demo review

[Turuk Makto]

The first thing I mentioned was that I was not able to change the keybinding. I don't think that many are still using arrow buttons to stear anything nowadays. WSAD is the way to go nowadays but that is probably not a good way for space combat.

The mouse steering feels very unprecise in combat. It is not impossible to get the target into the target cross but it seems unnecessarily complicated. So basicly this is not a game for mouse/keyboard flight. Since I do not ever use controllers and my last joystick kicked the curb almost 2 decades ago I don't know if the experience would be different with one of those.

Immovable weapons on a space ship so that your enemy has to be in the center of the screen to hit it seems to be a very 1990th approach. It makes more sense to be able shoot where the mouse cross is while using mouse steering. You know, because it is the future and they are more advanced and stuff in the future ;)

I wanted to like the game even though the sounds and graphics are mediocre because I would love to play a "Privateer"-like game again but I couldn't get myself to play past the first mission (+ a side mission to kill a pirate) because of the bad mouse steering/targeting.

The mining part was quite easy and did not need seperate mining equipment which I learned by accident while trying to hit a pirate next to a space rock. You guessed it, the space rock got hit, the pirate didn't. A bit annoying was that I could not simply set flight speed to zero but continously had to fly backwards while picking up the pieces.

Your game might have potential if mouse targeting would be implemented.

Oh yea and it would be useful to disable the boost using the tab button again. It is kinda a waste to having to use the boost until it is empty rather than make just short boosts to gain advantages e.g. in combat.

Does the game have strafe? I was kinda missing being able to use a and d to strafe. I´m sure I pushed the buttons automaticly to no avail.

[zoly0]

Hello Fred,

Thanks for trying the demo and for the feedback!

Regarding the ability to change the keybinding, yes, this is a feature that we have in plan for the release of the game.

You are right about the immovable weapons :D. The intended steering/targeting method is using the mouse and the game does actually have mouse targeting, but it seems there is a bug that allows deactivating it under certain circumstances - and you found it! :). We apologize, we`ll fix it as soon as possible.
On the keyboard we are using W/S for thrust and A/D for strafe and the arrow keys are just an alternative steering method for the mouse. We will think if we can improve this default layout.

We`ll put on our list the suggestions regarding stopping and using the boost, thanks!

Indeed mining does not require special equipment to work, but there is special equipment that can improve it (scanners for detecting composition, better teleporters to get the minerals onboard, ships with more cargo space, etc)

For strafe use A/D(horizontal) and R/F(vertical). (also Q/E for roll)

We plan to release a few updates for the demo in the near future, if you have any additional questions or feedback let us know!

[Turuk Makto]

Thank you for your reply!

Wonder what I did to deactivate mouse targeting. I´m usually going through the gaming options before I start any game but usually do not touch the targeting options before I tried it out. More like key mapping, details and turning off the music.

I´m sure I tried to use strafe via a/d per automation because I`m used to it. It just did not seem to have much impact. That might probably be because I played another space combat demo (forgot the name) shortly before your's where strafing made alot of difference in comparison. It might make sense for it to be less intense if one could add hardware later to strenghten the effect.

[zoly0]

So... for the mouse targeting try pressing F3 while in flight :)

As for the strafe, I guess we could try to add some more effects/highlight it more.

[Turuk Makto]

So I redownloaded the game and pushing F3 wasn't even necessary anymore. Mouse targeting worked right away so I have no clue what the problem was initially. Or maybe you uploaded a new demo version.

Strafe works, it just seems a bit weak. One can see it best if it is used when a hostile comes straight for you.

A huge problem is that I had to restart my PC because running your game screwed with my keyboard layout. It seems to switch to the US keyboard layout ignoring the windows settings for some unknown reason. That is very annoying! I mentioned that the first time but played several demo's back then and was not sure which one caused that problem.

Z and Y and other buttons are switched. That ofc screws up the currently fixed keybindings since pushing certain buttons on my keyboard layout does nothing.

I just found out that the keyboard layout sometimes quietly fixes itself a few minutes after closing your game.

I would also improve below mentioned things before releasing the game:

It needs a quest indicater for how far the missions are away. E.g. 1 jump, 2 jumps, in the current area etc. because you have no clue where respectively how far places are and if the payment is worth going there.

It seems I accidentally picked up contraband in some combat which is weird because it does not pick up most of the contraband. After jumping I got scanned and was told to drop my shields and surrender. Without delay I got shot upon with no clue even howto respond to the demand of the patrol ships or howto drop the contraband. So I fought the patrol ships and I´m not sure if that caused my reputation to drop. Maybe there should be an indicator for that too. (Or could it be that I missed it?) Also you could implement like an automatic (reasonable) fine (if one dropped the shield, or did whatever necessary to surrender to the patrol), the removal of the contraband and a reputation loss. Atm I wouldnt know howto drop my shields like they demanded. I found out howto drop cargo after that incident though.

The mouse weel works the wrong way in trade menu's, up is down and down is up.

While mining I got attacked by pirates who could shoot at me and fly through the space rock I was just mining while I could just try to flee to get a line of sight.

I flew around without quests and mentioned that I kept losing the jump point I wanted to reach because I got attacked several times going there and after that combat I had to turn like a crazy person to find the jump point I wanted to goto again. Ofc as soon as I found it I got attacked again and lost it again. I targeted it with Z (the jump point) but it did not show up on the hud and after the combat nothing is marked on the hud to turn to. It took me like 30 minutes to travel from the arriving jump point to a jump point 10k in the distance because of the lack of being able to see a marked jump point on the hud (even though I did not target the pirate ships).

Upgrading the ship does not feel like an upgrade because even though you just upgraded e.g. your armor and shield to the best ones available in the next fight the hostiles hammer you again with theyr ultra fast weapons and can kill you in a sec if you are unlucky or not boosting right away.

Marking contraband red on the HUD is not very useful because if you fight more ships you can turn to the contraband rather than to the next attacker.

At the end it crashed to desktop 1 sec after pirates appeared out of thin air and started shooting at me. The windows event manager did not show anything tied to that crash and no error message appeared thus I can not give more information on that.

Err... I edited this post several times while gaming but some information seems to have gotten lost somehow. I dont know if I remembered everything I edited into this post over some hours.

[zoly0]

The keyboard layout bug (sorry!) and the mouse targeting bug should be fixed in the latest build.

Until we add keys customization, for firing you can also use the left mouse button (instead of the oddly placed Z).

The "farness" indicator sounds useful indeed.

Regarding the contraband, the "drop your shields" line is currently for dramatic effect only (there is nothing you can do at that point to get away). Yes, you have the option of dropping cargo if you pause the game and go to the cargo menu, but you have to do it before getting noticed by the guards. It`s true that this is not explicitly stated in any tutorial, it might help to add it.

About the pirates going through rocks, yes, it`s an issue that haunts us for quite some time, hopefully we`ll fix it until release.

Reversed mouse - noted.

Hm, the target cycle key should give you the jump gates too. Also you now can use mouse right click on a target and it will select it. Or, you can pause the game and go to the Map page and select your destination and it will be highlighted with blue on your HUD.

Random encounters will be with enemies that are in the range of one level lower to one level higher, so indeed upgrades might seem that are not useful in this case. However you definitely need them when dealing with the missions from the story line or many of the side missions.

We will think what we can do about marking the contraband differently.

Regarding the crash, if you want to help us investigate the issue, you can check the game`s folder for any files with the .mdmp extension and send them to us.
The folder (depending on your system) should be like this:
c:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Stellar Wanderer Demo\Bin\


Thank you for taking the time to send us the feedback, it is highly appreciated!

[Turuk Makto]

Nguyên văn bởi zoly0:

check the game`s folder for any files with the .mdmp extension and send them to us.
The folder (depending on your system) should be like this:
c:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Stellar Wanderer Demo\Bin\

Hey zoly0,

Even though I´m the only one here (or even more so because I´m the only one) I´m amaged that you seem to be honestly appreciating my input so I guess I keep on testing.

I found the file, where do you want me to send it to? (Please dont say Twitter, I got no acc.) Unfortunately I cant upload it here.

Reverse mouse weel only pls :D The rest is good.

As you said. the keyboard layout problems are gone with the latest version.

The target cycle key works but with the many targets it's rather uncomfortable.
Maybe add a jump point cycle key for more comfort? :)
I mentioned the jump point is still there after a combat when a route via the map is chosen. I guess that was what you referred to.


Now I see a big blue arrow when I target stuff and turn away.

It would be lovely if loading sequences wouldnt stop if one alt+tabs to the desktop. (I wanted to use the time to update my review but when I come back I still have to watch the sequence :/)

A seperate mining button or a gun bank system where we can use the outter guns for combat and the inner guns for mining would be nice to have. With one button to switch between those two banks. I know that atm one can use just one bank with y and another button but the mouse button always uses all guns which draws too much energy in combat using mining cannons. Tbh I would favour a separate mining gun slot apart from the combat guns. Like one socket for mining guns only. You may or may not have that on other ships but since I cant test them I just put it in here.

Please implement a button to open the map with. I keep pushing M for map because I´m used to that for 3 decades now but thats for match speed (which is useful too) and there is not even a map button. ESC and a klick on map is soooo old style.

In combat I often accidentally docked or flew through jump doors which failed the mission. Basicly I came out of the dock, had a fight, wanted to speed up time to the next hostile, puff, I was docked even though I was facing away from the station. Or I auto jumped to another system because the hostile flew close to the jump point. So in combat there should be a need to push a button to jump to another system. The station docking problem is probably more complicated since the enter button is used for docking and 4x time. (That combination is probably not a good choice.)

It would be practical if you could implement the use of esc to get out of every menu on the station.

It seems like unmounted gear is carried around. A storage on the station would be useful. But then the question will be, would it be available at any station or would we have to go back to the station where we unmounted them. If the latter then it would need a system to see where is what. So prolly the first solution might be easier to implement and much more comfortable for the players.

While using 4 IAR Heavy lasers they shoot in sequence rather than together which makes it rather pointless to use more than 2. I dont know if that is intended.

[zoly0]

Cool! :) You can send the file to our email [e-mail] or drop it on our discord https://discord.gg/6ZDYhu2

[Turuk Makto]

A "sell all" button for every item would be useful. It's kinda no fun to sell 40 tons (let alone more with bigger ships/cargo) one by one.

In the defend missions when there are 3 hostile fighters, one you try to get rid of and 2 pawning you at the same time it is kinda hard to survive considering how fast one ship destroy's the shield and armor already let alone two or more of them. It feels like flying a paper airplane. I know I mentioned it before but without the feeling that upgrading your ship was worth it... what else is there?

Does H target the closest hostile or just some random one? Often it feels like its just a random one but it should be the closest.

The missions would need alot more variety than in the demo.
The same with hostiles. No variety there. Pirates and more pirates. No alien ships of any kind, no aliens who live in space (like space "animals" who dont use ships but float in space like e.g. whales in the sea, no surprises. Ok I couldnt go far but I have somehow the feeling that there wont be much more than pirates which would be sad in a space setting.

The economy is kinda too easy. It makes sense that parts are more expensive in different systems but purchase and sales prices shouldnt be virtually the same. Except for buying back in case one accidentally sold a part he didnt want to sell. While most games are really greedy with just giving 10 % (or even less) of the purchase price you are too generous. I was literally just flying around with stuff I bought for the ship in the cheapest system, to try them out, and upgraded by selling them in systems where they where more expensive. While thats ok for a demo to have the possibility to try out different equipment within a short time it shouldnt be that way in the release. Else everyone is rich in no time and just has to follow the story mission which is mostly too short.

Sent the file by mail.

[zoly0]

I received the file, thanks!

Note there are 3 keys for targets, did you try them all? T to cycle between all targets, H for the next enemy and Y to select between front targets.

About the loading that is tricky I guess because there are also people who would like the game to suspend and not use the cpu when in background. It`s something that I have to investigate.

Currently the system is that all weapons have a mining suitability attribute, so yes, mining is linked to the current weapon. Also, you always fire all primary banks (with keyboard and mouse too). Secondary fire refers to missiles.
We need to think about what could be changed for mining.

For map, indeed we could add a key, and we definitely plan to separate dock&jump from time accelerate. In most menus I think you can already close with BACKSPACE.

We have an express delivery system for the ships, when you own several of them (not available in the demo). They get delivered at your current station for a fee. For items so far we thought that it`s better to use the current system as an incentive to get a ship with bigger cargo. Again, something we need to reflect on.

About the lasers, i`m not sure now but it`s possible that you simply need a bigger generator.

Sell all - noted.

And thanks again for the effort! As developers we are sometimes so used to various aspects of the game that we fail to see things that are otherwise obvious, so a fresh pair of eyes is welcome.

[Turuk Makto]

Sorry it seems I edited my previous post while you answered. Thoughts on missions, hostiles and economy.

Y is shooting all my weapons (thus redundant). Z and T and H I used for targeting but mostly H and rightklick. T for searching a jump point but it's easier via the map.

I guess the sequence is just shown to avoid a boring loading screen so basicly it is loading the area? I was just wondering because many games are nowadays pausing the game when I alt+tab, but here in space I keep on flying (which isnt a problem because I can hear if I get attacked). Thats why I was wondering why on the one side not pausing but on the other side pausing the jumping/docking sequence. It kinda sent a mixed message if you know what I mean. CPU power can not be the problem with all the 4+ core cpu's around.

Ok tested it... 8 % cpu load while docking. 9 - 11 % while jumping, 8 % on arrival after the jump. 99 % below 10 % while flying in space (i7-9700K). Thats nowhere close to be threatening any other thing running in the background. I had downloads who caused more CPU load :D
On the jump back I mentioned that the CPU load depends on the system not the jump itself, because on the way back the cpu-load was basicly reversed. Which makes sense.

As to the mining I´m wondering if the chance to get better (more expensive) ore is tied to the mining % of the weapon? If it is then a weapon bank activation (or a seperate mining slot) like I mentioned before would make sense. If the mining percentage does just influence the frequency of getting ore then the ships dont really need a seperate mining slot. But that would render all mining weapons with low damage and high mining frequency kinda useless, except one has a ship with 10 tractor beams, or if higher lvl tractor beams can pick up more than one ore at a time.

I didnt try BACKSPACE but I kinda dislike the enter button already because it is too far. Everything should be in reach of my left hand and I would like to put some buttons on my mouse. In games who support it I'm using alt/shift/strg+mb 2/3/4/5 for stuff I need frequently. Unfortunately there are not many games out there who support that. Some dont even support mouse buttons 3, 4 and 5 without a strg/shift/alt combination.

Nguyên văn bởi zoly0:

For items so far we thought that it`s better to use the current system as an incentive to get a ship with bigger cargo.

Well then you should probably leave it as it is.

I'm sure everyone will like the express delivery system. I like to imagine it like a replicator or teleport system - because future n stuff hehe.

About the 4 lasers and the bigger generator:
I dont think I need a bigger generator because I can use two additional weapons that need the same amount of energy (3) without problem. Just 4 IAR HL's seem to have that problem even though the energy draw would be the same.

I always thought betatesting would be for me but nowadays I doubt I could make a living considering all the free open beta's.

It happend again. In combat, killed one, pushed enter to accelerate time, docked, mission failed. Then tried to pull down the mission list by klicking and pulling up not to take yet another "defend ship" mission. I somehow misklicked and ofc accepted the 2nd "defend ship" mission and that is when things got really ugly. When I got out there I basicly got hammered by 4 to 6 enemy ships right by the station already. I saw them shooting while was still in the liftoff sequence. The ship was down in a sec once I got to steer it. The reason the ship and the hostiles from the supposedly failed mission where still out there doubling the hostiles. That begs the question, why does a mission fail due to accidentally docking if the ship is still out there?

It's really interesting that pirates know exactly when I´m mining to shoot me out of the sky as soon as my cargo bay is full. They seem to have Klingon/Romulan ships considering how they appear out of thin air. (A hint for such ships for us to buy! :)

Being able to turn the map vertically could be useful.

Well that seems to be it. Nothing more to add. No more upgrades to get nor systems to fly to. I didnt test alot of the additional equipment like scanners, repair, healing, etc. because I didnt like the idea of dropping the shield improvement. It felt too much like flying a paper plane already.

A game like this with craftable weapons and equipment that doesnt use a loot box system with all the things I mentioned below would be awesome. I guess I wont live to see it.

I hope the finalized game is going to be filled with alien races, creatures, artefacts to find, more versatile quests (space stations to conquer! muahahaha) and more systems than you got on the demo map! (One can dream.)

[markornikov]

WASD only? Such fun when playing with an AZERTY keyboard.

[L4Z4RVS]

"For strafe use A/D(horizontal) and R/F(vertical). (also Q/E for roll)" It's better to use space(up)/shift(down) for vertical strafe for better maneuverability, because D/R/F keys use the same finger. It's common keybinding for 6DOF space games.

[catnipsongs]

I like the game so far, yes there are some things that are a tad annoying. My biggest peeve is I can not sit still and mine.
In all honesty I prefer this game to Avorion, so I would say keep up the good work.
I would recommend a great sound track like Rebel Galaxy has. It can make long trips seem a lot shorter.
Changing equipment on your ship seems a bit off, but could be I need to get use to it.
Thanks for the Demo and I will keep putzing at it

[Turuk Makto]

Is it me or are the textures alot better?

So I tested some equipment.:

The scanner is nice but since pirates can still appear out of thin space right next to me I wonder what it is good for besides detecting ore and the longer range (which does not seem to impede pirates from appearing within that range)?

The repair droid (kit): How can I activate it? J doesnt work. Found no other button in the key config who would activate it. I see a big repair sign next to the shield/armor display but thats about it.

When opening any menu that needs scrolling to see all items it does seem to save the position from another station. It would be useful to start at the top after opening trade menu's.

While gold mining near Memphis station every single weapon hit gave ore (unlike before when just every other fusillade gave some) resulting in ore despawning before I could even pick it up. While it is nice to mine fast it's pointless if the ore can not be picked up in time. It felt more realistic before. Or maybe just the gold near Mephis is mined that fast? I didnt test that anymore, just came to me when I stopped testing.

When setting a station to travel to on the map, the path leads through several systems and I land on a station in between then after the liftoff I do not see the travel indicator on the hud anymore even though the destination is still marked on the map.

I agree with Th3l0stboys that space(up)/shift(down) for vertical strafe would be the better solution. Since shift and tab are used for the boost I fear that with the possibility to change the keybinding if we would set shift to strafe down it would also change tab to the same action. Please make sure that this will not be the case so that we can bind shift and tab with seperate actions.

[zoly0]

Thanks for the feedback everyone! I will answer in several posts to make it more manageable.