Someone explain why Lu Bu is a well designed fight

[X2F01]

To start, he wasn't hard for me. I died less than 5 times mostly because I was overly aggressive. Other than that, his fight was unfun. There's almost no openings to attack so the best way to fight is to just wait to parry then fatal strike and repeat until he's dead.

Every video I've seen of people fighting him do this same thing then say it was some intense duel. While on the horse, he runs away and arrows but if you chase, you get a couple hits in and he'll run away then more arrows. If you stay away from him then it's an easy way to get him to do his critical blow, parry then do it again to knock him off the horse. Brain dead phase.

Unmounted, he never stops attacking so you just sit there doing your parries until he gets staggered and he's dead. Its the worst fight in the game but he does have a lot of health so it feels like some artificial endurance that you're overcoming. If you're unlucky like I was, he'll remount multiple times so the fight lasts even longer.

I don't understand how anyone can say it was a good fight and every explanation I've read doesn't match at all with how the fight actually is.

[Plank]

He is the personification of my issues with the games design. When it comes down to it, you can't really use the flashy melee combos, martial arts and spells (besides utility ones) against anything more threatening than basic soldiers and zombies. You can't even basic attack Lu Bu more than once with some weapon types. It feels to me like there are two design philosophies in this game and they conflict regularly.

[Erdrick]

Just about to do Lu Bu on NG+ mmm

[Sneaky_Bugger]

He just exists to train your parry skills. It honestly feels like that. It´s a kinda fun boss it that regard and you can use some martial arts but it´s not the most efficient way more for style points. At least if you don´t build around MA. Maybe boosting MA enough makes it more viable.

[AH-1 Cobra]

Anyone who's played Dynasty Warriors knows that Lu Bu is the most badass of any of them, I think the cutscene before the fight does him service where he just grabs men and knocks them aside like bowling pins. They had to make it feel like you were fighting against all odds, and even after winning, he just rides off like it's no big deal.

[peep]

He's just soooooo tanky, he's easy to fight when he's on horse as he has few attacks. On ground he can be annoying but honestly I thought he was a great boss.

Liu Bei on the other hand... just a mess. They need to get rid of flying enemies if they make a sequel.

[X2F01]

Originally posted by Kazuya's bicep:

He is the personification of my issues with the games design. When it comes down to it, you can't really use the flashy melee combos, martial arts and spells (besides utility ones) against anything more threatening than basic soldiers and zombies. You can't even basic attack Lu Bu more than once with some weapon types. It feels to me like there are two design philosophies in this game and they conflict regularly.

Everything you said makes sense to me and I can't disagree but at the same time, it isn't bothering me as I'm playing. I do understand what you mean though.

Originally posted by Sneaky_Bugger|1200baud:

He just exists to train your parry skills. It honestly feels like that. It´s a kinda fun boss it that regard and you can use some martial arts but it´s not the most efficient way more for style points. At least if you don´t build around MA. Maybe boosting MA enough makes it more viable.

If he's just a skill check then I can kinda see why people like the fight because it's an accomplishment to learn your parry timings instead of just hoping you did it right. My build is mainly in fire with fast martial arts and slots on my gear that boost their damage and give buffs. It definitely works on other bosses.

[AH-1 Cobra]

I got summoned for Lu Bu in coop around 15 times, and none of the hosts won. I soloed him without a helper just fine. The mistake people are making is they seem to insist on running glass cannon builds (minus the cannon) without possessing the skill required to pilot those builds. If you lose by getting chonked right out of the gate, that's not a productive loss, you learned basically nothing from it. People trying to run light armor + dual blades thinking they're assassins or something, just to get assassinated in 1 or 2 shots.

It was honestly the same ♥♥♥♥ in Elden Ring with Malenia, scrubs getting chonked by the first waterfowl dance, that's a tougher fight than Lu Bu, but people are making basically the same mistake in both cases.

[Dasginosis]

His fight was ok. He is parry skill gatekeeper.
Only thing I hate about Lu bu is... Team ninja kill him off mid-story.

[X2F01]

Originally posted by crimsonedge11:

I got summoned for Lu Bu in coop around 15 times, and none of the hosts won. I soloed him without a helper just fine. The mistake people are making is they seem to insist on running glass cannon builds (minus the cannon) without possessing the skill required to pilot those builds. If you lose by getting chonked right out of the gate, that's not a productive loss, you learned basically nothing from it. People trying to run light armor + dual blades thinking they're assassins or something, just to get assassinated in 1 or 2 shots.

It was honestly the same ♥♥♥♥ in Elden Ring with Malenia, scrubs getting chonked by the first waterfowl dance, that's a tougher fight than Lu Bu, but people are making basically the same mistake in both cases.

This is why I died because I'm a glass cannon and his moveset doesn't really allow you to be that aggressive. He ungas before you bunga and you have to wait it out with parries. After I seen how he fights, its simple.

[AH-1 Cobra]

Originally posted by X2F01:

This is why I died because I'm a glass cannon and his moveset doesn't really allow you to be that aggressive. He ungas before you bunga and you have to wait it out with parries. After I seen how he fights, its simple.

I specced earth as a primary stat, plenty of good weapons also scale with it as the top scaling stat. You take a lot less damage with heavier armor, gives you more wiggle room. Heavier weapons are typically better at blocking as well, so I could block a few of his combo hits, and deflect, etc. With enough earth stat, even heavier armor can be brought to B agility (under 70% equip load), so there's basically no downside.

For as slow of a weapon as pole axe is, people would assume it's garbage for usage as a small window weapon, but it's perfectly suited to get 1 hit off against something that cannot be staggered. 1 axe slam does more than 5 dual blade hits.

[Cronofear]

Originally posted by Kazuya's bicep:

He is the personification of my issues with the games design. When it comes down to it, you can't really use the flashy melee combos, martial arts and spells (besides utility ones) against anything more threatening than basic soldiers and zombies. You can't even basic attack Lu Bu more than once with some weapon types. It feels to me like there are two design philosophies in this game and they conflict regularly.

I use martial arts and spells on Lu Bu all the time. In fact I have a martial arts build right now and I have helped people with Lu Bu and used the fights to tweak my build.

[Tenshu]

Originally posted by Dasginosis:

His fight was ok. He is parry skill gatekeeper.
Only thing I hate about Lu bu is... Team ninja kill him off mid-story.

I mean it's better than him dying in stage 2 of every DW game other than playing as him yourself, Lu Bu doesn't live long in this time period you know. I do find it a bit clever how they took liberties with how certain things happened to some figures though (Sun Jian getting lit up by arrows and how Xiahou Dun became visually assymetrical)

[Tenshu]

Originally posted by Cronofear:

Originally posted by Kazuya's bicep:

He is the personification of my issues with the games design. When it comes down to it, you can't really use the flashy melee combos, martial arts and spells (besides utility ones) against anything more threatening than basic soldiers and zombies. You can't even basic attack Lu Bu more than once with some weapon types. It feels to me like there are two design philosophies in this game and they conflict regularly.

I use martial arts and spells on Lu Bu all the time. In fact I have a martial arts build right now and I have helped people with Lu Bu and used the fights to tweak my build.

Offensive spells or utility spells? I find the offensive ones to take way too damn long to cast aside from ones that should be used to proc status ailments like burn/poison.