New game = Same game?

[Mr. Moyer]

They just released their SECOND game into early access "fresh start cleaning simulator." I've watched a few videos and the official trailer. It is the SAME GAME. Just on a new map and from first person perspective, with a new visual model for your vacuum and hose. Uses all the same visual models for the trash piles and plants. Uses the same background elements like rocks and water. Same basic gameplay - vacuum up the trash to collect resources, repair some pipes and other equipment to clean up the environment, build some decorations, plant crops and grow trees and flowers. It is EERILY similar to the final release of NPLH. Maybe they should call it "NPLH Plus" instead of "FSCS".

My point is, it looks like they're just doing a quick and dirty port of NPLH, running it through early access again to make more money off of it, and hoping it just "goes better" this time. So guys, don't count on any more updates or the new fishing mechanic for NPLH. Seems like they've dropped this game and are solely focusing on its UPDATED version FSCS.

Shady move, devs. Very shady. You had a good concept here. And in the end I expect FSCS to be what NPLH was SUPPOSED to be - a 7/10 kind of game (assuming you fix most of the bugs and clean up the quest system). But you're leaving all us current NPLH players hanging here, with a 4/10 game cuz it has so many bugs and the quests were never really finished. I mean, come on, were you SERIOUS with that final sunken city zone and the big boss fight? Your last bunch of updates were pretty lame. I mean I appreciate you BRINGING BACK the underground (which shouldn't have been removed in the first place) and Challenge Mode gives a bit more meaning to combat and cooking meals. But then you took the NPLH framework and rebranded it as FSCS before even finishing the original game. That is not cool.

[SassyAzura]

I agree 100%, not only what they are doing ruining the name of any good indie dev but they literally gave us a incomplete game that they themselves admitted they rushed for no reason but then had the gall to take the game they abandoned to then make a whole new game with the same baseline they originally had for NPLH.... Seeing the sneak peak they gave us for the new game it looks like they are rushing this game out as well as there isn't really enough levels to sustain the game beyond a few hours

[Piperbird]

I can't play FP games without barfing, so I'm left out of the new game. I am curious if they went FP so that you never see the character, because so many people complained about being 'forced' to play a female.

[Mr. Moyer]

Originally posted by Piperbird:

I can't play FP games without barfing, so I'm left out of the new game. I am curious if they went FP so that you never see the character, because so many people complained about being 'forced' to play a female.

LOL no I think they just did it because it was technically easier, they don't have to maintain the character's appearance on screen all the time.

[Rianya]

I've played Fresh Start all the way through. It's early access so I'm definitely hoping for more content later but I loved it. I liked that I didn't have to fight anything and I still find vacuuming up trash and leaving behind clean and pretty natural spaces enjoyable. I would love to see them change up the music - preferably to change it to reflect each area/country you are cleaning and it would be lots of fun if they tied it to NPLH a bit more specifically - like your character is Ellie's grandma before the brothers split and the SuperSucker Mark 1 is her invention or something.

And it makes sense that they'd use the artwork and basic mechanics of the game they've already produced - but the clearly spent time making each area interesting and challenging.

[SassyAzura]

Originally posted by Rianya:

I've played Fresh Start all the way through. It's early access so I'm definitely hoping for more content later but I loved it. I liked that I didn't have to fight anything and I still find vacuuming up trash and leaving behind clean and pretty natural spaces enjoyable. I would love to see them change up the music - preferably to change it to reflect each area/country you are cleaning and it would be lots of fun if they tied it to NPLH a bit more specifically - like your character is Ellie's grandma before the brothers split and the SuperSucker Mark 1 is her invention or something.

And it makes sense that they'd use the artwork and basic mechanics of the game they've already produced - but the clearly spent time making each area interesting and challenging.

what do you mean early access?? they fully released this game not to long ago and its honestly not what we were promised... sure they gave us a *few* more levels but honestly its not worth what they are asking for in price and is definitely not the hours upon hours of gameplay we all asked for when they first put this game into early access... once again they pushed out a game WAYYY to fast and gave us a half baked game once more

[Rianya]

They fully released Fresh Start?

I agree that I hope No Place Like Home has more updates - whether they fully released it or not, it's not complete. They still have a lot that they should do with it.

[SassyAzura]

Originally posted by Rianya:

They fully released Fresh Start?

I agree that I hope No Place Like Home has more updates - whether they fully released it or not, it's not complete. They still have a lot that they should do with it.

as far as I've seen only minor bug patches and that's been it in terms of update

[Rianya]

I just read that they're working on adding fishing to NPLH - and a lot of people commented that they really want them to work on the bugs. So they seem to still be working on content. :)

[SassyAzura]

Originally posted by Rianya:

I just read that they're working on adding fishing to NPLH - and a lot of people commented that they really want them to work on the bugs. So they seem to still be working on content. :)

they'e been promising that since the game was fully released... if you read further they say they are no longer working on NPLH

[Mr. Moyer]

NPLH... The game had potential. But because the devs were new at this, because they caved to every single user suggestion, because they didn't properly plan out the schedule or the budget (they far underestimated the resources required to make a good game), because they don't actually know how to fix a lot of the bugs in the game, ... it became a $#!* show about 2/3 of the way into development. They pushed an unfinished project out the door. Then they abandoned it after promising several more updates for both bug fixes and new content. It just sort of fell apart. As a long-time backer since the early access days, I for one feel cheated not because they abandoned the project, hey it happens in this business. But because they already had a new game, almost a clone of it but with more polish, in the works before they even finished their first attempt at making a game. It's as if they PLANNED to dump NPLH as an unfinished mess since about halfway into its development, yet still they charged money for that garbage fire while also simultaneously charging money for the new game which I'm just gonna call it "NPLH PLUS" cuz that's what it is. Those who are defending it as an "original game" with "different mechanics" are just blind, you don't want to admit that you got scammed into buying the same product twice. The new game is what NPLH was INTENDED to be. I got no beef with the new one being a "good and fun game" ... I just don't like being lied to and cheated.

[Piperbird]

It's NPLH minus for me, I can't even play FP games without barfing, so this game is entirely off the table for me. I'm just stuck with unfinished NPLH. And not just unfinished, the game is in a much worse state than it was earlier in development. They really dropped the ball completley.

[ThatChickWithTheRabbit]

Eh, I play and like them both for VERY different reasons: No Place for when I want a bit of combat and farming, and Fresh Start for when I just wanna zone out and not worry about anything. One is focused on adventure/exploration and management, the other is more...zen, I guess would be the word? That makes them different games in my eyes. I think something similar might be the main series Pokemon games versus the spin-offs like Mystery Dungeon and Stadium.

I also don't consider using the same assets and similar mechanics an issue. That's how Majora's Mask came to be: They were given the green light to make another game, but only if it could be done in a ridiculously short amount of time; I assume due to budget.

Both games DEFINITELY need tightening up in various areas: hitboxes and collision are the first things that come to mind. I have to wonder if there's something at the base level of coding that's an issue. I know very, VERY little of coding, but I know that a shoddy foundation can be such an issue that it's better to just scrap it and start over. And starting over, especially late in development, takes TONS of resources.

Pure speculation, but I wonder if that's the deal with Fresh Start supposedly being in the works before NPLH was done? Release as-is or start over? Both options suck in that scenario, and doing 'both' was the probably the best option. However, if that was the case, transparency and honesty on that matter would help a lot. Even if they're afraid of losing some backing or being embarrassed by admitting to poor choices, it would be a display of integrity that could re-instill some faith, or earn some forgiveness.

I don't keep up with their news/social medias; I'm spit-balling in the dark, here. I have no idea if they've already said something on the matter. I'm just assuming that whatever they've communicated, it wasn't enough due to the comments posted here.

Personally, I feel I got my money's worth on both games and I'm eager for more. HOWEVER, as-is, NPLH is only a $15 game, and I can see why people are upset/disappointed. They NEED to slow down and give whatever game they do next a sturdier foundation, more playtesting, more planning and polish in the coding/meshing/whatever-it-is department.

[Mr. Moyer]

For the record, I'm not trying to argue with anyone else's point of view. Just stating my own observations and my own opinions.