Relic’s Resource Crunch: Save AoE4 First!

[Hellstorm]

Relic Entertainment’s down to an estimated 100–120 employees, a rough guess based on their pre-2023 size of around 200, slashed by layoffs—121 in May 2023 and 41 in April 2024—offset by minimal hires to keep projects afloat.

That shrinking headcount’s part of why they dropped Age of Empires III support after the Definitive Edition; they couldn’t sustain it alongside Company of Heroes 3 and AoE4. Another chunk of their resources got funneled into Earth vs. Mars, a quirky Relic Labs experiment due this summer that’s splitting their already thin team.

They should be pouring those limited resources into fixing what they’ve got, like AoE4’s busted AI that’s been a mess since Sultans Ascend or CoH3’s lingering balance issues, instead of chasing niche side projects.

Fans deserve polished games over gambles when staff’s this tight—thoughts?

[Hellstorm]

İlk olarak erb tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Hellstorm tarafından gönderildi:

Claim: Relic’s down to an estimated 100–120 employees, from ~200 pre-2023, after layoffs of 121 in May 2023 and 41 in April 2024, offset by minimal hires.

Evidence: The layoff numbers come from reports on Relic’s staff cuts. The 121 layoffs in May 2023 were widely covered when Relic was still under Sega, and the 41 layoffs in April 2024 were announced shortly after Relic went independent with Emona Capital’s backing—check GamesIndustry.biz, “Sega confirms layoffs at Relic Entertainment,” May 2023, and IGN, “Relic Entertainment goes independent, cuts 41 jobs,” April 2024. The pre-2023 headcount of ~200 is an estimate from Growjo’s 2023 company profile on Relic, and a 2019 Daily Hive article pegged them at ~250 with plans to grow to 330, supporting a similar range. The 100–120 estimate assumes minimal hires, inferred from their ongoing projects like AoE4’s Knights of Cross and Rose and CoH3’s Fire & Steel, which need a functional team.

Claim: The shrinking headcount is part of why they dropped Age of Empires III support after the Definitive Edition.

Evidence: Relic’s reduced support for AoE3: DE is evident from its update history—the last major content drop was in 2023, per the Age of Empires official site patch notes, with only minor fixes since. Steam player counts also show AoE3: DE at ~2,000 concurrent players, lagging behind AoE2: DE (~15,000) and AoE4 (~5,000), suggesting Microsoft shifted focus to bigger titles—see SteamDB charts for concurrent player data, updated daily.

Claim: They couldn’t sustain Company of Heroes 3 and AoE4 alongside Earth vs. Mars, a quirky Relic Labs experiment due this summer.

Evidence: Earth vs. Mars is confirmed as a Relic Labs project for summer 2025, per Relic’s February 2025 strategy update on their official site, where they outlined focusing on smaller experimental titles. X posts from early 2025 previews have called it “low-effort,” reflecting player skepticism—search X for “Relic Earth vs. Mars low-effort” to see the sentiment.

Claim: They should be pouring limited resources into fixing AoE4’s busted AI (broken since Sultans Ascend) and CoH3’s lingering balance issues.

Evidence: AoE4’s AI issues since Sultans Ascend (Nov 2023) are well-documented—players on Steam forums and X report villagers getting stuck in woodlines, with no major fix in the October 2024 patch (12.0.1974), per the Age of Empires blog patch notes. CoH3’s balance problems are reflected in its 56% positive Steam reviews, with users citing multiplayer issues since launch—check Steam’s Company of Heroes 3 review page for player feedback.

So in all of this downsizing it never occurred to you that you are offering the primary evidence to prove the point that Relic is no longer leading development as a result of their reduced size and focus on their own line of products??

So we agree then?

lol no, because you have no idea about anything you talk about

[erb]

I am actually a black belt in internet ju jitsu and have been able to levy the gods for the knowledge they provide

That is to say, I know as much as you do lol

[Hellstorm]

dude, relic is behind the last update, get you head out of your rear, there is no knight in shinging armor to come racing in. Just because you want some BS to be real, dont make it real..... im so sorry for that burn there hun

[Hellstorm]

and what point are you even trying to make? Also where is one shred of any evidence you have to offer?

i got my popcorn bruh, im waitin

[76561199600653329]

İlk olarak Hellstorm tarafından gönderildi:

I’m doubling down on this thread because the community’s feedback has made one thing clear: AoE4 could be so much more if the basic functions actually worked. The reality is, we’ve been asked to keep buying DLC that feels incomplete, while core issues—some of which have lingered for years—go unaddressed. That’s not okay. If these foundational problems were fixed, the player base would grow massively, and AoE4 could reclaim its spot as a top-tier RTS. We need to rally together and demand these changes now—let’s make this thread the spark that pushes for real improvements!

Here’s exactly what we’re asking for:

A Better Mod Store: The current mod system is clunky and hard to use. A proper mod store with better navigation, search functionality, and support for modders would let the community create and share content more easily, keeping the game fresh and exciting.

Enhanced Game Lobby with More Host Controls: Multiplayer lobbies need better tools for hosts—options to manage players, adjust settings on the fly, and save custom setups. This would make online play smoother and more enjoyable for everyone.

Advanced Game Settings (AGS) for Functional Replays: We need official AGS to enable working replays, customizable AI behaviors, and more. Replays are essential for learning, sharing strategies, and growing the competitive scene, but they’re broken right now.

Smarter AI Behaviors: The AI needs to be more dynamic—building walls, launching coordinated attacks, and adapting to player tactics. This would make single-player and skirmish modes challenging and fun, bringing back players who’ve drifted away.

These aren’t pie-in-the-sky requests—they’re basic quality-of-life fixes that should’ve been in the game from the start. We’re not asking for new content; we’re asking for a game that works as it should. If the devs see how much we care, they’ll have to listen. Let’s make this thread impossible to ignore—share it on Reddit, Discord, and every AoE4 community you’re part of. Add your own ideas for fixes below, and let’s keep this conversation alive until we see real change.

That would be amazing

[BigBotKilla187]

Yeah, its only relic who works on AOE4, they license it from MICROSOFT they don't own it. FE did their own thing and revived AOE2 and other old stuff, but they are not allowed to touch aoe4 per ownership stuff

[erb]

İlk olarak Hellstorm tarafından gönderildi:

and what point are you even trying to make? Also where is one shred of any evidence you have to offer?

i got my popcorn bruh, im waitin

You already proved my point for me.

[Hellstorm]

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İlk olarak Hellstorm tarafından gönderildi:

and what point are you even trying to make? Also where is one shred of any evidence you have to offer?

i got my popcorn bruh, im waitin

You already proved my point for me.

Actually speak child. You have no point. Relic needs to Fix AOE4

[erb]

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İlk olarak erb tarafından gönderildi:

You already proved my point for me.

Actually speak child. You have no point. Relic needs to Fix AOE4

You're asking for the wrong company to fix AoE IV. I'm not telling you anything else!

[Hellstorm]

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Actually speak child. You have no point. Relic needs to Fix AOE4

You're asking for the wrong company to fix AoE IV. I'm not telling you anything else!

Hey Erb, your take’s off base—Forgotten Empires hasn’t taken over as lead developer for Age of Empires IV. Here’s the breakdown.

Official sources like the Age of Empires Series Wiki and Wikipedia list Relic Entertainment as the primary developer, alongside World’s Edge, with Xbox Game Studios publishing. Nothing points to Forgotten Empires running things.

Recent updates confirm this. The February 2025 Knights of Cross and Rose expansion announcement names Relic with World’s Edge. An October 2024 Gamerant article flat-out calls it “Relic Entertainment’s Age of Empires 4.” That’s clear-cut.

Community chatter lines up too—Reddit posts from March 2024 say Relic’s still leading. Forgotten Empires helps with balance testing and maps, but that’s just their standard support role, not evidence of a takeover.

You mentioned Relic’s name being absent or lower in some credits. Sure, that happens—credits shift for dumb reasons like marketing. Doesn’t mean the big sources are wrong about Relic being in charge.

The game’s got problems, no doubt, and speculating about who’s to blame might feel good. But it’s a waste of time. We should just hammer the devs with feedback and push to fix Age of Empires IV.

[Hellstorm]

Prove you do more than speak totally out of your rear

[♪🎉 卂яЌŇᵍғ🐙🍭]

İlk olarak BigBotKilla187 tarafından gönderildi:

Yeah, its only relic who works on AOE4, they license it from MICROSOFT they don't own it. FE did their own thing and revived AOE2 and other old stuff, but they are not allowed to touch aoe4 per ownership stuff

dont write bs if you dont know anything thanks

FE is in charge of aoe4 dlcs atm, its not relic

we have 0 response from relic since a year ago

we get FE response like very often
https://www.reddit.com/r/aoe4/comments/1ip0s0y/so_the_devs_is_forgotten_empires_now_nice_we/

[Hellstorm]

No, the claim that Forgotten Empires is now the primary developer of Age of Empires IV is not correct. Based on official and up-to-date information:

Relic Entertainment remains the lead developer of Age of Empires IV, working in partnership with World's Edge, and the game is published by Xbox Game Studios. This is confirmed by sources like the Age of Empires Series Wiki and Wikipedia.
A recent announcement for the Knights of Cross and Rose expansion in February 2025 explicitly credits Relic Entertainment alongside World's Edge, showing their continued involvement.
An October 2024 Gamerant article refers to the game as "Relic Entertainment's Age of Empires 4," further supporting Relic's primary role.
Community discussions, such as a March 2024 Reddit thread, also highlight Relic’s heavy involvement, with Forgotten Empires contributing to specific tasks like map design and balance playtesting.
While Forgotten Empires does play a supporting role in the game’s development—potentially helping with maps, variant civilizations, or other features—they are not the lead developers. The speculation in the Reddit thread you linked seems to stem from community guesses rather than official evidence. So, the guy’s claim isn’t backed up by the facts!

[Hellstorm]

You guys really need to research your "facts" more than Reddit

[♪🎉 卂яЌŇᵍғ🐙🍭]

İlk olarak Hellstorm tarafından gönderildi:

You guys really need to research your "facts" more than Reddit

your the one who needs to do research your embarrassing yourself

AOE4 is made by Relic yes, and they made Sultan Ascend, after layoffs they dont really work on aoe4 no more.

dont use wiki or wikipedia those are outdated

see this screenshot of the Templar Keep? Who made it?

0 Logo of Relic anywhere, its all Forgotten Empires and World Edge
https://cdn.ageofempires.com/aoe/wp-content/uploads/2025/01/kcr_TemplarFortress.webp


Use your eyes and check the DLC page

https://store.steampowered.com/app/3144890/Age_of_Empires_IV_Knights_of_Cross_and_Rose/

you can see FORGOTTEN EMPIRE is FRONT,