Why does this seem so broken.

[The Civillian]

Currently doing run with my friend on madness (5 I think were on now)

Any composition we come up with nearly always falls flat before act 2.

Any that is, but one, and so far I'm failing to see how it's going to fail.

Lightening and water.

Reg/Wilbur/Evlyn/Heiner

Wilbur as the battery for the party, heiner does heiner things and Evlyin just electrocutes everything.

3 of the party have water (Rain/Healing rain) The damage is crazy, the regen is very high and the armour from Heiner can't be matched.


We've tried a lot of combo's and one seem to have the durability of this build.

Am I missing something

[TnJ]

It’s a fun build. I don’t see how it’s anything crazy.

Welcome to DPS synergy. You’re not even getting the most out of Heiner since he can put out a lot of fire.

[HAWAIIANpikachu]

Champion enemies once you climb up madness.

[Xandor]

For the most part it feels like only a few builds are good.
Low cost cards, bless, sharp, mark, regen and vulnerability are things I found to be very strong. It also feels like nothing could match Heiner, he has the highest resistance so it is easy to get to 95% resistance and gives a lot of block for the entire team, so much that it usually lasts until the end of the fight with plenty left. His taunt gives so much value for such a low cost also. The block he gives the team on turn 1 is also really good, makes it not really matter if the enemy gets to act first.

I use Reg, Thuls, Andrin, Heiner. I don't think I have lost a single run on madness, I am only on madness 6 act 3 (not because it is hard but because it takes time to get further), usually no enemy is able to really deal significant damage and after a while Thuls is able to do 600+ damage per attack with 3k+ damage in 1 round. Even Heiner and Andrin are able to deal significant damage after a while when they got a few bless stacks and the enemy have mark and vulnerability. There is basically no rng involved with this team either (except for getting items that make stacking buffs faster like apply bless when using any heal is really strong but I haven't needed any specific items or rare cards).

When I think about other builds I am usually like "those cards have too high energy cost, won't be able to use the entire hand with those cards so would be a waste" or "rng is involved with that build... no good" etc. Normal healing and regen feels superior to other forms of healing also since there is no rng involved, was struggling to keep the team alive with sanctify but switched to normal healing and now I think I have enough healing to heal at least twice as much damage as I take, probably even more.

[The Civillian]

Originally posted by TnJ:

It’s a fun build. I don’t see how it’s anything crazy.

Welcome to DPS synergy. You’re not even getting the most out of Heiner since he can put out a lot of fire.

We have Heiner being able to put out about 500+ with bouncing shield (per target) of lightening damage.

And the reason Lightening is kinda sick.

2-300 charges on a target, each target either side has 20+ water.

fights are usually done by round 3/4 and lookin very healthy.

Hexproof is SUCH a pain in the ass though regardless of build.

[TnJ]

Originally posted by The Civillian:

And the reason Lightening is kinda sick.

2-300 charges on a target, each target either side has 20+ water.

Yeah it's a fun build.

[Razor Feather]

Thinking you need to be able to play your whole hand each turn is a trap. You really, really don't need to. If the only card you play on your turn is citadel, that's a pretty dang strong turn.

Wilbur and reginald are definetly both really strong. Wilbur gives absurd energy economy and still manages to do a lot of damage, and the free bless from reginald is just really good. They are hardly vital, though.

Bree can actually do *absurd* damage with thorns while still being plenty durable enough to survive, Gustov is a really solid flexible support character who can pretty easily replace a "healer" type, Nezgleckt can do a lot of healing while pouring out damage, zek can spam high cost spells out if you carefully manage his dark stacks, etc.

Hell, one of my current madness 4+2 (no supply selling) runs is doing fairly well with bree as a psuedo healer by spamming battle shout for the vitality, and thuls doing dispels with a pair of sweet melodys while heiner goes fire dps.

As long as you have a clear plan, you can get through at least mid level madness with some pretty wacky builds. There are certainly outliers in terms of power, and I think Wilbur is very much one of them, but most things will work.

[The Civillian]

Originally posted by Razor Feather:

Thinking you need to be able to play your whole hand each turn is a trap. You really, really don't need to. If the only card you play on your turn is citadel, that's a pretty dang strong turn.

Wilbur and reginald are definetly both really strong. Wilbur gives absurd energy economy and still manages to do a lot of damage, and the free bless from reginald is just really good. They are hardly vital, though.

Bree can actually do *absurd* damage with thorns while still being plenty durable enough to survive, Gustov is a really solid flexible support character who can pretty easily replace a "healer" type, Nezgleckt can do a lot of healing while pouring out damage, zek can spam high cost spells out if you carefully manage his dark stacks, etc.

Hell, one of my current madness 4+2 (no supply selling) runs is doing fairly well with bree as a psuedo healer by spamming battle shout for the vitality, and thuls doing dispels with a pair of sweet melodys while heiner goes fire dps.

As long as you have a clear plan, you can get through at least mid level madness with some pretty wacky builds. There are certainly outliers in terms of power, and I think Wilbur is very much one of them, but most things will work.

The issue I have is that there are several enemy combo's that are specifically designed to destroy certain strats.

For example, Act 4 their is a fight with a pair of lancers and their combo will rip Thorns/vitality builds to shreds in two turns.

This is Madness 5, so it pretty much renders Bree and high vitality builds out of the question.

The Final boss also has an ability that causes high bless builds to detonate. (We had a high bless build, (LOTS of water, turned into bless. (40+ stacks) and had our mage and reg both just detonate.

I find this is an issue if your going to try and stray from the simple builds.

Heiner just makes absorbing damage (Like bless bombs) more manageable.

The problem with a lot of other builds, perticualr the healers.

Malika is incredibly item dependent if your going Dark healing, and you HAVE to avoid 2-3 fights that are immune to dark.

Nezgault, is the same deal

Reg and piggy work fine as straight healers, and while you CAN play Malika and Nez as straight healers, that kinda takes away from them being unique.

Heiner, with his unique cards make him far and away the best tank in the game, the fact he gets a taunt out of the gate is huge, not to mention his steel forge. And in the final fight, where armour isnt needed (As boss ignores it) he becomes and absalute god in terms of the single target damage he can do (I've seen numbers pushing 7000 on a SINGLE hit.

Me and my friend went for a meme build.

Reg

Grukly, Bree and Heiner

stacking health, bleed and armour and we coundnt get past Act 4 due to the lancer combo of silly damage vs thorns and silly damage vs vitality. (If it was just one of them, we woulda been fine, but two at the same time with said cards alternating was just too much damage to absorb.

[TnJ]

Originally posted by The Civillian:

For example, Act 4 their is a fight with a pair of lancers and their combo will rip Thorns/vitality builds to shreds in two turns.

This is Madness 5, so it pretty much renders Bree and high vitality builds out of the question.

Don't you just want to fight the other color?

If Dark enemies are a direct counter for you, fight the light ones, etc.

[Razor Feather]

Originally posted by The Civillian:

Originally posted by Razor Feather:

Thinking you need to be able to play your whole hand each turn is a trap. You really, really don't need to. If the only card you play on your turn is citadel, that's a pretty dang strong turn.

Wilbur and reginald are definetly both really strong. Wilbur gives absurd energy economy and still manages to do a lot of damage, and the free bless from reginald is just really good. They are hardly vital, though.

Bree can actually do *absurd* damage with thorns while still being plenty durable enough to survive, Gustov is a really solid flexible support character who can pretty easily replace a "healer" type, Nezgleckt can do a lot of healing while pouring out damage, zek can spam high cost spells out if you carefully manage his dark stacks, etc.

Hell, one of my current madness 4+2 (no supply selling) runs is doing fairly well with bree as a psuedo healer by spamming battle shout for the vitality, and thuls doing dispels with a pair of sweet melodys while heiner goes fire dps.

As long as you have a clear plan, you can get through at least mid level madness with some pretty wacky builds. There are certainly outliers in terms of power, and I think Wilbur is very much one of them, but most things will work.

The issue I have is that there are several enemy combo's that are specifically designed to destroy certain strats.

For example, Act 4 their is a fight with a pair of lancers and their combo will rip Thorns/vitality builds to shreds in two turns.

This is Madness 5, so it pretty much renders Bree and high vitality builds out of the question.

The Final boss also has an ability that causes high bless builds to detonate. (We had a high bless build, (LOTS of water, turned into bless. (40+ stacks) and had our mage and reg both just detonate.

I find this is an issue if your going to try and stray from the simple builds.

Heiner just makes absorbing damage (Like bless bombs) more manageable.

The problem with a lot of other builds, perticualr the healers.

Malika is incredibly item dependent if your going Dark healing, and you HAVE to avoid 2-3 fights that are immune to dark.

Nezgault, is the same deal

Reg and piggy work fine as straight healers, and while you CAN play Malika and Nez as straight healers, that kinda takes away from them being unique.

Heiner, with his unique cards make him far and away the best tank in the game, the fact he gets a taunt out of the gate is huge, not to mention his steel forge. And in the final fight, where armour isnt needed (As boss ignores it) he becomes and absalute god in terms of the single target damage he can do (I've seen numbers pushing 7000 on a SINGLE hit.

Me and my friend went for a meme build.

Reg

Grukly, Bree and Heiner

stacking health, bleed and armour and we coundnt get past Act 4 due to the lancer combo of silly damage vs thorns and silly damage vs vitality. (If it was just one of them, we woulda been fine, but two at the same time with said cards alternating was just too much damage to absorb.

I mean, that's sorta the "Don't over commit to any one tactic too hard" territory. The final boss also has an attack that blows up characters with high block, after all. While the dual lancer fight is painful, you can get through it with bree, you just need to keep an eye on the enemies ability cycle and make sure you're able to deal with the big hits when they come, and don't spam out thorns past what you actually need to win the fight.

[Octokitten]

Makes me think of watching careful on what debuffs enemies toss on you. Had to replay a fight twice, there is irony here, because I pretty stoned and didn't notice on my Grukli play through that both Bree and Magnus had the one turn "stoned" debuff on them. Nearly alternating. And was super confused while Gruks got like a single card that was usually sadness, thanks corruption, to stare at.

Answer? Every sharpen and sharpening stone and howl and blah-blah-blah skill card I played sucked out cards from hands until I was just staring at single card hands and got my head blown off.

Then I figured out who the hell was doing that, nuked them, and didn't play stoned cards while my characters were stoned .. while I was high af.