What's the parry good for?

[taronin]

I've just finished with this game, and while the combat feels pretty good on the whole, my experience with the parry mechanic has been consistently lackluster. (Now, the rest of this is assuming I'm already using it on an attack that's "weak" to it and not getting flung around the room for my troubles, which is nice as a way to encourage us not to parry everything.)

The biggest problem I have with it is this: the stun you get as a result of a successful parry is very short. Oftentimes, the recovery delay from dodging the enemy attack gives you a wider window to counter than the parry does; given that the timing on the parry is much tighter, this just doesn't feel good. Aside from the handful of situations where it's more important not to move than to have the most effective way to avoid damage, the parry just isn't that useful.

In short, if a parry is going to be harder to pull off than a dodge, it should also (at least most of the time) be *better* than a dodge. Right now, it feels like most of the time it is worse. Am I missing something about the mechanic that redeems it, or is it just intended to be highly situational?

(EDIT: to be clear, when I talk about the dodge having a wider window than the parry, I'm not talking about raw i-frames. In practice, as soon as you see an enemy winding up an attack, you can dodge through them and be safe, even if the dodge i-frames end well before the enemy hit actually lands, because by that point you are outside of the hurtbox of the attack. With the parry, you have to time the attack within the i-frame window, which is a much narrower constraint on when you can press the button and successfully avoid damage.)

[StoneofTriumph]

This was the result of people in Early Access just wanting to have a way to avoid damage that didn't require movement- a "spot dodge", I believe it was called. Basically something they could use on the game's narrow platforms or other times they'd just rather not be bothered because they were that afraid of contact damage.

It was pointed out that the Headless Defender already did that, but... They seemed to want something less limited.

[Ringlet]

I found myself using parry all the time, especially late game. It was useful in a tight situation where you really didn't want to move from a standing spot. For example, parrying while trading projectiles with range enemy from afar. Also you can parry CONSECUTIVELY, as how parrying in Street Fighter 3 works. Meaning you can timely spam R2 before the series of projectile hit you. (also big bonus for the *Kachin* *Kachin* *Kachin* sound effect)

[hisv]

I used it mostly when I wasn't using a counter skill to kill those invul knights and on a boss fight that spawned some sticks from the ground to keep me on air for a while, worked great.

[IronBudmeister]

From what I've experienced parrying is best for tight platforms / corridors where dodging isn't feasible, and the slight chip to posture the enemy gets in addition to the hit-stun. It's great against the aquatic monsters or any light enemies with predictable moves.

[Averis]

You aren't missing anything. There are many enemies that are not staggered by parry or will be stunned for 0.5 seconds before immediately attacking again. Why? No idea. It was one of the many design choices that had me scratching my head the entire game. It is simply not worth it to parry because of the way the developers designed it. There isn't a mechanic that makes it better unless you count the Headless Knight/Urn (which are spirits and not an innate part of the mechanic).

People can say that they used it as many times as they want and found it "useful", but that doesn't change the fact that it's worse than just dodging in almost every situation (even in tight spaces since Lily can still use the I-frames of her dodge even if she's not moving) and adds nothing to the combat.

Short story short: Parrying isn't better than dodging and gives no real reward on most enemies, but is harder by design because the developers didn't think about reward for increased difficulty. That lack of thinking results in two mechanics that accomplish the same thing with no real difference, but one is unreasonably harder than the other.

[Bankai9212]

I wouldn’t say it’s harder, has the same effect plus certain spirits are better for poise damage anyway.

[hisv]

引用自 Averis：

You aren't missing anything. There are many enemies that are not staggered by parry or will be stunned for 0.5 seconds before immediately attacking again. Why? No idea. It was one of the many design choices that had me scratching my head the entire game. It is simply not worth it to parry because of the way the developers designed it. There isn't a mechanic that makes it better unless you count the Headless Knight/Urn (which are spirits and not an innate part of the mechanic).

People can say that they used it as many times as they want and found it "useful", but that doesn't change the fact that it's worse than just dodging in almost every situation (even in tight spaces since Lily can still use the I-frames of her dodge even if she's not moving) and adds nothing to the combat.

Short story short: Parrying isn't better than dodging and gives no real reward on most enemies, but is harder by design because the developers didn't think about reward for increased difficulty. That lack of thinking results in two mechanics that accomplish the same thing with no real difference, but one is unreasonably harder than the other.

You can still use parry to kill some knights that only take damage after they're countered/parried, like the big shield ones, that small/fast one, parry WAS useful. Also used it in small platforms when the annoying mosquitos kept shooting me. It's also useful to keep you in the air for a longer time.

[Bankai9212]

I means you can just dodge behind them or use breath attacks.

[hisv]

引用自 Bankai9212：

I means you can just dodge behind them or use breath attacks.

Going to the back the smaller knights didn't work, they still take zero damage (unless you charge the hammer). The parry was very useful against these guys.

[taronin]

引用自 high impact sexual violence：

引用自 Bankai9212：

I means you can just dodge behind them or use breath attacks.

Going to the back the smaller knights didn't work, they still take zero damage (unless you charge the hammer). The parry was very useful against these guys.

I don't know what you're talking about. They take damage from behind just fine -- you just have to wait for them to start an attack before dodging behind them or they turn around to face you almost instantly.

[Bankai9212]

? Maybe it’s your setup, you do solid damage to them based on what you use. Plus based on that, wouldn’t matter if you parry them since staggered or not you’ll do the same amount of damage.

[Mr. Brokencyde]

I think they just wanted the parry to be situational. I don't see what's wrong with that, it's not like it's nightmarishly hard to use.

[Bankai9212]

Well it’s not it’s more like it sharing the same button for the dodge. If the devs could let us remap it I don’t see any issue. As I said it’s funational.