I love this game, but some there's improvements needed

[Romulus]

My first issues is with the ethnicity system. I've chosen to play as Italian and it seems the game starts out in an Italian neighborhood (which makes sense). I was excited about setting up an Italian crew, like the Sopranos or The Godfather or something to give it authenticity. HOWEVER, I cannot find one character available to recruit who is Italian, not even when my Italian brother or uncle refer them to me.

I've also selected a character trait/ skill where I'm supposed to get extra relationship benefits from businesses with the same ethnicity. HOWEVER, not one business owner in my "Italian neighborhood" is Italian, they're all American, German etc (does not make sense).

These issues detract from the immersion and realism. It's the same with other gangs, when their leader is killed they flip from Russian, to German, to American names. It would be even better if most (not necessarily every) characters were of the same ethnicity and for you to be able to recruit characters who are relations or extended family to keep the gang names going (it is VERY cool concept to have your family setting up fronts and businesses, but they should be able to work for you too).

[korac]

Are you sure it's actually an Italian neighborhood (i.e. did you check the ethnicity map overlay?). The reason I'm asking is because I also started as Italian but am actually nowhere near an Italian neighborhood (so it doesn't seem to be an actual built-in default) - there are only one or two others in my entire 20+ corner territory, it's mostly Americans and Czechs in my neck of the woods. It's a bit of a downer, since I started with the Organized Crime buff specifically to benefit from ethnicity... but that is of course the luck of the draw, just a little disheartening. Could indeed be worth a closer look and a tweak, otherwise it may only pay to play as American?

[Romulus]

Originally posted by korac:

Are you sure it's actually an Italian neighborhood (i.e. did you check the ethnicity map overlay?). The reason I'm asking is because I also started as Italian but am actually nowhere near an Italian neighborhood (so it doesn't seem to be an actual built-in default) - there are only one or two others in my entire 20+ corner territory, it's mostly Americans and Czechs in my neck of the woods. It's a bit of a downer, since I started with the Organized Crime buff specifically to benefit from ethnicity... but that is of course the luck of the draw, just a little disheartening. Could indeed be worth a closer look and a tweak, otherwise it may only pay to play as American?

I checked the overlay and it's supposed to be an Italian neighborhood. That's the exact same bonus I went with, Organised Crime, but I cannot use it!

However, for me what's most disheartening about this is that I want to play with historical authenticity. I want to play as the Italian mafia or the Russian mafia or the Irish mafia. I don't want to play as the rainbow mafia, it's not real enough for me and it's a missed opportunity in the game immersion.

[rickerts]

Understandable. For me, I'm enjoying playing as the more "minor" groups like Polish and Hungarian etc... just because I like to pretend I'm in an alternate reality etc and what would history have been like if a immigrant from one of those countries rose through the ranks etc.

My own personal version of Joseph Saltis so to speak

[SomaSim]

The characters you recruit come from your network of trust, not just from the neighborhood. So if you want a puretly Italian gang, you'll have to do extra work to build positive relationships with a lot of Italians, and then they'll introduce you to their brothers, nephews, etc.

[AlBoulcan]

the front guys are actually your crew too but they only operate their legal business plus the collecting money. In my game i try focusing expanding my fronts on italian people, but i use german running illegal business and swedish as muscle so far :D

[Romulus]

Originally posted by SomaSim:

The characters you recruit come from your network of trust, not just from the neighborhood. So if you want a puretly Italian gang, you'll have to do extra work to build positive relationships with a lot of Italians, and then they'll introduce you to their brothers, nephews, etc.

Thanks so much :D This makes sense, I realised now the shops I do business with do introduce me to their sons etc which are of course the same ethnicity, so I'll work on those relationships with Italians. I can see this will actually make it more challenging (and fun).
However, it would also be even better if my Italian uncle were to introduce me to shared Italian relations so I can have family members in my gang, as currently he only ever introduces me to his Latvian niece or German cousin (which feels randomly generated).

[SomaSim]

That's correct, the people you talk with will introduce you to members of their family, but they pick randomly from the family. But the nationalities are not random. We simulate families from 1870 till 1920 before the game starts. So if your Italian uncle had sisters who married people from other nationalities, chances are your cousins will be considered to be of different nationalities too.

[korac]

Originally posted by SomaSim:

That's correct, the people you talk with will introduce you to members of their family, but they pick randomly from the family. But the nationalities are not random. We simulate families from 1870 till 1920 before the game starts. So if your Italian uncle had sisters who married people from other nationalities, chances are your cousins will be considered to be of different nationalities too.

I love the 50-year-simulation aspect of the game's creation at start - a very nice touch indeed. It does seem to work well in generating families, marriages, offspring, etc.

My sole concern related to this, as mentioned in my earlier post above, is purely our own starting location relative to established communities (or even small gatherings) of the same ethnicity. My own start as an Italian (with the Organized Crime perk, purposely to benefit from ethnicity) actually had me start a very, very long way from most of my fellow Italians in the city. There's just a very few within my (now) 50+ corner territory at present.

Of course, it hasn't stopped me thoroughly enjoying my first playthrough - and I know it's just the luck of the draw - but I am rather concerned that someone who is... shall we say, less emotionally-invested in this excellent game... may view this sort of starting situation as a really huge negative on the grounds of (lack of) realism. That would be a shame.

[Romulus]

Originally posted by SomaSim:

That's correct, the people you talk with will introduce you to members of their family, but they pick randomly from the family. But the nationalities are not random. We simulate families from 1870 till 1920 before the game starts. So if your Italian uncle had sisters who married people from other nationalities, chances are your cousins will be considered to be of different nationalities too.

Hi SomaSim, simulation from 1870 is impressive! I wondered what the probability weights are in the simulation for marriage to the same ethnicity, as it seems extremely rare (never) for a my family member to introduce me to someone of the same ethnicity. I believe traditionally/ historically most Americans of the time would (not exclusively) marry within their ethnicity at a high rate.

The other issue I have is that when I start out in a neighborhood most of the shop owners are not of the same ethnicity. For example, I have one new game where I'm in bright red ethnicity for every building, for blocks and blocks, with small spots of gray for single buildings, which turn out to be all the shops. That is, not one shop in "Little Italy" is run by an Italian. It would be even better if they were. It would be very cool as well if parts of the city were so named, i.e. "Little Italy" or "Polish quarter", or whatever they were historically (moving of course with the random map generation).