Hey guys! It's early access.

[Casey Steelspine]

Friendly reminder.

Instead of the incessant ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, provide constructive feedback for the devs. It literally just came out of Alpha and into Early Access. That means the game is still being developed. It's still being improved. Steam provides a nice big fat disclaimer on the store page stating such, and if you actually read the dev's breakdown of the game they state that this game is being developed utilizing player feedback. Don't wanna be part of it? Wait to buy the game until it hits 1.0.

Already bought the game? Cool. Not happy with it? Valid! Explain what you don't like, why you don't like it, and what you would like to see done to fix what you don't like.

[Æsir]

These posts popping up means only one thing. People ain't happy. So what are people not happy about? They beat the game already?

[Dragon]

I'm so tired of "this game is being developed utilizing player feedback."

It's just as cliche and insincere as "because covid."

Testing for games used to be free. Actually, companies paid people to test their games. If you wanna charge for something incomplete, you get to hear about how your customers hate how incomplete your game is.

Also, this is not a complete experience in any way. Valheim was a complete experience. Everything that was in the game was fleshed-out. They added a ton to the game, but what was there in the beginning was good enough to bite your teeth into. People are going to compare this to that, because this game is a lot like that one! Only this game has skill trees missing, very few QoL features people expect to see, and it doesn't do much to add or mix up the formula. Additionally, the GFX settings are nearly nonexistent. There is plenty to complain about.

You paid money to play the game.
You put in time to play the game.
You get to complain however you want to about the game.

Good day.

[Kakarot ✟]

Originally posted by Dragon:

I'm so tired of "this game is being developed utilizing player feedback."

It's just as cliche and insincere as "because covid."

Testing for games used to be free. Actually, companies paid people to test their games. If you wanna charge for something incomplete, you get to hear about how your customers hate how incomplete your game is.

Also, this is not a complete experience in any way. Valheim was a complete experience. Everything that was in the game was fleshed-out. They added a ton to the game, but what was there in the beginning was good enough to bite your teeth into. People are going to compare this to that, because this game is a lot like that one! Only this game has skill trees missing, very few QoL features people expect to see, and it doesn't do much to add or mix up the formula. Additionally, the GFX settings are nearly nonexistent. There is plenty to complain about.

You paid money to play the game.
You put in time to play the game.
You get to complain however you want to about the game.

Good day.

Valheim had little to no content on release. Valheim now though has a ton of content and things to do. Let's see how the devs handle this.

[Fyuriae]

Yeah well I bought the game, played it and refunded it. I'll probably get it again when the game will be a bit more polished, the performance isn't great but I guess its expected from an Early Access game. There's definitely potential in the game tho.

[Dragon]

Originally posted by Fyuriae:

Yeah well I bought the game, played it and refunded it. I'll probably get it again when the game will be a bit more polished, the performance isn't great but I guess its expected from an Early Access game. There's definitely potential in the game tho.

I agree there is a ton of potential. Time will tell.

[Jake]

Originally posted by Dragon:

I'm so tired of "this game is being developed utilizing player feedback."

It's just as cliche and insincere as "because covid."

Testing for games used to be free. Actually, companies paid people to test their games. If you wanna charge for something incomplete, you get to hear about how your customers hate how incomplete your game is.

Also, this is not a complete experience in any way. Valheim was a complete experience. Everything that was in the game was fleshed-out. They added a ton to the game, but what was there in the beginning was good enough to bite your teeth into. People are going to compare this to that, because this game is a lot like that one! Only this game has skill trees missing, very few QoL features people expect to see, and it doesn't do much to add or mix up the formula. Additionally, the GFX settings are nearly nonexistent. There is plenty to complain about.

You paid money to play the game.
You put in time to play the game.
You get to complain however you want to about the game.

Good day.

Two problems with the "playtesters used to be paid" thing;

1. Being an actual, paid playtester requires much more than just "play the game early". It's a job, you play the game in a much worse state than what you'd typically see in Early Access, often you'd be instructed on how you're meant to play and would be tasked with re-testing one part over and over. On top of that you actually needed to have qualities and skills such as being able to document and articulate your feedback in a concise and constructive manner (which immediately disqualifies about 98% of the people who post in the Steam Discussions of early access titles).

2. Even though you and I both agree that generally speaking, paying to play an unfinished game does not sound like the best deal, the fact remains it's a deal you're welcome not to take; not buying the game early and paying for it when it fully releases is a perfectly valid option that I think a lot of people should exercise rather than spend money on something they know they'll be disappointed in.

That's not to say you cannot offer criticism; nobody has a problem with people providing feedback. It's just that so many people here just plain suck at it.
Obviously the whole point of Early Access is to find out what people like and don't like and make sure more or less of it is added to the game accordingly, but there's a difference between something like "Skill progression feels underwhelming and lacks incentive to engage with it" and "wow the skills suck ass they stole my £25" - one of them makes a valid point that opens the door for possible solutions, and the other one is being petulant and obnoxious. Not to mention pointing out "X is incomplete" as if that's a startling revelation.

And while we're on the subject of Valheim, guys I promise you it's okay to like or even prefer Valheim without tearing down anything remotely similar. It's fine to say "Valheim did X better, would prefer to see it changed" instead of "WHY THIS GAME NO HAVE EVERYTHING BALLHEIM HAVE???//?"

[Pyro3000]

Originally posted by Dragon:

I'm so tired of "this game is being developed utilizing player feedback."

It's just as cliche and insincere as "because covid."

Testing for games used to be free. Actually, companies paid people to test their games. If you wanna charge for something incomplete, you get to hear about how your customers hate how incomplete your game is.

Also, this is not a complete experience in any way. Valheim was a complete experience. Everything that was in the game was fleshed-out. They added a ton to the game, but what was there in the beginning was good enough to bite your teeth into. People are going to compare this to that, because this game is a lot like that one! Only this game has skill trees missing, very few QoL features people expect to see, and it doesn't do much to add or mix up the formula. Additionally, the GFX settings are nearly nonexistent. There is plenty to complain about.

You paid money to play the game.
You put in time to play the game.
You get to complain however you want to about the game.

Good day.

Part of me wants to say that early access is good because studios can fund their development and make the game they want. On the other hand, we've surely all seen projects by now that get all their funding up front and just bail. Even Life is Strange put mediocre effort into Episode 4 and 5 because they saw the sales decline in 3. They knew they had all the money they were going to get, so they just shoved out a story that was literally ripped from twitter fan posts.

I hope that this game gets fleshed out and becomes worth the $30, but I've seen the way things went for Chronicles and Idle Adventures. Jagex is not new to just tossing a product when sales slow down and posting a weak apology.

[Casey Steelspine]

Originally posted by Pyro3000:

Originally posted by Dragon:

I'm so tired of "this game is being developed utilizing player feedback."

It's just as cliche and insincere as "because covid."

Testing for games used to be free. Actually, companies paid people to test their games. If you wanna charge for something incomplete, you get to hear about how your customers hate how incomplete your game is.

Also, this is not a complete experience in any way. Valheim was a complete experience. Everything that was in the game was fleshed-out. They added a ton to the game, but what was there in the beginning was good enough to bite your teeth into. People are going to compare this to that, because this game is a lot like that one! Only this game has skill trees missing, very few QoL features people expect to see, and it doesn't do much to add or mix up the formula. Additionally, the GFX settings are nearly nonexistent. There is plenty to complain about.

You paid money to play the game.
You put in time to play the game.
You get to complain however you want to about the game.

Good day.

Part of me wants to say that early access is good because studios can fund their development and make the game they want. On the other hand, we've surely all seen projects by now that get all their funding up front and just bail. Even Life is Strange put mediocre effort into Episode 4 and 5 because they saw the sales decline in 3. They knew they had all the money they were going to get, so they just shoved out a story that was literally ripped from twitter fan posts.

I hope that this game gets fleshed out and becomes worth the $30, but I've seen the way things went for Chronicles and Idle Adventures. Jagex is not new to just tossing a product when sales slow down and posting a weak apology.

You have valid points, but the major thing here is: This game is already in a really good state, it just needs polish and more content. Plus it's tied to the name of the game that is the only thing keeping Jagex alive. If they're dumb enough to cash grab and dip on this then they deserve to sink. I'd hate to see it because I've been playing Runescape itself since day one, but if they ♥♥♥♥ around they'll find out.

Point remains, though. Provide constructive feedback instead of just pissing and whining about the game or just refund it and move on.

[Kashra Fall]

Originally posted by Dragon:

I'm so tired of "this game is being developed utilizing player feedback."

It's just as cliche and insincere as "because covid."

Testing for games used to be free. Actually, companies paid people to test their games. If you wanna charge for something incomplete, you get to hear about how your customers hate how incomplete your game is.

Also, this is not a complete experience in any way. Valheim was a complete experience. Everything that was in the game was fleshed-out. They added a ton to the game, but what was there in the beginning was good enough to bite your teeth into. People are going to compare this to that, because this game is a lot like that one! Only this game has skill trees missing, very few QoL features people expect to see, and it doesn't do much to add or mix up the formula. Additionally, the GFX settings are nearly nonexistent. There is plenty to complain about.

You paid money to play the game.
You put in time to play the game.
You get to complain however you want to about the game.

Good day.

Valheim was voxel and allowed terrain deformation and had a unique building system. To say it was "Complete." is just hilarious to me though, it was barebones and for the longest time, people thought it was abandoned. I think people should just stop looking at survival games at their EA launch, because this happens every single time. Enshrouded suffered the same. People burned through the content and then just started complaining (It had a pretty major graphics problem with the shadows on day and night switch, 16 fps ftw!), now look at it. Amazing what early access can do, eh?

[Pyro3000]

Originally posted by Kashra Fall:

Originally posted by Dragon:

I'm so tired of "this game is being developed utilizing player feedback."

It's just as cliche and insincere as "because covid."

Testing for games used to be free. Actually, companies paid people to test their games. If you wanna charge for something incomplete, you get to hear about how your customers hate how incomplete your game is.

Also, this is not a complete experience in any way. Valheim was a complete experience. Everything that was in the game was fleshed-out. They added a ton to the game, but what was there in the beginning was good enough to bite your teeth into. People are going to compare this to that, because this game is a lot like that one! Only this game has skill trees missing, very few QoL features people expect to see, and it doesn't do much to add or mix up the formula. Additionally, the GFX settings are nearly nonexistent. There is plenty to complain about.

You paid money to play the game.
You put in time to play the game.
You get to complain however you want to about the game.

Good day.

Valheim was voxel and allowed terrain deformation and had a unique building system. To say it was "Complete." is just hilarious to me though, it was barebones and for the longest time, people thought it was abandoned. I think people should just stop looking at survival games at their EA launch, because this happens every single time. Enshrouded suffered the same. People burned through the content and then just started complaining (It had a pretty major graphics problem with the shadows on day and night switch, 16 fps ftw!), now look at it. Amazing what early access can do, eh?

Yeah Valheim offered a lot in Early Access, but it was early access for a long time. It did not have the same offerings when it first came out as when it got its second wind in popularity.

[Dragon]

I didn't say Valheim was complete. I said it was a complete experience. There was a lot to do. What was there, was good. It was not grossly apparent that things were missing or under-cooked.

I learned that the devs making this game are a new development team within Jagex and this is their first game, which could explain a lot about the state of the game.

Either way, I still think the game is too early for EA. It does, however, have a lot of potential.

One of the issues here could be expectations. A lot of different types of games go in and out of EA. Some of them enter EA way closer to being finished, some enter EA with store assets still in the game. I guess it's up to each individual person what is acceptable to be released as an EA product. Gamers are never going to unanimously agree on what EA should be. Valheim, and enshrouded were great EA releases, IMO. Enshrouded had over 40 hours of content going into EA, which I would say is overly-ambitious. Valheim also had a massive amount of content when going into EA. It's hard not to compare these 3 games. Dragon Wilds doesn't currently hold a candle to those games when they released into EA. I guess that's the problem I have with it.

I think it will get a lot better. It has good bones and great potential. I would not recommend it in it's current state, though.

[Matex]

Who cares if its early access? You charge money ergo you sell a product. No excuse, early access or not the consumer expects the moneys worth otherwise you can go homeless.

[Casey Steelspine]

Originally posted by Matex:

Who cares if its early access? You charge money ergo you sell a product. No excuse, early access or not the consumer expects the moneys worth otherwise you can go homeless.

They charge money with the disclaimer it is an incomplete product and still in development. You're given plenty of fore-warning about the state of the game and where it is by both the development team and Steam. If you still purchase it knowing this and choose to piss and moan like a child because its exactly what you were told it would be that's on you. Go sit down and let the adults talk.

[Casey Steelspine]

Originally posted by Dragon:

I didn't say Valheim was complete. I said it was a complete experience. There was a lot to do. What was there, was good. It was not grossly apparent that things were missing or under-cooked.

I learned that the devs making this game are a new development team within Jagex and this is their first game, which could explain a lot about the state of the game.

Either way, I still think the game is too early for EA. It does, however, have a lot of potential.

One of the issues here could be expectations. A lot of different types of games go in and out of EA. Some of them enter EA way closer to being finished, some enter EA with store assets still in the game. I guess it's up to each individual person what is acceptable to be released as an EA product. Gamers are never going to unanimously agree on what EA should be. Valheim, and enshrouded were great EA releases, IMO. Enshrouded had over 40 hours of content going into EA, which I would say is overly-ambitious. Valheim also had a massive amount of content when going into EA. It's hard not to compare these 3 games. Dragon Wilds doesn't currently hold a candle to those games when they released into EA. I guess that's the problem I have with it.

I think it will get a lot better. It has good bones and great potential. I would not recommend it in it's current state, though.

I do agree that I think they put it on EA a little too soon. The fact that they don't even have magic and ranged open to leveling but have bows, staves, the appropriate armors, and even skillbooks that you can loot is just... wild to me. I can't wrap my head around that one. I know it's on their roadmap but I hope it's in an update that comes very soon because you're basically stuck using melee unless you don't mind wasting the XP and not getting any perks for the other two skills.

Otherwise I'm pretty content with where it is to start out. Lots of lore, lots to explore, decent amount of crafting and building you can do. Definitely needs some balance tweaks.

[Mr.Swan]

ist the reason why you're complaining right now because people are explaining what they want and what their problems are? are you serious?