Portrayal of white army?

[Duelist]

Alright so everyone's been talking about how the Reds are comic book villains in this game... i'm curious about the whites though? How are they portrayed?

[Punished Lukaš]

Depends on what you are talking about. In live action cutscenes, reds are not really comic book villains, and neither are whites.

In gameplay however, they are just disinterested in pretty much anything to do with people and just want to go about their business.

They are more sympathetically portrayed.

The game is most symphatetic to the Green Army tho.

What I find incredibly funny is that in gameplay characters pretend to have no idea why the Reds don't like them, while in live-action cutscenes your adjutant outright states that you are a foreign army in a foreign land, very openly supporting the Whites (their enemies) and taking part in all the ♥♥♥♥ they do together with foreign coalition that invaded Russia lol.

And this is stated before the scene where everyone is surprised Trotsky ordered them hunted down "for absolutely no reason other than him being crazy"

However, people complaining about portrayal are missing one crucial thing, and that is that the game's narrative needs this portrayal.

If the reds are not comic book villains, then the game would have to admit that Czechoslovak Legion sided with what were basically far-right lunatics of the time and took part in much of crimes they commited. It would also be unable to whitewash a lot of ♥♥♥♥ rest of the world commited in Russia at the time

[Wade Wilson]

just in case...

Slovakia was both politically and economically dependent on Germany for its existence as a sovereign state. Thus, Slovakia followed suit and joined the Axis alliance on November 24, 1940.

Slovak prime minister Vojtech Tuka (front row, standing) announces Slovakia's entry into the Axis alliance (initially Germany, Italy, and Japan; also joined by Hungary, Romania, and Bulgaria). Berlin, Germany, November 1940.

Czechoslovak News Agency

[Zen]

Originally posted by Punished Lukaš:

If the reds are not comic book villains, then the game would have to admit that Czechoslovak Legion sided with what were basically far-right lunatics of the time and took part in much of crimes they commited. It would also be unable to whitewash a lot of ♥♥♥♥ rest of the world commited in Russia at the time

I see poor Russia again the only country that suffered during WW1, jesus you people are so insecure.

If there were any reasonable armies back then in Russia I'm sure CS Legion would have sided with them. And if they could've had just move normally either to the West or to Vladivostok, there would've been no need for any fight.

[Swaggaccino]

Originally posted by Zen:

Originally posted by Punished Lukaš:

If the reds are not comic book villains, then the game would have to admit that Czechoslovak Legion sided with what were basically far-right lunatics of the time and took part in much of crimes they commited. It would also be unable to whitewash a lot of ♥♥♥♥ rest of the world commited in Russia at the time

I see poor Russia again the only country that suffered during WW1, jesus you people are so insecure.

If there were any reasonable armies back then in Russia I'm sure CS Legion would have sided with them. And if they could've had just move normally either to the West or to Vladivostok, there would've been no need for any fight.

It's not WW1. It's post WW1. Russian Civil War lasted from 1917 to 1923. WW1 ended in 1918.

Also, Reds are legit comic book villains. A lot of the game hits the nail on the head. Collectivization, red terror, labor camps, genocide, etc. You didn't see the Tsar doing any of that crap did you in the years prior did you?

[dusteki]

Originally posted by Duelist:

Alright so everyone's been talking about how the Reds are comic book villains in this game... i'm curious about the whites though? How are they portrayed?

The historical Reds and Whites make Lex Luther look like Gandhi, true evil.

One of the most brutal wars in history.

[dusteki]

Originally posted by Swaggaccino:

Originally posted by Zen:

I see poor Russia again the only country that suffered during WW1, jesus you people are so
Also, Reds are legit comic book villains. A lot of the game hits the nail on the head. Collectivization, red terror, labor camps, genocide, etc. You didn't see the Tsar doing any of that crap did you in the years prior did you?

The tsars did do that crap to Poland and the Caucases.

[DJ Catmom]

While CZ Legion is a "foreign army in a foreign land", the important part here is that the newly established government negotiated movement of the Legion through Russia on basis of neutrality. Legion was not supposed to interact with either side and in turn be left alone to transit. Trotski's order to kill them indiscriminantly without declaration of war is them going back on their word.

There is nothing historically innacurate with reds being comic book villians, they were. The party line was to collectivize everything, including food and whoever opposed it was designated a "kulak", "reactivist" or a "counter-revolutionary" and dealt with accordingly.

[Aethrys]

The reds aren't comic book villains, because in comic books the villains lose. They're far more realistic, historically accurate villains that get away with it.

[identifiedasbeingdisrespectful]

Originally posted by Punished Lukaš:

What I find incredibly funny is that in gameplay characters pretend to have no idea why the Reds don't like them, while in live-action cutscenes your adjutant outright states that you are a foreign army in a foreign land, very openly supporting the Whites (their enemies) and taking part in all the ♥♥♥♥ they do together with foreign coalition that invaded Russia lol.

it never says they support the whites, it in fact stresses their desire to remain neutral.

[WhackadillyWoo]

Originally posted by DJ Catmom:

While CZ Legion is a "foreign army in a foreign land", the important part here is that the newly established government negotiated movement of the Legion through Russia on basis of neutrality. Legion was not supposed to interact with either side and in turn be left alone to transit. Trotski's order to kill them indiscriminantly without declaration of war is them going back on their word.

I don't know about this. Even a quick search on Wikipedia suggests that the situation was more complicated than what you are saying. While they were supposed to remain neutral, the CZ Legion got into armed conflict with Hungarian loyalist POWs who were being returned home under Red Protection (because of the peace treaty). The Reds arrested some legion members for that incident, which led to the Legion revolting and taking over the entire city. It was then that Trotsky ordered the Legion to be disarmed and arrested, not "Indiscriminately killed". The Legion refused and the rest is history.

This isn't even from some hard to find source, this is literally from Wikipedia. I'm not even arguing against the Red Terror here, but it looks pretty clear that the CZ Legion weren't just betrayed randomly for no reason, evidently there was a complicated situation with the whole armed fight with the Hungarian POWs and refusing arrest that led to the conflict. And again, I'm not even arguing about Red Terror or White Terror or anything about that, just that it seems to be common knowledge that the CZ Legion did some actions that would understandably piss off the Reds.

That being said, I understand why the game portrays the Legion like this, for the purposes of the game's story it is necessary for the player to feel like they are the good guys. However, it is important to remember that it's just a game and not intended to be a completely 100% accurate depiction of history. Like the devs say, this is a fictional game that is just inspired by real events, and includes artistic licenses for many things.

[Commissar Tordez]

Originally posted by Duelist:

Alright so everyone's been talking about how the Reds are comic book villains in this game... i'm curious about the whites though? How are they portrayed?

Oh no! communists being portrayed like evil people? who could have foreseen this.....

[Duelist]

I SPECIFICALLY asked about the portrayal of the white armies...why is everyone talking about the reds? Anybody got an actual answer?

[Swaggaccino]

Originally posted by dusteki:

The tsars did do that crap to Poland and the Caucases.

Lmao, the start of Russian-Polish animosity can be traced all the way back to the time of troubles when Poland decided to attack a weaken Russia for the hell of it. This is after 500 some years of peace and even military alliances with Russia. All gone just for some real estate. 10 years later, Russia got their crap together, drove Poland out, and started expanding westward. Thanks for that Poland. Siding with Napoleon didn't help relations either.

[Enola Gay]

Originally posted by WhackadillyWoo:

Originally posted by DJ Catmom:

While CZ Legion is a "foreign army in a foreign land", the important part here is that the newly established government negotiated movement of the Legion through Russia on basis of neutrality. Legion was not supposed to interact with either side and in turn be left alone to transit. Trotski's order to kill them indiscriminantly without declaration of war is them going back on their word.

I don't know about this. Even a quick search on Wikipedia suggests that the situation was more complicated than what you are saying. While they were supposed to remain neutral, the CZ Legion got into armed conflict with Hungarian loyalist POWs who were being returned home under Red Protection (because of the peace treaty). The Reds arrested some legion members for that incident, which led to the Legion revolting and taking over the entire city. It was then that Trotsky ordered the Legion to be disarmed and arrested, not "Indiscriminately killed". The Legion refused and the rest is history.

This isn't even from some hard to find source, this is literally from Wikipedia. I'm not even arguing against the Red Terror here, but it looks pretty clear that the CZ Legion weren't just betrayed randomly for no reason, evidently there was a complicated situation with the whole armed fight with the Hungarian POWs and refusing arrest that led to the conflict. And again, I'm not even arguing about Red Terror or White Terror or anything about that, just that it seems to be common knowledge that the CZ Legion did some actions that would understandably piss off the Reds.

That being said, I understand why the game portrays the Legion like this, for the purposes of the game's story it is necessary for the player to feel like they are the good guys. However, it is important to remember that it's just a game and not intended to be a completely 100% accurate depiction of history. Like the devs say, this is a fictional game that is just inspired by real events, and includes artistic licenses for many things.

I wouldn't trust anything on wikipedia anymore. They have a severe problem with changing facts to fit political narratives. Ironically just like the reds did.

[Drakkar]

Little Question the dev say its just mostly ficition but its in the Game that CZ-Legion flee with the gold of the tzar ? And give the leader of the White army Admiral Koltschak, to the Red army for Execution so that they can flee ? Is that in the Game too ? Or its the Game more like Good guys flee away from evil without historical background ?