Symphony of War: The Nephilim Saga

Symphony of War: The Nephilim Saga

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EatExcreteRepeat Jun 17, 2022 @ 3:00pm
2
Let's discuss the classes
I was originally thinking of writing this as a guide, but there are a lot of good threads out there about class balance, and there are many ways to play, so I thought it'd be good to have a discussion about what people feel about the classes first. Here's just my thoughts about the classes.

This is going to be a long one, so I'm splitting it into a few parts.

Tier 1

Fighter - Between the four basic classes, Fighter is the most versatile by far because he can upgrade into units of just about any role. Every campaign could use a large number of Fighters in the early game to develop into viable promoted units into the mid and late game.

Bowman - Bowmen are the only basic class that can do two things: hit people from afar, and hit during a separate phase from melee. That makes them useful for building dedicated archer squads (like the one Jules starts out with) to give supporting fire from afar, assassinate squishy casters and light infantry, and soften up bosses, as well as making them useful for mixing into your more melee oriented squads to help them deal damage to multiple rows of enemies at once.

Medic - Medics are your only basic class that can heal. I think it's easiest to play with at least one healer in every squad that you will reasonably expect to take damage. This means the only squads that don't get at least one medic are archery/cannon squads for me. I could also see it being possible to skip the medic in melee cavalry squads and light infantry squads to depend on their charges and ambushes to shut down retaliatory damage. Or, perhaps, you could have a medic in one of every two squads, or two out of every three squads, and depend on out-of-combat healing for those squads without them. I haven't tried those strategies, and, really, it seems just far easier and safer to put a medic in every squad that isn't stacked with archers and cannons.

Militia - Militia's differentiated from Fighters by being a starter light infantry whereas the Fighter is a heavy infantry. However, they can both promote into different roles, so you can largely use them interchangeably. However, there is one thing that makes Militia require a bit more forethought than Fighters, and that is that everything a Militia would want to promote into requires expensive resources. If you're getting a Militia to be light infantry, realize that eventually, your Swordmaster will want two of your Obsidian. If you're getting Militia to be heavy infantry or heavy cavalry, realize that you'll be paying a Sunstone to promote her into either Paladin or Valkyrie. If you're getting a Militia to be a Sorceress, she'll eventually need two of your gems. If you're getting Militia to promote into a Templar... just don't. Start a Medic for that instead.

Tier 2

Heavy Infantry

Soldier - Soldiers bring Guardian, making them good at being on defense. I don't really think it's a great bonus compared to what Spearmen offer, but if you believe in leaving melee units in the rear to protect against rogues, you might as well use a Soldier to do it. That said, Soldiers also promote into offensive heavy infantry that I believe are better than what the Spearmen get, and Soldiers are the only guys who can promote into Champions, so if you want Champions, you need to have Soldiers.

Spearmen - Spearmen seem to provide many more benefits than Soldiers. On defense, a frontline of spearmen will all help each other mitigate melee damage, or with Polearm Mastery tech, you don't even need the frontline to have multiple spearmen. Spearmen also can't lose their turn to being charged by cavalry. Spearmen are also the only unit that promote into Centurions.

Acolyte - Acolytes seem to be far stronger than the other heavy infantry in their tier. Between their magic resistance and heavy armor, crossbows and firearms seem to be just about the only thing that can actually meaningfully hurt them, and they do just as much damage to other heavy infantry you would have. Acolytes' Striking damage also makes them good at brawling with other heavy infantry. The only thing that's not to love about Acolytes is that they will need a Sunstone to promote into either Valkyrie or Paladin. This means that every Acolyte you are using as Heavy Infantry (or trying to promote into cavalry) is going to compete with your Apprentices and healers for Sunstones. Since mages and healers are so important, you can't, unfortunately, really afford that many Acolytes, unless you don't mind them never upgrading. Still, consider somehow scraping together and fielding a heavy infantry squad of acolytes and/or paladins to tank enemy squads that use a lot of magic damage.

Light Infantry

Skirmisher - On paper, Skirmishers are the same as Swordfighters; they are both melee light infantry with frontal attacks. My experience, which I can't account for in any way, is that Swordfighters deal more damage and survive better. Perhaps someone better at light infantry tactics can shed some light on this. One consideration that you may want to make when deciding whether to field Skirmishers or Swordfighters, though, is that they promote into Rangers and Swordmasters, who are dramatically different units.

Swordfighter - See Skirmisher

Rogue - I have to admit, I severely dislike Rogues. There are many enemy squads where the guys at the back are the same as the guys in the front, and in those cases, an Apprentice or Siren is much better at spreading around your damage and killing big columns. There are a few enemy squads where you do want to target the guys at the back, but they may not be standing where your light infantry can go. One of the sadder things in this game is also when your Rogues must attack the rear, so they attack healers who don't deal damage to you and would have surrendered if you killed their pals in front of them to begin with, so not only did you not mitigate any damage for your squad by having a rogue, you actually damaged your faction ranking by killing a unit that would've surrendered!

Melee Cavalry

Cavalier - I'm not sure I really like Cavaliers. Charge obviously dunks on squads that do not have polearm frontlines (which is surprisingly few?), and they are a fair bit better at attacking into Spearmen than Scouts because of their armor, and they are a fair bit better at resisting being shot at with arrows. But look at everything you're trading for this...

Scout - ...You're trading the ability to ambush, the ability to trade with other light cavalry or beat heavy cavalry in both offense and defense, and the ability to move faster through rough terrain. You should use some kind of cavalry for their ability to hit and then move, and their ability to initiate combat against mobile enemy infantry, but given all their bells whistles, and most importantly, being the countering cavalry rather than the countered cavalry, Scouts seem much better at the job than Cavaliers.

Archers

Archer - They're basically like stronger bowmen and your stepping stone for getting Warbows. Not much to say about archers that don't apply to every other ranged unit.

Horsebow - Horsebows are basically archers, but better, because they are faster and can shoot and scoot. But then again, they cost horses, which you may be in short supply of at whatever point you are in the game. If you happen to have the horses and enough of the skill stat and also are not planning on turning the unit into a Warbow, I really don't see why you wouldn't want to promote your bowman into Horsebow over Archer. But then again, that's three reasons why you might not want or be able to get the horsebow.

Crossbowman - I admit I haven't used Crossbowmen because I never really saw the point in investing tech points just for a sidegrade, and I like that my archers get to use their strength as part of their damage calculations. Anyone have any strong positive or negative opinions about Crossbowmen?

Wizards

Apprentice - I really enjoy the Apprentice's ability to turn a single enemy into a smoking crater between your first melee attack and your second melee attack on the offensive. Because of their single massive damage attack, I think they are far better than archers for helping your melee squad drill past enemy squads with multiple rows. As a sweet, sweet, bonus, they upgrade into the three mages, who are some of the most potent damage dealers in the game. Apprentices do kind of suck on the defense because they can't attack until after the enemy's second phase, but note this attack will still probably successfully convert one man into one pile of ash. One important caveat to the apprentice is that he requires a rare bowman or fighter that has a high magic stat to get a good Apprentice. If you ever see those guys available for conscription, make sure to scoop him up and keep him around, those guys are worth their weight in gold. And, of course, the tech that allows your Apprentice to cast on the first round is also a priority if you have good access to apprentices and mages.

Siren - Sirens are so maligned, they are getting a massive buff in the upcoming patch 1.0b. I actually did not have a problem with the base class Sirens because they hit hard enough and mitigate the enemy's damage. Still, until I've seen the buff they get, I would prefer Apprentices over Sirens whenever I can get them. Sirens also promote into the Sorceress class, which is just awful. However, a consideration to make about Sirens is that they are easily accessed from a base medic class, which is guaranteed a good magic stat, and you don't have to fish for a very rare high magic fighter/bowman.

Healers

Priestess - A Priestess is basically a bigger medic. Not much else to say about that. Priestesses have dibs on all my gems because they are so important for keeping your squads alive and healthy enough to function.

Hospitaller - A Hospitaller is just a priestess with a horse. You really only need them if your cavalry unit will lose its cavalry moment unless its healer is also on horseback, so you can go ahead and promote into Priestess if you have a unit that's something like 3 scouts and your healer. The Priestess probably rides in the back with one of the horsemen, but I like to imagine they attach a little sidecar to a horse for her.
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Showing 16-19 of 19 comments
Jackfuego226 Jun 26, 2022 @ 7:46pm 
Crossbows are great for softening armor for your archer squads. Just having 2 in a squad of archers will let the others do much more damage to heavy infantry that might otherwise protect them.

For Samurai, a great use is when combined with a unit you already intend to fight at longer ranges with, like archers and cannons. I used them as the front line for Lysander's squad with a mid row of gunners and 2 cannons, and I'll be honest, he became stronger than even my nephilhiem units.

Gunners are great for shredding armor for your other units to take advantage of. Even without their upgrades, they are still strong units that only have the weakness of one attack per round until you invest in the proper tech tree.

Dragoons are, like you said, gunners on horses. This makes them great for cavalry squads. As part of a cavalry charge, they can shred any pesky armor that can stop your melee cav. And when they are upgraded to become light cav? Now you can add ambush potential to the mix.

Cannons turn enemy squads into paste before the rest of the squad even gets their first attack, even unupgraded
JurgenJuggernaut Jun 29, 2022 @ 7:54am 
Hi all,
In my experience (Captain),

Crossbowman: I like it more than archer types, they are good vs armored units. While archers vs light.

My only complain here is that there is no upgrade (warbow archers).

Cavalry: in general archiving a "charge" is hard, due often enemies as you said have pikes or have more movement range.

I don't know what trait cavaliers/knights have but they certainly could use a buff. Like having extra damage based on armor stat and/or changing charge mechanic to me stacked for each square.

I have a unit of 4 knights + 1 Hospitalier and "charged" archers they with 2 attacks only killed front liners.

That said, my "most" successful squad is Diana's so far (c.12). 1 Paladin + Valkyria + Priestess + Siren + swordfighter.

They benefit from the mixed squad tech, plus light/heavy armor + tech related to priestess/paladin + Diana broken.
Kanjejou Sep 7, 2022 @ 5:37pm 
Most of what you said Is close to what i felt about units, but I am goign to write what I feel was different.

Personally I didnt like light cav in WARLORD Permadeath because getting a charge or ambush are situationnal and the lower hp and armor make them pretty dependant on placement. Where classic Cavalier can fight pretty much anything as melee soldiers on horse...and only rifle canon or mage spam can stop them effectively.
Also tech give them so much extra stats.

Samourai is nice for a almost full ranged squad to be able to resist melee 3samourai 5 archer 1 healer.

Ranger very strong once you get 2/3 of them in a squad the almost garanted crit with the crossbow can easily oneshot heavy infantery or a mage hidding in the back, still require crossbow improvement tech to really shine.
Compared to swordwomen or assasin they truly hit super hard on first hit and okaish on second but have mostly the same power as them vs anything except super ligth armor unit where their crossbow wont shine but low armor units usually are so squishie they will still die. Also they dont require hard to get ressources or stats so its prety easy to make a ranged squad, or replace loses.

Rogue/assasin can help vs rifle mages and other squishies hidding in the back but require to be 3+ to work consistently. but they are quite hard to level since they require so much skill...

rifle= mages with different ressources...
they both alpha very hard and hit first once you get the tech.
rifle only seem to truly coumbo with skill and more HP so fighter seem to be a better choice.


For other units they were all okay except maybe skirmisher and swordfighter that even on attack tend to take way too much damages.

Crossbow are early-mid game anti heavy infantery unit and later on a very good ambush units, light infantery tend to lack anti armor and a line of crossbow can really help in that domain also they only require a bit of iron (not obsidian like warbow or pyrocite like rifles)
Last edited by Kanjejou; Sep 7, 2022 @ 6:39pm
Steelfleece Sep 7, 2022 @ 5:50pm 
Always remember that you as long as a majority of a unit is cavalry (unless there's a dragon), it gets the bonus movement and shoot-and-scoot capability. This lets you plunk in non-cavalry (except dragons) to flesh out a unit, resulting in such fun as a raider group with a templar in the mid row and three samurai up front. Still moves as light cavalry, all but the healer have a 2-range bow, but can duke it out like heavy infantry if they come under attack. The one real issue would be assassin-heavy squads, but that's where the speed comes in. These easily became some of my most-used squads in the mid to late game. Combined arms fun.
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Date Posted: Jun 17, 2022 @ 3:00pm
Posts: 19