Overpriced DLCs?????

[AppleShy]

I was extremely excited for them, but this pricing is beyond unreasonable!!! From what is described I do not believe they have enough content to justify both of them together being almost the price of the full game.... of course, I haven't gotten them yet to fully judge (precisely because they're too expensive....)
I'm beyond disappointed.

[Lady Neravin]

Originally posted by Ap2000:

Originally posted by Lady Neravin:

Wrong thread??

lmao
Are you just trolling now or what?

If you only quote one sentence, from a two and a half week old post, that didn't stand on its own before, it is not that obvious what you are talking about.

All that apart, I stand by what I said

[Kildread]

Eh, I think it's worth the value. Yuki & Zagan both have unique skillsets and are usable across all maps. 6 missions per DLC, and it's a nice excuse to get back to getting the remaining badges I was missing.

All together, this game will have cost me roughly what a "regular" new title would cost on release. With the amount of hours I've spent with it so far, I've got a value of less than a single dollar per hour. That's better than most non-RPG games I've bought.

Like most things, you can hold off until a sale/bundle/whatever if you find it too costly.

Parsing through the thread, I'm always amazed at the mentality of 'knowing where the money goes'. Like it's any of our business, a steam user pays for the product/license to use said product, that's it. If the amount I paid goes to some dev/Mimimi former owner retirement fund, more power to 'em. The moment I paid it, it ain't mine no more --- and it's not like my ~40$ is a game changer to anyone.

[Lowlight]

I'm not buying the DLC simply because they didn't add Achievements for them. But with all add-ons, you choose your level of involvement and don't let anyone else tell you how to spend you time and money (unless they are legally obligated to).

[fourfourtwo79]

Originally posted by Kildread:

All together, this game will have cost me roughly what a "regular" new title would cost on release. With the amount of hours I've spent with it so far, I've got a value of less than a single dollar per hour. That's better than most non-RPG games I've bought.

Big RPG fan, but RPGs of course can be a bit notorious for a) promoting that "Dollar per hour" value. And b) padding that value with paste&copy content (trash combat, fetch quests, etc.). I whish this would change.... in particular since I've played quite a few RPGs that don't have the content to justify going that long. The original Fallout would have a real hard time nowadays, for all the wrong reasons.

Speaking about which, Mimimi added quite some grind for Shadow Gambit too, in particular achievements. You can finish the game with easily not having "completed" ~30% of it. But most of the rest is also pretty filler. Prior they only did pretty unique badges, the baron challenges in Desperados 3 were also real fun and unique. This is the first time they went "cheap RPG dev" tactic in padding things a bit, even though it's optional achievement stuff.

Still, trying to go to 100% in this one looks like a major pain, whereas prior it wasn't as much. Anyway, finished the main story, just bought the DLCs.

[Lady Neravin]

Originally posted by fourfourtwo79:

Originally posted by Kildread:

All together, this game will have cost me roughly what a "regular" new title would cost on release. With the amount of hours I've spent with it so far, I've got a value of less than a single dollar per hour. That's better than most non-RPG games I've bought.

Big RPG fan, but RPGs of course can be a bit notorious for a) promoting that "Dollar per hour" value. And b) padding that value with paste&copy content (trash combat, fetch quests, etc.). I whish this would change.... in particular since I've played quite a few RPGs that don't have the content to justify going that long. The original Fallout would have a real hard time nowadays, for all the wrong reasons.

Speaking about which, Mimimi added quite some grind for Shadow Gambit too, in particular achievements. You can finish the game with easily not having "completed" ~30% of it. But most of the rest is also pretty filler. Prior they only did pretty unique badges, the baron challenges in Desperados 3 were also real fun and unique. This is the first time they went "cheap RPG dev" tactic in padding things a bit, even though it's optional achievement stuff.

Still, trying to go to 100% in this one looks like a major pain, whereas prior it wasn't as much. Anyway, finished the main story, just bought the DLCs.

Mimimi games where always about this "filler" content. They just did more of that this time.
I don't think I will ever get to 100% badges in ST, because of the bloody time badges, wich are mostly missing this time, wich I really prefer

[SJkr8]

Originally posted by Lady Neravin:

Originally posted by fourfourtwo79:

Big RPG fan, but RPGs of course can be a bit notorious for a) promoting that "Dollar per hour" value. And b) padding that value with paste&copy content (trash combat, fetch quests, etc.). I whish this would change.... in particular since I've played quite a few RPGs that don't have the content to justify going that long. The original Fallout would have a real hard time nowadays, for all the wrong reasons.

Speaking about which, Mimimi added quite some grind for Shadow Gambit too, in particular achievements. You can finish the game with easily not having "completed" ~30% of it. But most of the rest is also pretty filler. Prior they only did pretty unique badges, the baron challenges in Desperados 3 were also real fun and unique. This is the first time they went "cheap RPG dev" tactic in padding things a bit, even though it's optional achievement stuff.

Still, trying to go to 100% in this one looks like a major pain, whereas prior it wasn't as much. Anyway, finished the main story, just bought the DLCs.

Mimimi games where always about this "filler" content. They just did more of that this time.
I don't think I will ever get to 100% badges in ST, because of the bloody time badges, wich are mostly missing this time, wich I really prefer

Thanks for mentioning the difference in achievement types. I also didn't bother aiming for 100% in Shadow Tactics because of timed badges, but did so in both Desperados 3 and Aiko's Choice. It is unfortunate that they did away with the unique badges in this game...

[Lorgarmor]

I was a bit shocked in the first moments as well, but I thought: Shadow Gambit alone gave me over 80 hours of fun gameplay, so it is not that bad after all and it supports/rewards the devs for providing us with all these amazing games.

[Kildread]

Originally posted by fourfourtwo79:

Still, trying to go to 100% in this one looks like a major pain.

It's not --- really, it was pretty fun to do it. Most Island/Mission/Crew badges can be chained together without needing to run a mission *solely* for one. The ones about kill amounts come through natural gameplay unless you really avoid using certain characters.

I didn't bother with Shadow Tactics' because of the timed badges (hate those) and quit Desperadoes 3's badges for much the same reason. This one has like, 2 of them --- one that is very generous and one on a very small map. They were the only 'pain in the ass' I could define as such.

My playthrough of this game was --- Cursed difficulty for each initial mission without bothering with badges (You can't see them at that point anyway), then lower it down to Explorer when getting badges post game. I had around 73% done when I decided I'd just wait for the teased new content. Good thing I did too, Yuki, Zagan and the Treasure Hunt missions make some of the badges very easy.

Missing 1 Zagan mission and 5 Yuki mission and I'll have 100% it completely.

[ToRni27]

Wait for discounts or if you like the game just pay it cuz the devs deserve it then.

[Krude]

Honestly it depends on perspective.

Because we as a community reward trash with money but get stingy with quality, we get less good stuff and see more small devs close, it's tragic.

12£ skin? ooo it looks pReTtY, but doesn't do anything outside aesthetics, oOoOoOh must have.

12£ dlc that gives you literally tons of hours of gameplay? Ah Mawh Gawd, OVERpRicEd!!

like do this from now on:

How many hours will I probably get of enjoyment, then divide the price by those hours.

That's what you are paying for, that's literally it, if you know you'll get 30 hours of fun out of it, 12 divided by 30 is 0.4 per hour.

Now think about how much you spend to go to the cinema and watch 2 hours at most of a movie?

Perspective.

[SJkr8]

As someone who played a lot of Paradox games like Cities Skylines, Prison Architect and Surviving Mars, I am particularly allergic towards DLCs, not to mention that many devs later offer a complete collection which is often cheaper to buy for new players than for existing players to complete their collection. I also don't preorder games and don't have fanboy attitude, meaning I critically analyze even content from my favorite devs (Steam recently released best-selling games of 2023, and both Baldur's Gate 3 and Starfield are in the top Platinum tier; I don't have to tell you which reached there due to fanboyism).
As such, I can't help ignoring fanboy comments here about this being Mimimi's last offering and fans should get it; I'd definitely like to play it before I die, but I'm not dying to play it. As much as I love their games, I personally feel Desperados 3 was their best product in terms of both quality and quantity. Also, I do feel like Shadow Gambit is kind of a magic reskin rather than being very innovative (I particularly like Partisans 1941 despite its flaws because it introduced skill tree and camp mechanics to the real-time tactics genre).
Thanks to all the people providing critical info about the game after playing it. With all these arguments about overpriced DLCs, this sale I decided to get a game effectively without DLCs and years of development, Transport Fever 2, that I'm sure will surpass in playtime games like Cities Skylines and Euro Truck Simulator 2 from my library that I still don't own all DLCs for (by the way, I don't think playtime should be the sole measure of good games).

[fourfourtwo79]

To me making a decision is not a "fanboy attitude". Rather, it's a "market signal" attitude. For gaming this rings truly: the market rules everything. The gaming market is democracy all around. And you're voting what gets be made with your wallet. Thus, product that sees no customer support eventually stops being made. I learned that lesson the hard way, as some of my favourite genres disppeared for years until Kickstarter and smaller studios revived them. That way, I have all right to complain about when it all goes down the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ again -- and only the gaming equivalent of Marvel Blockbuster movies and Michael Bay fad ends up being made. RPGs proper for instance as opposed to action adventure type of games with barebones RPG features attached: Baldur's Gate 3 wouldn't even exist if Kickstarter et all had revived this gig. Larian were practically bust before they found success and their niche with Original Sin too.

Doesn't mean I buy clearly subpar product though. Arkane's Redfall for instance: They are clearly the only triple-A Immersive Sim type developer left standing. The only major studio still championing what Ultima Underworld, System Shock, Deus Ex et all tried to achieve back then. However, buying a subpar looter shooter just for supporting Arkane? No. Speaking of which, Redfall is the least Arkane game to date, even leading to lots of staff resigning, and they've recently even announced a cinematic 3rd person action game in Blade -- which in some ways looks even further from what they are all about (will reserve judgement until gameplay is shown). By buying into these kind of products I'd send the signal that opting for change was the right thing to do.

Btw. the DLC to the first Dishonored are still my favourite DLC. In particular combined they are like oldschool add-on packs released in the 1990s for stuff like Jedi Knight et all. And Prey even went fully-on experimental with Mooncrash, turning the core experience upside down by going more rogue-like.

[Lady Neravin]

Originally posted by fourfourtwo79:

To me making a decision is not a "fanboy attitude". Rather, it's a "market signal" attitude. For gaming this rings truly: the market rules everything. The gaming market is democracy all around. And you're voting what gets be made with your wallet.

I think you confuse capitalism with democracy here...