Bow: Is Crit Boost broken or No Good?

[Yew Nough]

I'm trying to build a Rapid bow set and noticed Crit Boost is doing horrible damage:

No Crit Boost: 11, 25, 36
+1 Crit Boost: 11, 26, 37
+2 Crit Boost: 12, 26, 38
+3 Crit Boost: 12, 27 38
(Using Rapid 2/3/4)
(on training dummy)

I understand that the +1's and +2's add up, but I expected a bit more from a 35% crit damage boost.

Am I wrong about this or should I be gemming something else that isn't Crit Boost for damage?

Rampage Bow S
240 Atk
28 Dragon

Affinity 40%

Critical Eye 7 (Max)
Dragon Atk 5 (Max)
WEX 3 (Max)
Normal/Rapid Up 2
Critical Element 1

[Zed]

It isn't a 35% damage boost from 2 levels of Crit boost, it's 10%. Crits do 25% extra damage by default. Each level of crit boost raises that by 5%, so 30, 35, 40%. It also only applies to raw damage.

[Yew Nough]

Originally posted by Zed:

It isn't a 35% damage boost from 2 levels of Crit boost, it's 10%. Crits do 25% extra damage by default. Each level of crit boost raises that by 5%, so 30, 35, 40%.

Well, that sucks.

Kinda wish the wording was 'alittle' clearer to avoid misinterpretation.

Thanks!

PS: No Crit Boost and 2 Crit Element does: 12, 26, 38
Safe to say Crit Element > Crit Boost

[OoOoOoooOOoOoorgle]

If you're hitting the training dummy, all the numbers are pointless, because the dummy has ideal hitzones. Those basically don't exist.

Crit Boost is 100% better than Crit Ele in practice. Reason being, the number it's increasing is higher to begin with - as well as the fact that the raw hitzones are almost always (literally always? I haven't done all the math) better than the same elemental hitzone.

[AH-1 Cobra]

When damage numbers are in the lower half of 2 digits, it can be subject more to rounding errors. That's especially the case with pierce ammo on LBG for example.

That doesn't mean that crit boost isn't good on bow, it still is, or can be. It's good on the Chameleos Raw/Spread bow for sure.

[Yew Nough]

Will do, I'll try more number crunching on something with high elemental weakness and see what happens

[OoOoOoooOOoOoorgle]

If you want to get more out of this, lose the dragon for non-ele, and find space for the third rank of rapid up. You will still want WEX3 and CB3.

[Yew Nough]

Ran test on LR Rathian/Broken face, you are correct:

CE2/No CB: 14, 35, 50
No CE/CB2: 17, 36, 53

CE3/No CB: 18, 38, 54
No CE/CB3: 18, 39, 57

[Plumber]

also look into grabbing the Mighty Bow Feather equip, which you get by doing some arena quests (think it's barioth/rajang off the top of my head). It's no slots, middling defense for HR, and only gives a single skill, but that single extra charge stage is EXTREMELY powerful if you're using a bow where shots can go to a higher power level.

[OoOoOoooOOoOoorgle]

What I still need to figure out is the value of the Val set bonus, specifically against the Rath pair. And 3pc vs 4pc, since the head slot is reserved for mighty bow. With Golden Hakama it's pretty easy to get CB3 and still all the Constitution, etc that you want. Without, a lot less so. And then Val's own bow has the unique soul bonus to increase Dragon attack...versus the Ibushi (or a Rampage?), with way higher raw.

If you're in a particularly testing mood, that could be a cool thing to look at, at some point.

[Soren]

Originally posted by Plumber:

also look into grabbing the Mighty Bow Feather equip, which you get by doing some arena quests (think it's barioth/rajang off the top of my head). It's no slots, middling defense for HR, and only gives a single skill, but that single extra charge stage is EXTREMELY powerful if you're using a bow where shots can go to a higher power level.

Yeah, it's kind of unfortunate, but Mighty Bow Feather is basically forced on archer builds (unless you're specifically in need of small animal parts).

It pretty much increases damage by 20%. No amount of skills on any one piece of equipment can keep up with it alone. Even if the bow says lvl 5 piercing on charge 3, and lvl 5 piercing on charge 4, the charge level 4 itself adds about 15% damage alone over charge level 3.

[Plumber]

Bow is actually pretty raw-focused this time around; a resource I looked at the other day (https://mhwbowbuilds.wordpress.com/rise-build-2-0/) listed the multipliers for raw and ele as
Lv1: 0.4 R, 0.7 E
Lv2: 1.0 R, 0.85 E
Lv3: 1.5 R, 1.0 E
Lv4: 1.7 R, 1.125 E
where the element value of the charge level is what determines how much element damage you do, regardless of what your shot type actually is.

Going from 1.5x to 1.7x on raw doesn't seem like too big of a deal, but consider how much that value compounds if you also go to a better shot type tier. Rapid 4 is 10x4, but Rapid 5 is 11x4, for example. I'm not sure how much it affects Dragonpiercer, but I think it's safe to assume it's also somewhere in the ballpark of "a lot".

also, consider the situations where it's impossible or unfeasibly difficult to target a hitzone that would trigger WEX. All this adds up to Val bow having some massive missing raw, a skill that's normally really good on blademaster weapons and the bowguns (due to slicing ammo) having some situational issues, and also Ibushi bow gets Anti-Aerial Species (which includes the two raths which are dragon-weak, hello los goodbye los).

[OoOoOoooOOoOoorgle]

Originally posted by Plumber:

Bow is actually pretty raw-focused this time around; a resource I looked at the other day (https://mhwbowbuilds.wordpress.com/rise-build-2-0/) listed the multipliers for raw and ele as
Lv1: 0.4 R, 0.7 E
Lv2: 1.0 R, 0.85 E
Lv3: 1.5 R, 1.0 E
Lv4: 1.7 R, 1.125 E
where the element value of the charge level is what determines how much element damage you do, regardless of what your shot type actually is.

Going from 1.5x to 1.7x on raw doesn't seem like too big of a deal, but consider how much that value compounds if you also go to a better shot type tier. Rapid 4 is 10x4, but Rapid 5 is 11x4, for example. I'm not sure how much it affects Dragonpiercer, but I think it's safe to assume it's also somewhere in the ballpark of "a lot".

also, consider the situations where it's impossible or unfeasibly difficult to target a hitzone that would trigger WEX. All this adds up to Val bow having some massive missing raw, a skill that's normally really good on blademaster weapons and the bowguns (due to slicing ammo) having some situational issues, and also Ibushi bow gets Anti-Aerial Species (which includes the two raths which are dragon-weak, hello los goodbye los).

Ah, good info here.

Yeah, this mostly corroborates my suspicions. Element seems to be good *IF* you can get a good raw pairing with it. Less so, otherwise.

I still keep thinking that there must be a catch with the Valstrax stuff, but...maybe not. I have had some good times on the dual Rath quest with the weird 3pc + Val bow I have been working on, but nothing approaching test-worthy consistency. Will have to see how a raw-focused loadout performs at some point.

To be fair, I will give this one to Capcom as a win in terms of providing options. While the "best" loadouts may be fixed somewhat by these numbers, it seems like we have leeway to still be pretty strong while focusing in other areas. It's just unfortunate that CE loses out in a big way.

[Plumber]

anything that moves us away from the affinity/free dmg meta is good; unconditional power or rewarding you for something you would already be doing (hitting a monster in their weakpoint) adds very little to the game. Wish we'd get more use out of the weird stuff like Bubbly Dance, Dragonheart, Mind's Eye that directly affects how you can approach a fight.

[Soren]

Originally posted by Plumber:

anything that moves us away from the affinity/free dmg meta is good; unconditional power or rewarding you for something you would already be doing (hitting a monster in their weakpoint) adds very little to the game. Wish we'd get more use out of the weird stuff like Bubbly Dance, Dragonheart, Mind's Eye that directly affect how you can approach a fight.

I've trolled a few too many dragonheart users in multiplayer. Healing them not realising what they were doing.

[Plumber]

dragonheart is a very funny skill that punishes you for having considerate teammates - it's a lot of fun to play around in coordinated groups that NORMALLY would but have to consciously decide if the convenience of a team heal is worth knocking someone out of their silly +10% raw +20 flat raw +50% resistance super mode