What is the best SA build/set...

[D. Flame]

... for someone who doesn't have Sunbreak?

[Laughing kookaburra]

Originally posted by overmage:

Originally posted by Laughing kookaburra:

surge slash is optimal, rage slash is optimal while Switchaxe without double slash morph is not, it has what other things ? CFD ? morphing spam like pre sunbreak ?

I have never seen a GS speedrun that didn't use strongarm TCS so idk what you mean by "surge slash is optimal"

Switchaxe also has aerial style (ZSD->soaring loop) which while in TU6 is a little weaker than morph slash spam is not weaker by much; certainly you cannot complain that it is not viable if you are saying in the same breath "surge slash is optimal" when strongarm TCS exists

there are surge slash speedrun on youtube, it's free.

aerial SA is meme, people only use ZSD before monster recover from a knockdown, nobody spams it like world

[AH-1 Cobra]

Originally posted by Laughing kookaburra:

aerial SA is meme, people only use ZSD before monster recover from a knockdown, nobody spams it like world

The top speed runs don't spam ZSD in world either. Spamming ZSD is just convenient to do in World using the rocksteady and temporal mantles, it's the most damage a lesser skilled player can do with the weapon, but still less than a really good player can do using the rest of the weapon's moveset. ZSD spam became popular with SA because it was one of the first methods for cheesing Fatalis.

[Zelph]

Originally posted by Laughing kookaburra:

Originally posted by overmage:

I have never seen a GS speedrun that didn't use strongarm TCS so idk what you mean by "surge slash is optimal"

Switchaxe also has aerial style (ZSD->soaring loop) which while in TU6 is a little weaker than morph slash spam is not weaker by much; certainly you cannot complain that it is not viable if you are saying in the same breath "surge slash is optimal" when strongarm TCS exists

there are surge slash speedrun on youtube, it's free.

aerial SA is meme, people only use ZSD before monster recover from a knockdown, nobody spams it like world

Please, provide a surge slash speed run video. Because everything that is on youtube looks like strongarm slash. After looking at 5-10 videos, it seems like it just may not exist.

[overmage]

Originally posted by Zelph:

Originally posted by Laughing kookaburra:

there are surge slash speedrun on youtube, it's free.

aerial SA is meme, people only use ZSD before monster recover from a knockdown, nobody spams it like world

Please, provide a surge slash speed run video. Because everything that is on youtube looks like strongarm slash. After looking at 5-10 videos, it seems like it just may not exist.

Also, if aerial SA is a meme then surge slash is a joke. Strongarm TCS outperforms it by a far higher margin than morph slash spam vs aerial; back in TU2 aerial was meta for some monsters and only started falling behind due to increasingly easy access to high base element

[Boiledteabag]

Originally posted by Laughing kookaburra:

Originally posted by HammyBread:

I prefer physical based builds tbh, or dragon. Since dragon applies to everything.
If you make one elemental build you have to copy and paste the build in the different elements and thats just a pain.

most monsters in the game have 0 dragon hzv, if you use dragon on them it's wasted. Physical is dead, maybe MH6 will be different

physical is dead? huh?
90% of what I've solo hunted, including bosses and elders was with physical.......... did just fine.......
I think you just think its dead, or maybe too many people min/max and forget to have fun. A majority of my builds are silly gimmick builds and mostly physical.

[Dagný]

Originally posted by HammyBread:

Originally posted by Laughing kookaburra:

most monsters in the game have 0 dragon hzv, if you use dragon on them it's wasted. Physical is dead, maybe MH6 will be different

physical is dead? huh?
90% of what I've solo hunted, including bosses and elders was with physical.......... did just fine...

You beating bosses and elders ,,just fine" doesn't make raw weapons less dead. Since you never even made elemental builds you shouldn't say anything about it.

[Boiledteabag]

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

Originally posted by HammyBread:

physical is dead? huh?
90% of what I've solo hunted, including bosses and elders was with physical.......... did just fine...

You beating bosses and elders ,,just fine" doesn't make raw weapons less dead. Since you never even made elemental builds you shouldn't say anything about it.

What an assumption, I have made elemental builds but as I said previously the make one you have to make them all per weapon type you like to play and that can get tedious.

Don't really feel like being a walking wiki and going "oh gotta switch X element set for this" every single hunt just because I don't feel compelled to min/max or meta each hunt.

[Dagný]

Originally posted by HammyBread:

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

You beating bosses and elders ,,just fine" doesn't make raw weapons less dead. Since you never even made elemental builds you shouldn't say anything about it.

What an assumption, I have made elemental builds but as I said previously the make one you have to make them all per weapon type you like to play and that can get tedious.

Don't really feel like being a walking wiki and going "oh gotta switch X element set for this" every single hunt just because I don't feel compelled to min/max or meta each hunt.

This post here is precisely why i never want to see raw meta on monster hunter ever again.
Lazy players always have to do less damage with their raw weapons.

[Remi]

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

Originally posted by HammyBread:

What an assumption, I have made elemental builds but as I said previously the make one you have to make them all per weapon type you like to play and that can get tedious.

Don't really feel like being a walking wiki and going "oh gotta switch X element set for this" every single hunt just because I don't feel compelled to min/max or meta each hunt.

This post here is precisely why i never want to see raw meta on monster hunter ever again.
Lazy players always have to do less damage with their raw weapons.

How about a middle ground where element is better than raw when used correctly, but also not completely overtuned like it is now in Sunbreak. Element was in a fine place in Iceborne until Lightbreak and Fatalis stomped previous elemental options for most weapons and matchups. Sunbreak's elemental bias is comparatively worse than World's raw bias.

We hit the point where quantity > quality has become optimal for weapons other than Dual Blades, which should never be the case. The abomination that is Rise's Hunting Horn got even more scuffed in Sunbreak and now just relies on spamming that one shockwave silkbind into single recital for maximum frequency of elemental shockwave hits; what a sad state of affairs.

Element should reward additional preparation and accurate knowledge of hitzones instead of outperforming raw by default even when hitting <15 ele hitzones.

[overmage]

Originally posted by Remi:

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

This post here is precisely why i never want to see raw meta on monster hunter ever again.
Lazy players always have to do less damage with their raw weapons.

How about a middle ground where element is better than raw when used correctly, but also not completely overtuned like it is now in Sunbreak. Element was in a fine place in Iceborne until Lightbreak and Fatalis stomped previous elemental options for most weapons and matchups. Sunbreak's elemental bias is comparatively worse than World's raw bias.

We hit the point where quantity > quality has become optimal for weapons other than Dual Blades, which should never be the case. The abomination that is Rise's Hunting Horn got even more scuffed in Sunbreak and now just relies on spamming that one shockwave silkbind into single recital for maximum frequency of elemental shockwave hits; what a sad state of affairs.

Element should reward additional preparation and accurate knowledge of hitzones instead of outperforming raw by default even when hitting <15 ele hitzones.

True, feels like sunbreak overcompensated. Some monster should need ele to do better, but monsters like zin or astalos with ass hzv should do better with raw...

[Dagný]

Originally posted by Remi:

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

This post here is precisely why i never want to see raw meta on monster hunter ever again.
Lazy players always have to do less damage with their raw weapons.

How about a middle ground where element is better than raw when used correctly, but also not completely overtuned like it is now in Sunbreak. Element was in a fine place in Iceborne until Lightbreak and Fatalis stomped previous elemental options for most weapons and matchups. Sunbreak's elemental bias is comparatively worse than World's raw bias.

We hit the point where quantity > quality has become optimal for weapons other than Dual Blades, which should never be the case. The abomination that is Rise's Hunting Horn got even more scuffed in Sunbreak and now just relies on spamming that one shockwave silkbind into single recital for maximum frequency of elemental shockwave hits; what a sad state of affairs.

Element should reward additional preparation and accurate knowledge of hitzones instead of outperforming raw by default even when hitting <15 ele hitzones.

That middle ground is one lightbreak away from everyone using 1 weapon again. Elemental sets require a lot of time and effort and for that alone it has to be rightly rewarded like it is in sunbreak.

In the base game everyone was using nargacuga weapons, I only made 1 set. Explain to me how that is fun and rewarding.

[Remi]

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

That middle ground is one lightbreak away from everyone using 1 weapon again. Elemental sets require a lot of time and effort and for that alone it has to be rightly rewarded like it is in sunbreak.

In the base game everyone was using nargacuga weapons, I only made 1 set. Explain to me how that is fun and rewarding.

If the devs stopped introducing blatant powercreep in title updates, we'd not have the issue of Lightbreak outclassing every base-Iceborne weapon.

I never argued that base Rise was remotely fun; in fact, I disliked base Rise more than any other MH game due to the lack of content and variety. Why is it that both X/XX and Rise/Sunbreak are Switch titles, yet the former have superior sound design, vfx, weapon balance, and most importantly, gameplay? Did World really ruin the franchise?

[D. Flame]

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

Originally posted by Remi:

How about a middle ground where element is better than raw when used correctly, but also not completely overtuned like it is now in Sunbreak. Element was in a fine place in Iceborne until Lightbreak and Fatalis stomped previous elemental options for most weapons and matchups. Sunbreak's elemental bias is comparatively worse than World's raw bias.

We hit the point where quantity > quality has become optimal for weapons other than Dual Blades, which should never be the case. The abomination that is Rise's Hunting Horn got even more scuffed in Sunbreak and now just relies on spamming that one shockwave silkbind into single recital for maximum frequency of elemental shockwave hits; what a sad state of affairs.

Element should reward additional preparation and accurate knowledge of hitzones instead of outperforming raw by default even when hitting <15 ele hitzones.

That middle ground is one lightbreak away from everyone using 1 weapon again. Elemental sets require a lot of time and effort and for that alone it has to be rightly rewarded like it is in sunbreak.

In the base game everyone was using nargacuga weapons, I only made 1 set. Explain to me how that is fun and rewarding.

I don't find mindlessly grinding the same thing over and over again for the same set just with different colored numbers to be "fun".

At least when I grinded out a KO set or a Para set, the results where visible different in the way the hunt played out. Using an Ice SA on Black Diablos won't change up how you fight it vs a Raw SA. But you add in a Para SA and the entire dynamic of the fight changes. That's what variety in sets SHOULD look like.

[Dagný]

Originally posted by D. Flame:

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

That middle ground is one lightbreak away from everyone using 1 weapon again. Elemental sets require a lot of time and effort and for that alone it has to be rightly rewarded like it is in sunbreak.

In the base game everyone was using nargacuga weapons, I only made 1 set. Explain to me how that is fun and rewarding.

I don't find mindlessly grinding the same thing over and over again for the same set just with different colored numbers to be "fun".

At least when I grinded out a KO set or a Para set, the results where visible different in the way the hunt played out. Using an Ice SA on Black Diablos won't change up how you fight it vs a Raw SA. But you add in a Para SA and the entire dynamic of the fight changes. That's what variety in sets SHOULD look like.

Don't follow guides or make threads asking for the best builds and make up your own fun builds then. Just know that for the best builds you're gonna have to put a lot of effort into it, it's how it should always be

[overmage]

Originally posted by D. Flame:

Originally posted by Dahlia Hawthorne:

That middle ground is one lightbreak away from everyone using 1 weapon again. Elemental sets require a lot of time and effort and for that alone it has to be rightly rewarded like it is in sunbreak.

In the base game everyone was using nargacuga weapons, I only made 1 set. Explain to me how that is fun and rewarding.

I don't find mindlessly grinding the same thing over and over again for the same set just with different colored numbers to be "fun".

At least when I grinded out a KO set or a Para set, the results where visible different in the way the hunt played out. Using an Ice SA on Black Diablos won't change up how you fight it vs a Raw SA. But you add in a Para SA and the entire dynamic of the fight changes. That's what variety in sets SHOULD look like.

You are contradicting yourself here; you asked for the best build/set not the most interesting. Objectively speaking there can only be one best set (unless you want to change the definition of the English language). Variety and "best" don't go together, on a philosophical level it is not possible. Do competitions have three first places?