Why can't you flip back over by winching? Why not???

[BlkBlazzin]

Need I say more? The vehicle has a winch. The winch is not gas powered. Nobody would put a gas powered winch in a off-road vehicle. If you flip....you just winch up and your on your way in less than 5 mins. This game is like "Na bro....You need another vehicle to fix this or you can start over at the garage." I have a winch. There is literally a million places to hook up to but the devs went ahead and strategically placed winch points in places that don't even help rather than just let it hook up to solid things sort of like the grapple in Just Cause. This is goofy. Then the game saves every 5 seconds and its one of those games where when a save happens the game has a stroke and stutters while your trying to play. You can't choose when it saves and you can't pick from a save list so you can't even reload a previous save when your vehicle flips and you don't feel like starting from square one because you can't just winch your vehicle from off of its side. Wish I could just use my winch like in the real world. When your vehicle flips,,,,when that is 100% a time that you would use your freaking winch. Who would not?? Who's idea was it to make it so you couldn't? Tell him that was a retarded idea. Then go to the guy that approved it and hand him some dog poop for approving that crap.

[Eagle Eye]

I get your frustration, but...

Bad news is, winches in real world are designed to pull you out when the vehicle is still on at least 3 wheels..

Real world, as you say, they are meant to pull you out of bogs etc..

In the real world, you won't find trucks pulling themselves back onto 4 or more wheels, they'll be calling a tow truck.

All the scout vehicles can be fitted with an autonomous winch, which can be used when the vehicles engine is disabled.

Games are meant to have challenges, this is a game, in this game vehicle recovery is part of playing.

You need to be prepared to bring another vehicle for recovery.

[BlkBlazzin]

Umm...."Bad news is, winches in real world are designed to pull you out when the vehicle is still on at least 3 wheels.."
Thats false. Roll overs are common in 0ff-roading. If you have done any off roading you will see this happen without. Esspecially with people that are off roading alone. Not suggested but we do it anyway. even if it doesn't have a roll cage. If its a slow flip (Which it should be if you are off roading. Meaning you tipped over rather than roll down a hill or something. If you tip on to your side and you are surrounded by big trees and big rocks you rig and flip it back over. This is common in off roading.

Umm..."Real world, as you say, they are meant to pull you out of bogs etc.."

I never mentioned a single body of dense viscus liquid such as deep mud and bogs. I tipped over. There are plenty of rigging points around me. And I can't winch. Which in the real world generally would not happen. Because winches are usually battery powered because they want them to still work even if the vehicle isn't running. I have seen this too. Plenty because sometimes when you roll over its onto you roof. You don't want to leave your vehicle running when its not right side up. I have also seen winches break and cables break because people tried to pull a heavy vehicle made even heavier by being submerged in a bog or deep mud. That is a lot of weight. And a lot of stored energy in that cable when you start pulling. This is also common in off roading. There is a lot of safety and skill needed to recover a vehicle without killing somebody or damaging your vehicle. Winches are your friend.

And so I stand behind my rant. If I tip over and I am not trying to winch back up a cliff face or something (because these are very heavy trucks but are equipped with heavy duty winches. The game wants to make challenges. I agree. You don't want it to be easy. But...this is what it makes me do. I flip. I then have to get another vehicle. Drive to the 1st flipped vehicle with the 2nd vehicle and then.....connect a winch to it and flip it. So...you gotta ask.....what was the difference? Using an additional vehicle with a winch as the attachment point for the winch on the 2nd vehicle while ignoring the winch and the dozens of winch connection points rather than just using the flipped vehicles winch and simply winching back onto my wheels. The only difference being that the flipped vehicle was recovered using a second vehicle as the attachment point rather than the tree next to where the 2nd vehicle parked at in order to attach the 2nd winch to you. ITs like if you have a gun and need a gun but can't use it because it on its side so I gotta bring my gun because yours obviously can't be used because its on its side. Quick...somebody bring a 2nd gun because the primary gun is its side. It can not be fired. It don't make any sense. Winches are designed for this use. Nobody wants to flip...but its common. Its not a rare thing. And its literally 100% of the reason that a lot of people put a winch on their off roroad vehicle in the first place especially if you will be going by yourself. So when a game makes challenges that don't exist in order to make it challenging I face palm. Devs that do the "You gotta craft 1 of these in order to be able to craft this other thing. And its like....Ok. Screw in light bulb and now for some reason you can craft a lamp. Skill leveled up. Ok....I guess it works. Pretty lazy and uncreative but it works. Like this game. Very lazy with challenges. But well done. I am having a ton of fun. But things frustrate me such as when I flip I can't just load a previous save and start again before flipping. So since I can't do that the least they can do is not make me have to go to get an additional vehicle with a winch in order to flip and recover a vehicle using the winch even though that the vehicle being recovered has its own winch and crane. What the additional vehicle is for is beyond me. I have all I need on the flipped vehicle. I already gotta flip over then pick up my cargo. I got enough to do challengewise. I don't need them making me have to go to get another vehicle for no reason other than to be an attachment point. I don't need a 2nd vehicle. I just want to be able to use on my winch. When a vehicle flips it may not be able to turn on. But the winch still works. This here is goofy. make it that way in Hard mode or something for people that want unrealistic challenges like survival game fanatics. They want games that are harder than real life.

[Bobby]

What are you winching? A scout or a heavy?? Scouts recover quite easily -exactly like off-roading mud pluggers. They have battery winches and can self right no problem. Your not going to recovery a heavy with a winch unless it’s running off the engine and it’s using its drive to help the winch, which if it’s flipped no chance! Since engines don’t like running while pistons are filling up with sump oil….. heavy recovery trucks with outriggers are used to recover such vehicles -again- hence the heavy Crane attachment. Or use another heavy to push or try and pull with good drive and a strong winch + engine. And of course the highest capable winch on the truck. Forces are also a factor in the game and angles.
Same applies in MudRunner or Spintires, though you need +to enable battery winch on scouts. Have a look at heavy wrecker recovery trucks on YouTube and see the rotator used along with pulleys and other trucks to recover the weight of these things on to wheels.
It’s a pain, but so is real life.

[Thermal Lance]

This is a videogame...

[Bobby]

Originally posted by Thermal Lance:

This is a videogame...

A simulation that models weight, friction and energy. It pays to be attentive when you buy.
If you want a de facto ‘video game’, then buy a side scroller or one that doesn’t model ballistics, crash damage, inertia, deformable surfaces, wind, fuel consumption, parts wear, punctures etc. because they are simulations not video games.
Certainly not the video games you are expecting or classifying in your flippant choice of words.

Simulators used to train truck drivers or pilots are ‘video games’ in your opinion then?

[Thermal Lance]

Originally posted by Brian the Snail:

Originally posted by Thermal Lance:

This is a videogame...

A simulation that models weight, friction and energy. It pays to be attentive when you buy.
If you want a de facto ‘video game’, then buy a side scroller or one that doesn’t model ballistics, crash damage, inertia, deformable surfaces, wind, fuel consumption, parts wear, punctures etc. because they are simulations not video games.
Certainly not the video games you are expecting or classifying in your flippant choice of words.

Simulators used to train truck drivers or pilots are ‘video games’ in your opinion then?

This is not a hardcore, true to life, simulator. It's "realistic" in the sense that most people feels it as believable. I don't exactly expect everything to be like it "should".

Bringing up professional-grade simulators in this discussion is hilarious thought. I'm gonna give you that.

[MarkJohnson]

Originally posted by BlkBlazzin:

Need I say more? The vehicle has a winch. The winch is not gas powered. Nobody would put a gas powered winch in a off-road vehicle. If you flip....you just winch up and your on your way in less than 5 mins.

This is completely false. If you roll over any vehicle it is literally impossible to flip it back over. A winch pulls you forward. that is it. It can't flip you over unless you're at the right angle and a perfect slop with nothing in the way. Which never happens when by yourself.

This game in unrealistic in that it has winches on all 4 sides of your vehicle. IRL, if you flip your truck over you are walking all day to get out, or flag someone down to help get you out. And you don't use another truck's winch on your vehicle. you use the other passengers to push it back over.

This game is in super easy mode as far as winching goes.

Then the game saves every 5 seconds and its one of those games where when a save happens the game has a stroke and stutters while your trying to play.

Looks like time to upgrade your computer.

You can't choose when it saves and you can't pick from a save list so you can't even reload a previous save when your vehicle flips and you don't feel like starting from square one because you can't just winch your vehicle from off of its side.

This is probably the most realistic part of the game. Now you only need to add the walk of shame back home.

Wish I could just use my winch like in the real world. When your vehicle flips,,,,when that is 100% a time that you would use your freaking winch. Who would not??

You have obviously never owned a 4x4. If you flip your truck, the worst thing to do is use a winch, unless you want to destroy your truck.

Who's idea was it to make it so you couldn't? Tell him that was a retarded idea. Then go to the guy that approved it and hand him some dog poop for approving that crap.

Ironically, the game does let you do this with little to no damage and in an unrealistic manner of having a winch on all sides of your truck..

Only the autonomous winch uses electricity. All other winches run off your PTO (power Take off) on your transmission in your vehicle. So, yes, they run on fuel so they won't work if you roll your truck over.

[Ixia Irisborne]

Yeah, this is a pet peeve of mine with this game. There are *hand powered* winches. It would be laboriously slow, but that would fit 105% with this game.

[Bobby]

Originally posted by Thermal Lance:

Originally posted by Brian the Snail:

A simulation that models weight, friction and energy. It pays to be attentive when you buy.
If you want a de facto ‘video game’, then buy a side scroller or one that doesn’t model ballistics, crash damage, inertia, deformable surfaces, wind, fuel consumption, parts wear, punctures etc. because they are simulations not video games.
Certainly not the video games you are expecting or classifying in your flippant choice of words.

Simulators used to train truck drivers or pilots are ‘video games’ in your opinion then?

This is not a hardcore, true to life, simulator. It's "realistic" in the sense that most people feels it as believable. I don't exactly expect everything to be like it "should".

Bringing up professional-grade simulators in this discussion is hilarious thought. I'm gonna give you that.

Whatever….to deflect the stupid comment you made, you have to justify something about it eh? It’s a ‘video game’ though like this is https://youtu.be/Lqx2KKWI8aM
The word ‘simulation’ is to simulate real world. Video game comment is something a person that hasn’t played a pc in their life properly and just pushed it aside. Are you a gamer or just out to start an argument…. Cause from my viewpoint you aren’t and it’s a laughable reply.

[Thermal Lance]

Originally posted by Brian the Snail:

Originally posted by Thermal Lance:

This is not a hardcore, true to life, simulator. It's "realistic" in the sense that most people feels it as believable. I don't exactly expect everything to be like it "should".

Bringing up professional-grade simulators in this discussion is hilarious thought. I'm gonna give you that.

Whatever….to deflect the stupid comment you made, you have to justify something about it eh? It’s a ‘video game’ though like this is https://youtu.be/Lqx2KKWI8aM
The word ‘simulation’ is to simulate real world. Video game comment is something a person that hasn’t played a pc in their life properly and just pushed it aside. Are you a gamer or just out to start an argument…. Cause from my viewpoint you aren’t and it’s a laughable reply.

So you think this game PROPERLY simulate an off-road experience or something? Then start pulling dodgy comparisons out of your ass then I'm the moron here?

Lmao. Go touch some grass and do actual off-road. This is about as much of a simulation than MSFS 97. XD

[MarkJohnson]

Originally posted by Ixia Irisborne:

Yeah, this is a pet peeve of mine with this game. There are *hand powered* winches. It would be laboriously slow, but that would fit 105% with this game.

I haven't seen one of these on a truck in a long time. I remember when I was young, my neighbor bought a 1950s boom truck that had an optional (emergency) hand crank to use on the winch, in case you lost power or had engine trouble.

Or do you mean a portable hand ratchet winch? They half-ass work and scare the hell out of me. Of course, I buy the cheapo ones. I use them more for tie downs, than winching out vehicles. But if it's all you have?

[Marcin_89]

In Real World, vehicles engines won`t turn off if are overturned...

[Mieumieu]

It's simply part of the challenge of the game, the way they decided to do it. Not everything is realistic but I don't think we'd want it to be either, they left out a lot of the bad realism. The way these cars drive on asphalt here for instance, that is very unrealistic. The way the cars drive in low mud and dabs of snow isn't that real either really. But the vehicles also don't get stuck in places that they definitely would in real life, so I don't complain about it not being perfect.

You want more realism with the winches? Well, people are trying to point out that more realism with them doesn't mean it would always be a better thing.

It's a part of the challenge to this game. Tipping over is not supposed to be a minor inconvenience you quickly winch your way back up with. They did let us do that with scout vehicles, but no it is not realistic with the trucks.

It's already a lot easier than it is it real to upright them with another vehicle and keep going, your load intact, etc. I don't know about winching trucks that much in real life, but I have seen the big machinery they usually pull out to upright these things. If it was as easy as the driver just winching them back over, then they would do that, but it's not. It's a big job and they're charged thousands of dollars to get them put upright again.

I don't know if you're playing the version where you got all these advanced DLC trucks right off and started to use them instead of the base starting trucks, so maybe you think the game is more arcade like than it is, or more about straight delivery than it is. It's about the tip overs too. It's about deciding to take the long way around so you won't tip over and have to deal with that. Or knowing the area where you would tip, and leaving another vehicle nearby at all times to help upright things.

If you choose to take that shorter route and aren't careful enough and tip over, there are supposed to be consequences and more game play aspects to do to fix that. Not just simply winching your way back up.

They simplified a lot of things already in the game, but maybe you're looking more for a normal delivery sim. There are some great truck delivery games out there about driving and delivering where you don't deal with tip overs or difficult muddy driving.

The tip overs in this game and having to deal with them without just winching back upright are part of the experience here. It is the punishment for failing to keep it upright or taking the shorter route. And again, if it's happening that often, position other trucks you wouldn't normally use for much out by the rough areas and leave them there.

[Thermal Lance]

Originally posted by MewmewGirl:

It's simply part of the challenge of the game, the way they decided to do it. Not everything is realistic but I don't think we'd want it to be either, they left out a lot of the bad realism. The way these cars drive on asphalt here for instance, that is very unrealistic. The way the cars drive in low mud and dabs of snow isn't that real either really. But the vehicles also don't get stuck in places that they definitely would in real life, so I don't complain about it not being perfect.

You want more realism with the winches? Well, people are trying to point out that more realism with them doesn't mean it would always be a better thing.

It's a part of the challenge to this game. Tipping over is not supposed to be a minor inconvenience you quickly winch your way back up with. They did let us do that with scout vehicles, but no it is not realistic with the trucks.

It's already a lot easier than it is it real to upright them with another vehicle and keep going, your load intact, etc. I don't know about winching trucks that much in real life, but I have seen the big machinery they usually pull out to upright these things. If it was as easy as the driver just winching them back over, then they would do that, but it's not. It's a big job and they're charged thousands of dollars to get them put upright again.

I don't know if you're playing the version where you got all these advanced DLC trucks right off and started to use them instead of the base starting trucks, so maybe you think the game is more arcade like than it is, or more about straight delivery than it is. It's about the tip overs too. It's about deciding to take the long way around so you won't tip over and have to deal with that. Or knowing the area where you would tip, and leaving another vehicle nearby at all times to help upright things.

If you choose to take that shorter route and aren't careful enough and tip over, there are supposed to be consequences and more game play aspects to do to fix that. Not just simply winching your way back up.

They simplified a lot of things already in the game, but maybe you're looking more for a normal delivery sim. There are some great truck delivery games out there about driving and delivering where you don't deal with tip overs or difficult muddy driving.

The tip overs in this game and having to deal with them without just winching back upright are part of the experience here. It is the punishment for failing to keep it upright or taking the shorter route. And again, if it's happening that often, position other trucks you wouldn't normally use for much out by the rough areas and leave them there.

Great post. :)

[BlkBlazzin]

@Brian the Snail - The game is fun as heck. I wanted to winch this 8x8 thing. Its cool. It literally tipped over so softly. It took no damage at all. I am surrounded by attachment points. Its just annoying. I could see if I rolled it down a hill and it took damage. But when you just need to re-right your vehicle and you have a winch its face palming. Still having fun though.

@MarkJohnson - "If you roll over any vehicle it is literally impossible to flip it back over." Weird cause I have not only see it done in real life and in videos but I have done it myself. The only time you ever need a 2nd vehicle is if you can not find a attachment point that agrees with the angle of your vehicle. Just search YT and you will find people doing it. Also...I am not sure where the hyper realistic stuff came into play. I did mention my opinion that "The winch is not gas powered. Nobody would put a gas powered winch in a off-road vehicle." I said this because in the game when you tip over on your side...the vehicle shuts off. This makes perfect sense. But I took no damage. I am surrounded by trees. And they give you attachment points that are all over the vehicle. Not just where the winch is. Its as if the truck has multiple winches on it. I'm not complaining. It works. But....why does the winch not work simply because the vehicle is on its side? Is it not battery powered?? If any time there was to winch...it would be when one has a slow roll over that does not damage your vehicle. You roll it....then drive off. My boy flipped his jeep like 1000 times. Its a toy to us. The only time we couldn't re-right it was when he got it stuck in clay. We had no angle. Your not just pulling a vehicle out of clay without a good angle. His cousin had to come pull him out. I simply just want to be able to re right my vehicle after a slow roll over. Straight up tumbling down a hill in understandable. Slow roll over with no damage...let me winch it.

Also you said I have never owned an offroad truck. I have had 7. I'm on my 8th right now. I only drive jeeps. Grand Cherokees are my favorite but I just got a commander. Its fun. Still got to mod it. All my toy jeeps have winches that worked with the car running or not. Thats what they are to me. Toys. I don't drive them to work or the store. I have another for that. See....cars have these things called batteries. Obviously its not an endless supply of power. The car charges it. It cares not what position your car is it. It will work. If the winch asks for power the battery will give it to it.