Zhuge Nu i don't get it

[Zeit Eis]

First time playing as the Chinese but i am confused with the Unique Unit Zhuge Nu
They say something like its a very damaging unit but ineffective against Armor Units.....

If i am not wrong apart from Villagers and Trader and maybe Scouts?

All other units have armor or armor value. So itsn't it just a useless unit?

also is the Barbican of the Sun bugged or may i reading it wrong?

i noted they say it has or fire a long range cannon and arrow slit for the garrison units but i have not see the cannon attack at all and also the garrison unit hardly fires.

[Harris]

Zhuge Nu's whole point is that it shoots VERY fast. And regardless of the target's ranged armor, it will always do a minimal damage of 1. This means you can effectively use it against anything provided you've amassed enough of them. Even against buildings. Generally speaking though:
- spearmen and landsknechts
- other archers and crossbowmen
- villagers and traders
- scouts and horsemen
Think longbowmen, but with high fire rate without any gimmicks/upgrades, for the additional cost in gold. Equally bad late game or against m@a and knights.

Barbican of the Sun is Age 2 Keep-ish. You can't upgrade it with any weapons and it shoots something like a rifle (definetely not a cannon though). Similarly to Chinese's version of Outpost Arrowslits, this shot does good damage to m@a and knights. Therefore it's decent defense for the point in the game when it comes online, but mostly useless later on.

[Falaris]

Spearmen, archers, horsemes are weakly armored, Basically, all the units that cost food and wood - the resources that tend to be the easiest to get in large amounts.

Armor works like this:
Let's say an archer shoots at a spearman. The archer does 5 damage, the spearman has 0 armor, so the shot does 5 damage.

Archers has a special ability dealing +5 damage against lightly armored targets, for an additional +5, doing 10 damage.

The zhuge-nu does a burst attack, meaning it attacks, in this case, 3 times. Their arrows do 4 damage. Against a spearman, that would do 4*3 = 12 damage.

Against a target with 2 damage, the archer would do 3 damage, while the Zhuge-Nu would do 4(-2)*3=6 damage.

Against a target with 3 armor, the zhuge-nu would do 3 damage, while the archer does 2.

THe fun begins when the zhuge-nu upgrades the ranged damage with later tiers, because +1 damage is a lot bigger with 3 attacks.

However, the Zhuge-nu, due to how armor reduces damage, quite vulnerable to the enemy's improved armor, as well.

This is what it means with 'ineffective against armored targets'.

Early men at arms, for reference, have 3 ranged armor and 90 hp. They are generally very resistant to archery.

It is worth noting that Zhuge-nu is a bit expensive for what it does currently, but that will be improved in a future patch.

[Thunder]

Armoured units are generally considered MAA and Knights.

The repeater crossbow is confirmed as being buffed in the next patch through lower cost and faster build rate so you can mass them more easily.

[Harris]

Originally posted by Falaris:

Against 4 armor is the only case where the archer is better, with 1 damage against 0.

They would still do that 1 damage even if the target is a building with the ranged armor of 50. This means that while it's very worthwhile and fun to upgrade them to make them a beast unit against unarmored targets, they're still passable against those knights and so on, provided you brought enough of them along.

Zhuge Nu are practically much better for this specific situations than longbowmen, because their fire rate is not reliant on upgrades nor situational gimmick, so they'll bring you value more consistently.

On a more serious note, there's little use for them (as well as longbowmen) for everyone mostly builds knights, m@a and siege engines.

[Zeit Eis]

Hmmm okay. So could i put it like this
Zhuge Nu is a unit that do at least 1 damage minimum per arrow against all Enemy assuming they are all fully armor? which means if they fire 3 arrow in a shot/volley they will always deal 3 damage per attack? To all Units include Knights? Or is it just 1 damage no matter the amount of arrows per shot? I notice when you put them into Garrison they only shot 1 arrow.

I was confused as my first game using the chinese. i notice 8-10 Zhuge Nu did so little damage that the enemy 4 spearman and 3 archer killed them all without so much as 1 casualty which was odd. i might have miss them killing maybe 1 enemy unit but overall they were all slaughtered by the enemy.

regarding the Barbican of the Sun. i just played another round i notice they did fire something but it was easily missed if there was no sound.

by will the nest of bee be buffed? 4 - 5 nest to kill a group of archers in 1 attack seems really sad.

[Falaris]

Originally posted by Harris:

Originally posted by Falaris:

Against 4 armor is the only case where the archer is better, with 1 damage against 0.

They would still do that 1 damage even if the target is a building with the ranged armor of 50. This means that while it's very worthwhile and fun to upgrade them to make them a beast unit against unarmored targets, they're still passable against those knights and so on, provided you brought enough of them along.

Yeah, I realized my error and edited that away before you published. Still, it's appreciated.

However, I guess a good rule of thumb is, zhuge-nu has the strengths and weaknesses of archers, rather than crossbowmen.

On a more serious note, there's little use for them (as well as longbowmen) for everyone mostly builds knights, m@a and siege engines.

I would be careful about judging units based solely on the merits of the current meta; it's counterproductive if you run into someone who do not play according to it, or the meta changes - as it is wont to do.

Also, I should probably sleep. Yes.

[Falaris]

Originally posted by Zeit Eis:

Hmmm okay. So could i put it like this
Zhuge Nu is a unit that do at least 1 damage minimum per arrow against all Enemy assuming they are all fully armor? which means if they fire 3 arrow in a shot/volley they will always deal 3 damage per attack? To all Units include Knights? Or is it just 1 damage no matter the amount of arrows per shot? I notice when you put them into Garrison they only shot 1 arrow.

I was confused as my first game using the chinese. i notice 8-10 Zhuge Nu did so little damage that the enemy 4 spearman and 3 archer killed them all without so much as 1 casualty which was odd. i might have miss them killing maybe 1 enemy unit but overall they were all slaughtered by the enemy.

regarding the Barbican of the Sun. i just played another round i notice they did fire something but it was easily missed if there was no sound.

by will the nest of bee be buffed? 4 - 5 nest to kill a group of archers in 1 attack seems really sad.

It sounds like your opponent were from a higher age. Age differences, if they're upgraded, can be very rough. It shouldn't be quite that uneven, but if even one of those spearmen were a men-at-arms, that would make a huge difference; they are almost unkillable by archers.

About the nest, they will be adjusted, I belive was mentioned in the future patch note post. Still, if you halve a large group of enemy archers, that means your other troops will use half as long to kill them - that's still extremely worthwhile, even if you don't kill them outright.