn't tell you: You get 10.000 tech points max to unlock things in your tech tree. 11.000 after completing the final mission. Since the game lacks a planner for the tech tree someone created one that lacks a 'save tech tree' function: https://institution.github.io/they-are-billions-tech-tree/

Against the Storm: The genius concept about this game is that you can min-max and micro-manage a lot in the game, keeping you busy, and that it's also randomized a great deal with traders, random construction blueprints (aside from basic you always have), what newcomers you get per year (what species with their traits & needs, amount and types of resources they bring), what cornerstones (permanent bonus effects) you get and what's inside the glades you can explore (risk & reward inside). It has a lot of long play value and can get really extreme in one way or the other. Because the game is very complex but also has one of the best UIs I've ever seen there's a lot of UI info to get into though. A youtuber, named RonEmpire has a lot of useful UI hints in this video. Although its length may be kind of a turn off it's highly recommended to watch the entire thing to get infos about features that were patched into the game later and that its tutorial lacks.

[LeftPaw]

I have all of their games and loved them all. The only reason I don't own this one is because of their involvement with certain party's. Yet, I will pick it up and play it someday.
What I will say is that it's a darn shame, these dev's knew their stuff when it came to game development and were one in and million. So sad to see them go. Their wonderful games shall live on though.

[wicked lester]

Originally posted by Bertie:

I don't think Destructive Creations will become the next Mimimi

Artificer seems more likely as Sumerian Six and Showgunners are both amazing. Fun af and I didn't notice a single bug (though I'm only about half way through S6.

[リアンダ]

Originally posted by wicked lester:

Originally posted by Bertie:

I don't think Destructive Creations will become the next Mimimi

Artificer seems more likely as Sumerian Six and Showgunners are both amazing. Fun af and I didn't notice a single bug (though I'm only about half way through S6.

I think wicked lester is right. Desperdados 3 has 9,9k reviews. It sold okay-ish but obviously not well enough for THQ to hold on to the studio which changed publishers after the release. Shadow Gambit has 3,6k reviews and the game caused the studio to close down mere days after its release. Summerian Six currently sits at a measily 613 reviews on steam with a production value comparable to the products Mimimi games created. So unless Summerian Six was some sort of Epic exclusive or gamepass exclusive during the initial weeks of its release I'm afraid there's 0 possibility Summerian Six has made money. The situation looks similarly dire for War Mongrels with 1,5k revierws thought this game doesn't look quite as polished and was made in Poland so they break even point may be comparatively low.

Either way I am concerned about the upcoming Commandos origins. If that game doesn't sell well then I'm afraid that the genre of RTT is dead as a whole. True, sustaineable successes in this genre are few and far between. Shadow Tactitcs is the last RTT success I can think of with 30k Steam reviews to this day. But as things currently stand I'm afraid there just isn't an audience there to justify the production of highly polished RTT games with high production value and realistic graphics. Maybe faux retro or a return to 2D isometric might save the genre by lowering production budgets and making these games sustaineable with a smaller customer base. Personally I wouldn't mind one bit if we returned to 2D, prerendered or maybe even handdrawn maps as long as the advancements in RTT gamedesign remain intact. But unfortunately I am not conident in the future of the genre.

/edit: Lookign really forward to Eriksholm but looking at the production value of thatz one, with it's AAA quality of cutscenes and environments I shudder to think of how many copies it will have to sell to break even. especially when considering that the Studio is located in Sweden where every employees cost about one sack of gold and a dozen semlor per day...

[Bertie]

Originally posted by リアンダ:

The situation looks similarly dire for War Mongrels with 1,5k revierws thought this game doesn't look quite as polished and was made in Poland so they break even point may be comparatively low.

They actually made a sequel (I say sequel, it was more of the same) which has performed worse than War Mongrels. Unfortunately it's of a similar quality and lacks polish.

https://steamdb.info/app/2202120/charts/

My guess would be that Commandos Origins will end up in the good but not fantastic score range. It's too close to the Mimimi style to satisfy those people who want it to go back to the original Commandos games, but it doesn't feel as polished as Shadow Tactics and co. Although I'd be happy to be proven wrong!

[リアンダ]

Originally posted by Bertie:

They actually made a sequel (I say sequel, it was more of the same) which has performed worse than War Mongrels. Unfortunately it's of a similar quality and lacks polish.

https://steamdb.info/app/2202120/charts/

Ouch. I don't care if this was developed in a polish potato cellar with the budget of a pack of cigaretts and a bottle of vodka. It's impossible this game has made money.

Originally posted by Bertie:

My guess would be that Commandos Origins will end up in the good but not fantastic score range. It's too close to the Mimimi style to satisfy those people who want it to go back to the original Commandos games, but it doesn't feel as polished as Shadow Tactics and co. Although I'd be happy to be proven wrong!

Commandos was my first experience with RTT so I think I'll buy the game even if it isn't overly polished.

[Spectrum Legacy]

Maybe this one could interest you (new game in 2D, made by the guys who did Blasphemous / the last door, etc).
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1309710/The_Stone_of_Madness/

[リアンダ]

Originally posted by Spectrum Legacy:

Maybe this one could interest you (new game in 2D, made by the guys who did Blasphemous / the last door, etc).
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1309710/The_Stone_of_Madness/

Oh this looks perfect, thank you for the recommendation :) I like the 2D styl quite a lot.