seriously why is crossout designator at 1?

[Korgoth of Barbaria]

we need it at 2 yeah i hate being on the receiving end of it but we need it at 2 rn in this hand trap riddled meta not even mentioning the fact of sprights, punks, and runicks dominating so many deck lists

[Darigaaz]

Ban Maxx "C", Ban Crossout, Ban Called by. All part of the problem for Turn 1 domination

[Furry Garbage]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von C.C. アヌビス:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Furry Garbage:

Maxx "C" should be outright banned, Ash Blossom should be at 2, Called By should be at 3, Crossout should be at 3.

Maxx "C" - agree
Ash - disagree, she's fine as she is
Called By - hell no, if the bug goes away, this should go to 1, thing is way too versatile
Crossout - yea, if the bug is banned, it won't see much play anyway

Called By and Crossout are primarily answers to hand traps. They should never be limited so long as most/all hand traps are allowed at 3 in a format. It'd be different if the entire Ash cycle & Veiler were at 1 or 2, but they are not. If the answers to the answers are causing problems in a format, that points twords a larger problem with the format itself that more than likely won't be resolvable without other bans/limits. The answers to the answers are never the actual problem in any card game.

[Yerc2]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Darigaaz:

Ban Maxx "C", Ban Crossout, Ban Called by. All part of the problem for Turn 1 domination

In regards to Maxx "C" and Ash-
In the current state of the game, just banning those cards would make turn 1 domination/lockout issue worse since those cards and their mandatory-ness are a symptom of and attempted way to fight back against turn 1 lockout decks.
Even though those handtraps can be usually played through or around, they can on rare occasion change the outcome of a match, depending on card draws, of course.

To snip the issue in the bud in a healthy way, they'd need do a MAJOR banlist overhaul of the enabling consistency and/or card advantage and control cards that allow people to set up lockout boards on turn 1.
Doesn't make sense to take off a bandaid when the wound isn't healed~

And IMO, things like Crossout and Called By wouldn't be as big of an issue if we weren't in such a meta based around turn 1 lockout. Those cards could allow for interesting play without major issue, if they weren't mainly used as a safety net for the stronger decks in the current state of the game.
It's like special summoning a ludicrous amount of times to prevent your opponent from being able to play is the crux of the issue, and because of how powerful that is, it's changing the value of other cards. And that issue can't be fixed by banning a few cards.

[C.C. 折オリ枝 の 夫]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Furry Garbage:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von C.C. アヌビス:

Maxx "C" - agree
Ash - disagree, she's fine as she is
Called By - hell no, if the bug goes away, this should go to 1, thing is way too versatile
Crossout - yea, if the bug is banned, it won't see much play anyway

Called By and Crossout are primarily answers to hand traps. They should never be limited so long as most/all hand traps are allowed at 3 in a format. It'd be different if the entire Ash cycle & Veiler were at 1 or 2, but they are not. If the answers to the answers are causing problems in a format, that points twords a larger problem with the format itself that more than likely won't be resolvable without other bans/limits. The answers to the answers are never the actual problem in any card game.

The thing is, you're wrong.

You see, in the TCG, which is the only format where Crossout is at 3 and Maxx "C" banned, the card isn't played, it's not seeing use against hand traps.

Called By on the other hand, IF all it did was to affect hand traps, it could easily go to 3, nobody would care, problem is, it doesn't do only that. If you summon a monster of which you also have a copy in the GY, CBTG is a not only a quick-play negate, but applies a lingering effect until the end of the next turn, so it shuts down that monster for 2 turns. Cards that tribute themselves or need to be tributed, are also affected, basically, if there's any copy of a monster in your GY, it can be negated.

Also, one big thing that people overlook is that CBTG can also be used proactively, not just reactively. If you have a copy of something in your GY and I know it's important, I can hit it during my turn, and you can't use it during your turn.

CBTG is so extremely powerful, and toxic, due to how much it can affect non-hand traps on top of applying a lingering effect that can't be interacted with for 2 whole turns.

[Furry Garbage]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von C.C. アヌビス:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Furry Garbage:

Called By and Crossout are primarily answers to hand traps. They should never be limited so long as most/all hand traps are allowed at 3 in a format. It'd be different if the entire Ash cycle & Veiler were at 1 or 2, but they are not. If the answers to the answers are causing problems in a format, that points twords a larger problem with the format itself that more than likely won't be resolvable without other bans/limits. The answers to the answers are never the actual problem in any card game.

The thing is, you're wrong.

You see, in the TCG, which is the only format where Crossout is at 3 and Maxx "C" banned, the card isn't played, it's not seeing use against hand traps.

Called By on the other hand, IF all it did was to affect hand traps, it could easily go to 3, nobody would care, problem is, it doesn't do only that. If you summon a monster of which you also have a copy in the GY, CBTG is a not only a quick-play negate, but applies a lingering effect until the end of the next turn, so it shuts down that monster for 2 turns. Cards that tribute themselves or need to be tributed, are also affected, basically, if there's any copy of a monster in your GY, it can be negated.

Also, one big thing that people overlook is that CBTG can also be used proactively, not just reactively. If you have a copy of something in your GY and I know it's important, I can hit it during my turn, and you can't use it during your turn.

CBTG is so extremely powerful, and toxic, due to how much it can affect non-hand traps on top of applying a lingering effect that can't be interacted with for 2 whole turns.

I'm sorry, but all I can see with this is a player who wants to full combo turn 1 every game. If a card is an answer to an answer that precludes it from being a problem. This applies to any card game, not just Yugioh.

[HeraldOfOpera]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Furry Garbage:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von C.C. アヌビス:

The thing is, you're wrong.

You see, in the TCG, which is the only format where Crossout is at 3 and Maxx "C" banned, the card isn't played, it's not seeing use against hand traps.

Called By on the other hand, IF all it did was to affect hand traps, it could easily go to 3, nobody would care, problem is, it doesn't do only that. If you summon a monster of which you also have a copy in the GY, CBTG is a not only a quick-play negate, but applies a lingering effect until the end of the next turn, so it shuts down that monster for 2 turns. Cards that tribute themselves or need to be tributed, are also affected, basically, if there's any copy of a monster in your GY, it can be negated.

Also, one big thing that people overlook is that CBTG can also be used proactively, not just reactively. If you have a copy of something in your GY and I know it's important, I can hit it during my turn, and you can't use it during your turn.

CBTG is so extremely powerful, and toxic, due to how much it can affect non-hand traps on top of applying a lingering effect that can't be interacted with for 2 whole turns.

I'm sorry, but all I can see with this is a player who wants to full combo turn 1 every game. If a card is an answer to an answer that precludes it from being a problem. This applies to any card game, not just Yugioh.

Except... CBTG is primarily a tool to help you full combo turn 1. By negating hand traps. That's why it's a) clearly OP and b) a necessary evil while Maxx "C" also exists.

[Bad Distraction Carnifex]

Basically, it's at 1 because of Maxx "C" and OCG's Stockholm syndrome when it comes to that card. It was countering the broken bug and OCG can't have none of that, nosir.

It was also a consistency card for Floo, who at the time were a problem. Not so much anymore.

[Darigaaz]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Yerc2:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Darigaaz:

Ban Maxx "C", Ban Crossout, Ban Called by. All part of the problem for Turn 1 domination

In regards to Maxx "C" and Ash-
In the current state of the game, just banning those cards would make turn 1 domination/lockout issue worse since those cards and their mandatory-ness are a symptom of and attempted way to fight back against turn 1 lockout decks.
Even though those handtraps can be usually played through or around, they can on rare occasion change the outcome of a match, depending on card draws, of course.

To snip the issue in the bud in a healthy way, they'd need do a MAJOR banlist overhaul of the enabling consistency and/or card advantage and control cards that allow people to set up lockout boards on turn 1.
Doesn't make sense to take off a bandaid when the wound isn't healed~

And IMO, things like Crossout and Called By wouldn't be as big of an issue if we weren't in such a meta based around turn 1 lockout. Those cards could allow for interesting play without major issue, if they weren't mainly used as a safety net for the stronger decks in the current state of the game.
It's like special summoning a ludicrous amount of times to prevent your opponent from being able to play is the crux of the issue, and because of how powerful that is, it's changing the value of other cards. And that issue can't be fixed by banning a few cards.

Ash is fine Maxx C is the problem together with called by xD

[「AMOEBA」]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SkyllerSY:

It has nothing to do with maxx c.

TCG is a different thing done by different people.

It literally has everything to do with Maxx C. Everybody is running Maxx C in master duel, so why would you not run Crossout at 3 if you could?

Deck building space is already limited with people running Maxx C, Ash, Called By and Crossout, please don't limit it even more by allowing 3 copies of it. Would literally by 11 cards before even thinking about your archetype.