Testament is called a "man" in this GG Strive glossary, why the change for the DLC?

[Genolla]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2783010527

I genuinely have no problem with Testament being non-binary, and I don't get why people freak out over that fact on it's own, however why would they make this change so late in the series that even the base game calls him a man? Looks like a pretty lazy last-second change to me, but please do correct me if I'm wrong (preferably with proof)

[Yung Venuz]

I'm actually dying at the google translation of this article.

"Suffering from guilt due to his regaining his original personality, he desperately desperately wanders and eventually arrives at a forest called "the land of the devil."
There he meets his boobs daughter, Dizzy.
Interested in her bizarre birth, he is half-forced to hear her story from her.
As she listened to her story, he soon became aware of her as her "her source of herself" and re-entered her battle as a super dad to protect her."


Anyways,

Postat inițial de Kai:

There is a thing called lying and another one called changing your mind.

It's an article from a random third party. There's no direct tie to Arcsys or Ishiwatari, and it's very possible they simply saw Testament's old design with their eyeballs and went "yeah that's a guy," before writing the article. That's speculation, but it's an example of any number of misinterpretations they could have had.

The fact of the matter is that we have Ozawa using the words musei (無性) and the word ryosei (両性, which even comes up multiple times in the article btw) from the most recent official press release; in addition, we've got a 2002 year old interview where Daisuke says that Testament is "Androgynous," regarding their gender specifically.



Finding a random wiki article is about as credible as posting this: https://www.destructoid.com/guilty-gear-strive-testament-trailer-dlc-arc-system-works/

and saying "well Destructoid confirms Testament goes by They/Them now." No primary source cited, just the word of Chris Moyse who's entirely unrelated to the creator or IP holders.

[TurboTired]

There is nothing wrong with a fictional character in a fantastical setting being genderless.
There is everything wrong with real people in real life claiming to be genderless, and then even following through with genital mutilation.

[Kai]

Postat inițial de Yung Venuz:

I'm actually dying at the google translation of this article.

"Suffering from guilt due to his regaining his original personality, he desperately desperately wanders and eventually arrives at a forest called "the land of the devil."
There he meets his boobs daughter, Dizzy.
Interested in her bizarre birth, he is half-forced to hear her story from her.
As she listened to her story, he soon became aware of her as her "her source of herself" and re-entered her battle as a super dad to protect her."


Anyways,

Postat inițial de Kai:

There is a thing called lying and another one called changing your mind.

It's an article from a random third party. There's no direct tie to Arcsys or Ishiwatari, and it's very possible they simply saw Testament's old design with their eyeballs and went "yeah that's a guy," before writing the article. That's speculation, but it's an example of any number of misinterpretations they could have had.

The fact of the matter is that we have Ozawa using the words musei (無性) and the word ryosei (両性, which even comes up multiple times in the article btw) from the most recent official press release; in addition, we've got a 2002 year old interview where Daisuke says that Testament is "Androgynous," regarding their gender specifically.



Finding a random wiki article is about as credible as posting this: https://www.destructoid.com/guilty-gear-strive-testament-trailer-dlc-arc-system-works/

and saying "well Destructoid confirms Testament goes by They/Them now." No primary source cited, just the word of Chris Moyse who's entirely unrelated to the creator or IP holders.

The question is the translation from japanese to english. Why would a localised japanese wiki doc take a translation from english websites and then translate it back to the japanese.

[Yung Venuz]

Postat inițial de Kai:

The question is the translation from japanese to english. Why would a localised japanese wiki doc take a translation from english websites and then translate it back to the japanese.

What's with the strawman? You play Faust? I don't think they did translate it from En to Jp, but it's clear they're less informed than the developers. Plus, you know there's an edit button at the top of the page, yeah? Even I can click that and write whatever I want.

[Valentine (Lunaticus)]

Postat inițial de Kai:

You understand that if a person in this context transhumanize into a being that has an option of being either/or or both will retain the original stance no matter what, a person does not become one or the other or both by choice and there isnt such a thing as neither. Testament was a He and he will be a He regardless of becoming a Gear even though technically as a gear his sex cannot be determined as its some made up fictional being but if it retains his bit of humanity, he will retain his sexual preference so he is still a He. If I become a being with an option of whatever, ill still be a dude into chicks. sexual prefence isnt a choice and gender is a social construct.

Have they actually told the sexual preferences and what Testament identified as before becoming gear? You're talking as if we know all of that and that it's obvious, but was any of that info actually ever out there?

[Kai]

Postat inițial de Yung Venuz:

Postat inițial de Kai:

The question is the translation from japanese to english. Why would a localised japanese wiki doc take a translation from english websites and then translate it back to the japanese.

What's with the strawman? You play Faust? I don't think they did translate it from En to Jp, but it's clear they're less informed than the developers. Plus, you know there's an edit button at the top of the page, yeah? Even I can click that and write whatever I want.

Like i said, Its a matter of believing them, I dont. The loose translation is very convenient and the timing is too obvious. They couldve cleared it up long ago and corrected it in all these years, why now. Anyway, this is pointless.

[Kai]

Postat inițial de Valentine (Lunaticus):

Postat inițial de Kai:

You understand that if a person in this context transhumanize into a being that has an option of being either/or or both will retain the original stance no matter what, a person does not become one or the other or both by choice and there isnt such a thing as neither. Testament was a He and he will be a He regardless of becoming a Gear even though technically as a gear his sex cannot be determined as its some made up fictional being but if it retains his bit of humanity, he will retain his sexual preference so he is still a He. If I become a being with an option of whatever, ill still be a dude into chicks. sexual prefence isnt a choice and gender is a social construct.

Have they actually told the sexual preferences and what Testament identified as before becoming gear? You're talking as if we know all of that and that it's obvious, but was any of that info actually ever out there?

Hes been called a son, a noun, theres no questioning that. The question is after becoming a gear. Whether or not he was referred to as son based on the adapted pronoun, is again another mystery that works in their favour.

[Valentine (Lunaticus)]

Postat inițial de Kai:

Postat inițial de Valentine (Lunaticus):

Have they actually told the sexual preferences and what Testament identified as before becoming gear? You're talking as if we know all of that and that it's obvious, but was any of that info actually ever out there?

Hes been called a son, a noun, theres no questioning that. The question is after becoming a gear. Whether or not he was referred to as son based on the adapted pronoun, is again another mystery that works in their favour.

That answers literally none of that. It just confirms that we barely know anything about Testament before becoming gear.

[Lain]

Postat inițial de Sonnenrad:

There is nothing wrong with a fictional character in a fantastical setting being genderless.
There is everything wrong with real people in real life claiming to be genderless, and then even following through with genital mutilation.

once again it's demonstrated that all ramlethal enjoyers are based

[Shakeandbake]

Postat inițial de Megumin:

Postat inițial de Asuterisuku:

"Kare" is not gender specific and has an inflection more akin to "that person" in fewer words.

Kare is widely used for "he", it essentially means he.

No it doesn't. It can also carry over to those whose gender is not directly specified. Its a defaulting term in Japanese as well. Please study the language.

"most of the controversy inherently comes from the usage of the term "non-binary" which tends to carry political baggage. non-binary as a term is used by people who claim to not be a specific gender; and some even claim that they deserve special rights because of this form of self-indentification. it's usually where the whole debate goes downward spiral."

First off no it does not have an political baggage we only make it so for no reason other than a couple of people butthurt at the concept. Otherwise is a pretty neutral term. Non-binary as a term is used by people who claim to not be a specific gender because thats the point.

" and some even claim that they deserve special rights because of this form of self-indentification"

Way to go mask off. Jfc. Whats wrong with people respecting thier pronouns. Come on, its not that serious.

"it's usually where the whole debate goes downward spiral."

Its not up for debate though this is something the devs wrote are you seriously going to sit here and say that Daisuke was wrong about his own work? Seriously?

[Shakeandbake]

Postat inițial de Kai:

Postat inițial de Shakeandbake:

Did you just gloss over the part where I said:

"There was no deliberate way of addressing the term "they" as an individual in Japanese back then so they defaulted to "He"."

You understand that if a person in this context transhumanize into a being that has an option of being either/or or both will retain the original stance no matter what, a person does not become one or the other or both by choice and there isnt such a thing as neither. Testament was a He and he will be a He regardless of becoming a Gear even though technically as a gear his sex cannot be determined as its some made up fictional being but if it retains his bit of humanity, he will retain his sexual preference so he is still a He. If I become a being with an option of whatever, ill still be a dude into chicks. sexual prefence isnt a choice and gender is a social construct.

So, The argument about their stance on Testaments gender is simply a matter of believing them what theyre saying now that it was what they did 20 years ago, it was just about sticking to translation or theyre just doing it just now. I dont believe them. If they did this 10 years ago, I wouldve, but seeing how this is a trend nowadays, I dont, im sure most people that are hesitant are just because of this, the timing. call me a cynic.

I have yet to finish Soul Eater, I thought Crona was into Maka. Ill watch it and check it out.

They can be either or or none at all. Transhuman does not mean they fix to any binary hence why I said :they can be whatever they want or none at all." Which just means that thier identity is just that. Literally whatever. What is wrong with you? They didn't say anything currently other than what was written 20 years ago. Unless you know Daisuke so well that you can read his thoughts and tell him hes wrong about his own lore this isn't up for debate. These are things that were written 20 years ago and you're just confused because you don't know/ understand Japanese connotations fully.

But I find it cute that you call me a lair when you link me to a third party source WITH AN EDIT BUTTON as opposed to the official wiki! You slimey weasel!

[Shakeandbake]

Postat inițial de Yung Venuz:

Postat inițial de Kai:

The question is the translation from japanese to english. Why would a localised japanese wiki doc take a translation from english websites and then translate it back to the japanese.

What's with the strawman? You play Faust? I don't think they did translate it from En to Jp, but it's clear they're less informed than the developers. Plus, you know there's an edit button at the top of the page, yeah? Even I can click that and write whatever I want.

Oh ♥♥♥♥ I didn't even see that!

[🎃MaximusBlastalot🎃]

Postat inițial de Sonnenrad:

I would go so far as to say that no one would have had an issue with Testament's redesign if we didn't actually live in a clown world full of man-made horrors beyond our comprehension.

No his redesign is full on hot garbage.

They basically copy pastad a top hat on his old design.

[Shakeandbake]

Postat inițial de 🎃MaximusBlastalot🎃:

Postat inițial de Sonnenrad:

I would go so far as to say that no one would have had an issue with Testament's redesign if we didn't actually live in a clown world full of man-made horrors beyond our comprehension.

No his redesign is full on hot garbage.

They basically copy pastad a top hat on his old design.

When did they wear a vest?

[Lain]

Postat inițial de Shakeandbake:

Postat inițial de Megumin:

Kare is widely used for "he", it essentially means he.

No it doesn't. It can also carry over to those whose gender is not directly specified. Its a defaulting term in Japanese as well. Please study the language.

"most of the controversy inherently comes from the usage of the term "non-binary" which tends to carry political baggage. non-binary as a term is used by people who claim to not be a specific gender; and some even claim that they deserve special rights because of this form of self-indentification. it's usually where the whole debate goes downward spiral."

First off no it does not have an political baggage we only make it so for no reason other than a couple of people butthurt at the concept. Otherwise is a pretty neutral term. Non-binary as a term is used by people who claim to not be a specific gender because thats the point.

" and some even claim that they deserve special rights because of this form of self-indentification"

Way to go mask off. Jfc. Whats wrong with people respecting thier pronouns. Come on, its not that serious.

"it's usually where the whole debate goes downward spiral."

Its not up for debate though this is something the devs wrote are you seriously going to sit here and say that Daisuke was wrong about his own work? Seriously?

hey, don't blame me. i'm not the one who designed human beings to have different sets of chromosomes, nor am i the one who invented language quirks. being upset at me isn't going to change those things.

Postat inițial de Shakeandbake:

Its not up for debate though this is something the devs wrote are you seriously going to sit here and say that Daisuke was wrong about his own work? Seriously?

what?
i dunno how that's relevant to what I said, but the point i was making is that calling Testament non-binary is wrong because as Daisuke himself said, Testament is Testament. non-binary implies he indentifies as such and would otherwise have a gender. this is incorrect. he's sexless. i do call him a "he" because well, he's always been called that way, and he was a guy before being a gear, so it's more convenient for simplicity's sake.

i dunno what you're getting riled up for. i'm not upset at the character, just wish he received some more love instead of being representation bait because muh wiki said he's non-binary.

Postat inițial de Shakeandbake:

No it doesn't. It can also carry over to those whose gender is not directly specified. Its a defaulting term in Japanese as well. Please study the language.

"it can also"
it's widely used to refer to "he". whether it can be used in another way doesn't matter; i'm going to ignore any further discussion about this because you're being silly.