Why I Like Modern Yugioh

[JKArtorias]

The card design has improved massively, whether it be card text to make a more complicated and freeing experience, card art having many different styles or the archetypes having fun themes like Space Fish, Vtuber Thieves or ♥♥♥♥♥♥ Sushi Boats.

Having card interactions that can make you genuinely sit and go hmm how will this work. Is such a fun experience both in match and in deck building.

The speed of the game allowing players to come back from complete losses with a single draw on an empty board is also incredibly fun and healthy for any game. It turns a match where halfway through you go "Yup i've lost if my board is wiped" into something you know you can still win with a decent draw off the top.

Decks not following the same theme. Every deck can be different and is different. The Extra Deck isn't just for bosses, the main deck can just be set up and all the good monsters can be in the Extra or no Extra at all.

Then we have fun things like Exosister. Girls who if the opponent removes something from the GY aka reviving the dead they become there angel warrior forms. The main 2 banishing instead of sending to GY and the Trap where they're fighting a Demon to banish it actually banishing what they're targeting as long as you control an Exosister is really cool.

Suship's requiring opponents to pay for the Suship and select which Suship they want you to have like they're ordering is so funny.
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TLDR: I like Modern Yugioh. :)

[Merilirem]

Modern Yugioh is definitely full of cool stuff. They just need to find ways to fix the inherent flaws made due to not understanding how to make a game like Yugioh 20 years ago. I believe they are trying though. Decks like Floo and Tear for instance work to make the game less one sided while still having the higher intensity that oldschool oldschool yugioh lacked. I genuinely think a perfect game could be made by learning from Yugioh as it is now and just remaking it from the ground up. I would for instance just build Simultaneous turns into the games core rules so we didn't need to print cards to compensate for being unable to stop the opponents plays.

Also I would start with an ED full of cards like Gate Guardian, ritual monsters and Horus lv8 who shouldn't be in the main deck to begin with.

[C.C. 折オリ枝 の 夫]

Meh, I don't think simultaneous turns are a good idea, but rather, they should make better going 2nd cards.

Rikka Konkon, Tearlaments Havnis, Naturia Molecricket, Incredible Ecclesia, the Virtuous, those are all good examples of good going 2nd cards.

If they remove the busted going 2nd cards such as Evenly Matched, Maxx "C", etc, where "draw the out" isn't needed on both sides, and make some good going 2nd cards, the game would be in a much better state.

[nightmareside15]

Agreed.
Those new cards aren't even make your deck super OP or anything ( such as bystial in dragon link), but rather make it more playable if you got turn 2 nightmare, or getting Dark ruler no more by the very next turn.
TBH even my dragunity line up would be more OP since it include buster - lock, but getting turn 2 would be a nightmare.

The banlist still a disaster tho,

[Daguza]

Origineel geplaatst door JKArtorias:

The card design has improved massively, whether it be card text to make a more complicated and freeing experience, card art having many different styles or the archetypes having fun themes like Space Fish, Vtuber Thieves or ♥♥♥♥♥♥ Sushi Boats.

Lies, everyone complains about how much card text there is. Especially on pendulum cards. Also there's always been different themes and art styles. It's so bad that a lotof players specialy newer ones would rather scoop then sit and read to figure out what's going on. Helps propagate the Yugiho players don read meme lol.

Origineel geplaatst door JKArtorias:

Having card interactions that can make you genuinely sit and go hmm how will this work. Is such a fun experience both in match and in deck building.

It's fun when I get interrupted or negated for sure bro... But it can be fun to build decks sometimes, I'll give you that. Altho a lot of deck are invalidated by Bystial now so It feels like there a lot less viable deck that be made.

Origineel geplaatst door JKArtorias:

The speed of the game allowing players to come back from complete losses with a single draw on an empty board is also incredibly fun and healthy for any game. It turns a match where halfway through you go "Yup i've lost if my board is wiped" into something you know you can still win with a decent draw off the top.

Not true, 90% of the time if the opponent ever get any kind of momentum on you it feel hopeless and better just too scoop and go next next. Only time maybe that's true if you running a going 2nd deck. But going 2nd deck suck in master duel for sure because going 1st and setting up a unstoppable bored is more proven consistent way to win in yugigo.

Origineel geplaatst door JKArtorias:

Then we have fun things like Exosister. Girls who if the opponent removes something from the GY aka reviving the dead they become there angel warrior forms. The main 2 banishing instead of sending to GY and the Trap where they're fighting a Demon to banish it actually banishing what they're targeting as long as you control an Exosister is really cool.

I like the concept of Exorcist Nuns for sure but anyone that plays against this deck sure ain't having fun. The multiple quick effect banish if you didn't draw a out is unfair. I usually just roll my eyes when I run in to this deck and go next. Not fun...

[Papa Shekels]

I think it's cool that they expanded different art directions, but I kind of prefer the old card arts that had these grotesque monsters with trippy backgrounds. There is something cool about that simplicity that is kind of lost in many of the modern cards. Although it is also definitely cool when cards like exosisters have backgrounds with so much detail and lore to them. It's just cool in general, card art has always been one of the most distinguishing factors of yugioh.

The interactions are the other most distinctive aspect. After the goat era, people developed so many janky ideas for decks and those only went further and further off the deep end since then. By this point, archetypes guide them in a certain direction but it definitely allows for even more creativity with how many generic options exist. Magic the gathering also has some crazy stuff possible with their cards, but I feel like they are different levels of crazy. There's a reason this game is the one infamous for long card text and complicated rulings, and it absolutely is exciting when you go through five layers of interactions to finally break a board.

The pacing is a hit or miss, it is fun to play midrange decks that can recover from a board wipe but the momentum swings can get out of hand at different power levels. This would be more of a specific level than any general game idea, but some decks just get way too much advantage out of a single card. It can get frustrating to be in a top deck war and suddenly one normal summon ends on a full board through disruption

[Candarian]

dont forget that u dont have to think anymore
just pray u win the coin flip :P

[Adonan]

I feel like this is a response to that other thread pointing out the modern game's flaws.

[DeathDweller]

Origineel geplaatst door Adonan:

I feel like this is a response to that other thread pointing out the modern game's flaws.

Cause that's what it is

[Zaebore]

On a creative and art direction standpoint I have to say I do like Yugioh's design on the cards and the themes the cards represent for the archetypes they belong in. It can be detailed and organized to a point if they can flesh out or promote background stories to the cards. The two best examples is the storyline of Albaz and the World Legacy. If they can make writing comparable to the scale of these two stories for the yugioh cards they want it would be a great investment and the community would probably love it if it is done well. Other than that I have no idea what Visas Starfrost is doing but maybe it might catch my interest someday if they have something big planned for it.

[Merilirem]

Origineel geplaatst door C.C. アヌビス:

Meh, I don't think simultaneous turns are a good idea, but rather, they should make better going 2nd cards.

Rikka Konkon, Tearlaments Havnis, Naturia Molecricket, Incredible Ecclesia, the Virtuous, those are all good examples of good going 2nd cards.

If they remove the busted going 2nd cards such as Evenly Matched, Maxx "C", etc, where "draw the out" isn't needed on both sides, and make some good going 2nd cards, the game would be in a much better state.

The problem with going second cards is that they require you to play them. You just can't balance pure going second cards properly because end of the day you need to draw them when you go second. So this means pure going second deck or they are 50% useless for going first. Unless you want to make them like Maxx C and have them be always useful, if not a little less powerful. Still becomes a game of drawing the out though.

Simultaneous turns is far superior because it becomes how the game is played. You don't just add cards to deal with situations. You build a deck that can deal with situations on both turns. It inherently stops those big boards from being an issue unless you brick.

Like how exactly do you make better going second cards that aren't just making us have Simulturns anyway?

[Yerc2]

YuGiOh certainly has evolved into a good single-player game.
Even though it's shifted away from a TCG with strategy and player interaction, it's still a pretty decent gacha/collecting game.

Since they've abandoned the concept of making a balanced card game with more than a few viable decks at a time, it is kind of strange that they haven't put more effort into getting the lore and story out there on display.
Some of the archetypes have pretty neat stories outright, or through theorising.

In terms of gameplay. the newer mechanics and gimmicks are neat in concept, and they would be more enjoyable if the game wasn't experiencing as much powercreep as it is.

Even though the gameplay has pretty much devolved into a coinflip simulator with next to no player interaction, it is still able to keep my attention, and I am still able to find some fun in playing it.
As glaring as the flaws are in this game, I still prefer to play it over other card-based games.

[Serx]

I'm hearing you and I'm glad you are having fun. Took me a little to get use to the pace of the game. Some of it was finding the right deck. But I feel like everything you said is true about basically all eras of yugioh.

[Papa Shekels]

Origineel geplaatst door Merilirem:

Simultaneous turns is far superior because it becomes how the game is played. You don't just add cards to deal with situations. You build a deck that can deal with situations on both turns. It inherently stops those big boards from being an issue unless you brick.

Like how exactly do you make better going second cards that aren't just making us have Simulturns anyway?

The biggest issue with that is that it makes everything prior to that obsolete. It's going to reach a point where anything that hasn't allowed you to set up some kind of a board while your opponent did theirs is now too slow to be viable. If you are going second and do not have anything set up by the time your first turn starts, you basically already lost. The game isn't yet at a point like that but I'm not sure if I want it to move in that direction. Reactive cards like gamma and other hand traps are kind of teetering on the edge, but cards like merrli or the ishizus are really pushing it into dangerous territory. I feel like the only exceptions I would validate would be something like the labrynth furniture or support for decks like ghoti/metaphys that are always playing a turn behind just due to how their decks function

[TormentedSalad]

Origineel geplaatst door Adonan:

I feel like this is a response to that other thread pointing out the modern game's flaws.

You mean the echo chamber the guy basically screamed blocked at anyone who disagreed.

As for this mostly agree except card design is still mixed I feel like sometimes they are going in a good direction at least until a nice looking cliff appears and I really can't agree on exosisters I will never see the appeal of a one note deck like that because I don't see girl and lose all rational thought.

[Merilirem]

Origineel geplaatst door Papa Shekels:

Origineel geplaatst door Merilirem:

Simultaneous turns is far superior because it becomes how the game is played. You don't just add cards to deal with situations. You build a deck that can deal with situations on both turns. It inherently stops those big boards from being an issue unless you brick.

Like how exactly do you make better going second cards that aren't just making us have Simulturns anyway?

The biggest issue with that is that it makes everything prior to that obsolete. It's going to reach a point where anything that hasn't allowed you to set up some kind of a board while your opponent did theirs is now too slow to be viable. If you are going second and do not have anything set up by the time your first turn starts, you basically already lost. The game isn't yet at a point like that but I'm not sure if I want it to move in that direction. Reactive cards like gamma and other hand traps are kind of teetering on the edge, but cards like merrli or the ishizus are really pushing it into dangerous territory. I feel like the only exceptions I would validate would be something like the labrynth furniture or support for decks like ghoti/metaphys that are always playing a turn behind just due to how their decks function

See the thing is we already have that problem anyway. You already need to try and play on both turns to survive with the exception of niches like pure going first or second decks which won't go anywhere.

You don't need to do setups on your opponents turn but you DO need your deck to be inherently capable of playing at all times. This was done with traps and flips at first. Then hand traps went beyond Kuribo when normal traps and flips became too slow and vulnerable. The game either has to go find a stage of itself where the power and ability to end the game in any sense before both players have had a few turns is nonexistent outside a gimmick deck or it has to move on to its natural evolution which is the ability to play cards on your opponents turn without sacrificing combo potential. Stuff like Havnis or cards that simply have 2 effects. Like say a monster that was a hand trap like imperm but also special summoned itself if you had nothing on field. So on your turn its a body of board but on the enemy turn its a combo breaker.

The current middle-ground state we exist in now is not at all a good compromise. People that think the game is a coin flip for instance don't realize there are 2-3 very different types of Yugioh coexisting. The low powered 2005 style with flips n traps and monsters only on your own turn. The mid range with all sorts of hand traps and specialized outs to unbreakable boards which can completely win on turn 1 if you don't stop them because OTKing is easy enough you won't make it turn 3. Then there is the Tear/Floo type of Yugioh where both players fight it out on every turn. The second one is the worst imo because its way too yes/no while 1 and 3 are so different in approach to the same goal of playing together that they can't coexist without 1 becoming 3. 1 becoming 3 being something like Eldlich getting Havnis effects.