How important is ping ?

[Jason Ford]

Will there be animation cancelling like in other games such as blade and soul ? Because there if you didn't have good ping you lost like 30% of your dps. Pretty much the only thing holding me back from buying right now is this question so any answers would be helpful.

- playing from Australia so I'm assuming around 250 ping at best.

[打游戏打到心趴上]

250 ping will be fine in pve, you can still do a great damage (only lost 5-10% dps ) but if you playing tank/healer, 250 ping does not matter

[VarBear]

I've downloaded the Taiwan client to test this out. As far as I can tell, latency doesn't seem to affect much, at least early game pve. There is no input delay like Blade & Soul, so you don't have inherent slower attack speed. I made sure of this by choosing a bad VPN server and getting 700ms ping and still was attacking just as fast as 160ms. As soon as you left click, the attack starts. B&S has a delay here depending on latency, not just for animation cancelling. I don't know if there is animation cancelling in here but from what I've seen it doesn't look like there is.

I also tried to test avoiding attacks and there doesn't seem to be any delay there either, though I could only test it on 1 enemy as the rest only had "auto attacks". There is some rubberbanding when using movement skills though. Don't expect to enjoy PVP with high ping in action combat MMO's

[Jason Ford]

Thank you both, That answers everything I wanted to know. Sounds like pve shouldn't be much of an issue and pvp delays I'm already used to from other games. Will buy the game a bit closer to release as it looks rather promising.

[Wolfsoldier5]

If you play anything above 100ms you will feel it. Even in PvE it makes a difference. I play wow with 180ms. Can it be played? Yes. Would it be better with a lower ping? For sure

[VarBear]

Originally posted by Wolfsoldier5:

If you play anything above 100ms you will feel it. Even in PvE it makes a difference. I play wow with 180ms. Can it be played? Yes. Would it be better with a lower ping? For sure

The difference is WoW is all server sided, whereas SOLO is mostly client sided. The game doesn't wait for a response from the server to initiate an action. It does the action and then sends the data over. Newer games are starting to use this method because it makes latency less important. It's likely harder to implement because of issues you have to work around such as, if you use a skill but get stunned right after. If they don't compensate for that, the player on the other end will get hit by this already stunned player, or the skill will go on cooldown but the damage won't apply, stuff like that. I'm sure by now developers are getting around that.

WoW is also probably the worse example you could have given. It's a tab target MMO with skill queueing. As long as your ping isn't higher than the queue, which would have to be well over 500+ms, it wouldn't affect your rotation. High latency would only affect movement, positioning, statuses such as stuns, which is not going to harm you in any meaningful way in a pve environment.

Going from 30ms to 240ms in SWTOR because of server merges barely affected the gameplay at all. Playing FF14 at 140ms is perfectly fine, even if you are going after the top 1%. I play the most ping dependent class in the game and manage to get top 2% without trying to get that high. I was hoping for 5% at best. I hope you're not blaming bad play in WoW on your latency.

[Hudon]

Originally posted by Wolfsoldier5:

If you play anything above 100ms you will feel it. Even in PvE it makes a difference. I play wow with 180ms. Can it be played? Yes. Would it be better with a lower ping? For sure

why would you even compare wow and solo when they work completely different... had 250-350 ping in TW, the only problem i had was big desync on running(rubberbanding) and slower spam skills, otherwise combat felt a bit too smooth.

[Wolfsoldier5]

Originally posted by 中国龙 杀手:

Originally posted by Wolfsoldier5:

If you play anything above 100ms you will feel it. Even in PvE it makes a difference. I play wow with 180ms. Can it be played? Yes. Would it be better with a lower ping? For sure

why would you even compare wow and solo when they work completely different... had 250-350 ping in TW, the only problem i had was big desync on running(rubberbanding) and slower spam skills, otherwise combat felt a bit too smooth.

Originally posted by VarBear:

Originally posted by Wolfsoldier5:

If you play anything above 100ms you will feel it. Even in PvE it makes a difference. I play wow with 180ms. Can it be played? Yes. Would it be better with a lower ping? For sure

The difference is WoW is all server sided, whereas SOLO is mostly client sided. The game doesn't wait for a response from the server to initiate an action. It does the action and then sends the data over. Newer games are starting to use this method because it makes latency less important. It's likely harder to implement because of issues you have to work around such as, if you use a skill but get stunned right after. If they don't compensate for that, the player on the other end will get hit by this already stunned player, or the skill will go on cooldown but the damage won't apply, stuff like that. I'm sure by now developers are getting around that.

WoW is also probably the worse example you could have given. It's a tab target MMO with skill queueing. As long as your ping isn't higher than the queue, which would have to be well over 500+ms, it wouldn't affect your rotation. High latency would only affect movement, positioning, statuses such as stuns, which is not going to harm you in any meaningful way in a pve environment.

Going from 30ms to 240ms in SWTOR because of server merges barely affected the gameplay at all. Playing FF14 at 140ms is perfectly fine, even if you are going after the top 1%. I play the most ping dependent class in the game and manage to get top 2% without trying to get that high. I was hoping for 5% at best. I hope you're not blaming bad play in WoW on your latency.

Lmao, and those issues are caused by, guess what, a high ms. I also play Lost Ark with 250ms, again... is it playable? yes, but you will from time to time get hit by something even though you can clearly see you moved out from

I have also done dungeons/raids in wow with 500ms+, it is unplayable. Not just a matter of some dps loss.

[VarBear]

Originally posted by Wolfsoldier5:

Originally posted by 中国龙 杀手:

why would you even compare wow and solo when they work completely different... had 250-350 ping in TW, the only problem i had was big desync on running(rubberbanding) and slower spam skills, otherwise combat felt a bit too smooth.

Originally posted by VarBear:

The difference is WoW is all server sided, whereas SOLO is mostly client sided. The game doesn't wait for a response from the server to initiate an action. It does the action and then sends the data over. Newer games are starting to use this method because it makes latency less important. It's likely harder to implement because of issues you have to work around such as, if you use a skill but get stunned right after. If they don't compensate for that, the player on the other end will get hit by this already stunned player, or the skill will go on cooldown but the damage won't apply, stuff like that. I'm sure by now developers are getting around that.

WoW is also probably the worse example you could have given. It's a tab target MMO with skill queueing. As long as your ping isn't higher than the queue, which would have to be well over 500+ms, it wouldn't affect your rotation. High latency would only affect movement, positioning, statuses such as stuns, which is not going to harm you in any meaningful way in a pve environment.

Going from 30ms to 240ms in SWTOR because of server merges barely affected the gameplay at all. Playing FF14 at 140ms is perfectly fine, even if you are going after the top 1%. I play the most ping dependent class in the game and manage to get top 2% without trying to get that high. I was hoping for 5% at best. I hope you're not blaming bad play in WoW on your latency.

Lmao, and those issues are caused by, guess what, a high ms. I also play Lost Ark with 250ms, again... is it playable? yes, but you will from time to time get hit by something even though you can clearly see you moved out from

I have also done dungeons/raids in wow with 500ms+, it is unplayable. Not just a matter of some dps loss.

Guess what, Lost Ark is a highly ping dependent game. Blade & Soul is too. If you read my first post on this, I clearly stated that I tested how it plays with ping, and that I didn't even need to move out of AOE's early to make up for the latency. You're really not understanding that games are being made differently. Latency is a non-issue here. Packet loss and other such instabilities, which is not directly tied to latency, can cause issues. You can get massive lag at 30ms if it's unstable by having a bad server route. Ping boosters are there to smooth out the connection. Slightly reduced ping is basically a side effect of that. It's not the goal of it.
Also if you're ever getting more than 350ms, even from across the globe, that is not just distance causing it.

Those games have those issues because everything is done server side. SOLO does not do that. If you have played Genshin Impact with a high ping, it's pretty much like that. Playing SOLO at 300ms is way smoother than playing something like B&S at 100ms. Of course 0 ping will always be better until the technology advances, but games are becoming less reliant on latency.

[Wolfsoldier5]

Originally posted by VarBear:

Originally posted by Wolfsoldier5:

Lmao, and those issues are caused by, guess what, a high ms. I also play Lost Ark with 250ms, again... is it playable? yes, but you will from time to time get hit by something even though you can clearly see you moved out from

I have also done dungeons/raids in wow with 500ms+, it is unplayable. Not just a matter of some dps loss.

Guess what, Lost Ark is a highly ping dependent game. Blade & Soul is too. If you read my first post on this, I clearly stated that I tested how it plays with ping, and that I didn't even need to move out of AOE's early to make up for the latency. You're really not understanding that games are being made differently. Latency is a non-issue here. Packet loss and other such instabilities, which is not directly tied to latency, can cause issues. You can get massive lag at 30ms if it's unstable by having a bad server route. Ping boosters are there to smooth out the connection. Slightly reduced ping is basically a side effect of that. It's not the goal of it.
Also if you're ever getting more than 350ms, even from across the globe, that is not just distance causing it.

Those games have those issues because everything is done server side. SOLO does not do that. If you have played Genshin Impact with a high ping, it's pretty much like that. Playing SOLO at 300ms is way smoother than playing something like B&S at 100ms. Of course 0 ping will always be better until the technology advances, but games are becoming less reliant on latency.

Yes, I have played Genshin. Until you play co-op, you can feel the lag, which is why I play solo.
If you have played anything with 5ms and then you play with 150ms you know where/how laggy the game is. It will make a difference in your i-frames and other actions.

You mention "As long as your ping isn't higher than the queue, which would have to be well over 500+ms, it wouldn't affect your rotation. High latency would only affect movement, positioning, statuses such as stuns, which is not going to harm you in any meaningful way in a pve environment."

From this phrase alone you are wrong. Have you played something with 500ms? In this case wow? It's not just your movement that becomes affected.
I have played with 500ms, it's ♥♥♥♥. EVERYTHING becomes delayed by a reasonable amount.

You also mention playing this with 700ms and not noticing an issue I doubt it.

[VarBear]

Originally posted by Wolfsoldier5:

Originally posted by VarBear:

Guess what, Lost Ark is a highly ping dependent game. Blade & Soul is too. If you read my first post on this, I clearly stated that I tested how it plays with ping, and that I didn't even need to move out of AOE's early to make up for the latency. You're really not understanding that games are being made differently. Latency is a non-issue here. Packet loss and other such instabilities, which is not directly tied to latency, can cause issues. You can get massive lag at 30ms if it's unstable by having a bad server route. Ping boosters are there to smooth out the connection. Slightly reduced ping is basically a side effect of that. It's not the goal of it.
Also if you're ever getting more than 350ms, even from across the globe, that is not just distance causing it.

Those games have those issues because everything is done server side. SOLO does not do that. If you have played Genshin Impact with a high ping, it's pretty much like that. Playing SOLO at 300ms is way smoother than playing something like B&S at 100ms. Of course 0 ping will always be better until the technology advances, but games are becoming less reliant on latency.

Yes, I have played Genshin. Until you play co-op, you can feel the lag, which is why I play solo.
If you have played anything with 5ms and then you play with 150ms you know where/how laggy the game is. It will make a difference in your i-frames and other actions.

You mention "As long as your ping isn't higher than the queue, which would have to be well over 500+ms, it wouldn't affect your rotation. High latency would only affect movement, positioning, statuses such as stuns, which is not going to harm you in any meaningful way in a pve environment."

From this phrase alone you are wrong. Have you played something with 500ms? In this case wow? It's not just your movement that becomes affected.
I have played with 500ms, it's ♥♥♥♥. EVERYTHING becomes delayed by a reasonable amount.

You also mention playing this with 700ms and not noticing an issue I doubt it.

You also don't know how skill queueing works, do you? You press the button in advance and then it comes out as soon as it is ready. If your skill queue is 500ms long, and your ping is 500ms, there is no delay between skills. B&S was modded (and patched out) to be able to add skill queueing, which made you attack faster with high ping. Here, I even recorded some gameplay of 180ms vs 635ms, you can check ping on top left.

https://gyazo.com/cf15e26afaef7fba3af0243d37d2f213
https://gyazo.com/407e9afa0f871c91f5671c042c3b7f55

Do let me know if you notice any slower attack animations. I didn't say there was no issue. I said I made sure that DPS would not be directly affected by higher ping by purposely making myself lag. To compare it to B&S, where higher ping meant slower attack speed, or any other game with no skill queue. Of course 700ms is not playable, but again, nobody with internet faster than 10mb/s is going to go above 350ms even from across the globe. Unless of course there are other issues causing it, like packet loss.