Underground Belts Needed. Yes I know about arching belts.

[Dersh]

So this is basically why Im frustrated and done with this game for now.

The belt system in this game blows in one aspect. Placing belts over other belts. I must have spent 15 minutes trying to do this efficiently. Its just a pain in the ass. Its not very forgiving in terms of the length you need the arch to be.

Now I am going to compare this to Factorio a bit.

In Factorio I can slap down an underground belt start and end. Its simple, efficient, and clean looking. I have built massive setups in Factorio, and other than the planning of the layout it doesn't take very long. In Dyson Sphere Program its a huge hassle, I personally think it ends up looking goofy, you need a lot more space to do it. In Factorio I could have it done in one space to run the belt through.

It may seem whiny but this just killed the fun factor for me, especially considering you have less space to build because of water constraints. What do you all think about underground belts? I don't think copying another aspect of Factorio to be an issue.

Devs: could you please add Underground Belts to the research tree?

[Arcane]

No need because you only need spaghetti in the early game. After early game there is no need for overlapping belt or any kind of complex belt layouts. Just ground level belts is more than enough.

The answer is Logistics Towers.

[Dersh]

Still though I lost interest when I spent 40 minutes to an hour trying to get one area setup that would have taken me like 5 minutes in Factorio. I know I am comparing it to that game but thats my beef with Dyson Sphere Program. I still think this game needs underground belts. You could keep the arching belts for people that really like it but id get rid of it.

[YoulluPukki]

No, you don't

[Regicide]

Originally posted by Dersh:

Still though I lost interest when I spent 40 minutes to an hour trying to get one area setup that would have taken me like 5 minutes in Factorio. I know I am comparing it to that game but thats my beef with Dyson Sphere Program. I still think this game needs underground belts. You could keep the arching belts for people that really like it but id get rid of it.

I feel you, it was something I was missing on my first two playthroughs, too. But they're, youi just need to know how to avoid crossing belts or how to handle it (Splitters work excellent for this, for example, I hope you know that you can switch Splitter Layout by pressing Tab) and after checking out Layouts from other Players I realized "Oh damn, I don't even need to cross the belts, if I set it up like he did" becasue it can make an huge impact how you handle input and output belts.

And finally with the now, not so far? (^^) Blueprint patch you will be able to save your solutions once achieved and you never need to bother with it then again.

So don't give up yet. This game is great and will become even greater (I'm so curious about the space station milestone!)

[Piorn]

You don't really want "Underground Belts", you want a belt segment that ignores collision. An underground belt would just be a nightmare to entangle.
Personally, I found that a pair of splitters with elevated input slots work perfectly fine, because they eliminate the clumsy ramping.

Thematically, the devs could propably implement a warper belt, that zaps resources 5 points ahead, but I'd rather have them focus on content.

[Xilo The Odd]

Originally posted by Piorn:

You don't really want "Underground Belts", you want a belt segment that ignores collision. An underground belt would just be a nightmare to entangle.
Personally, I found that a pair of splitters with elevated input slots work perfectly fine, because they eliminate the clumsy ramping.

Thematically, the devs could propably implement a warper belt, that zaps resources 5 points ahead, but I'd rather have them focus on content.

this is a neat concept. i could get behind that.

yeah underground belts... they work in factorio i dont see them being practical here. like above ground belts you would likely have to extend it a minimum distance anyway.

after logistics towers my only weird belt placements is me being lazy and cramming elevated belts out of tower ports to feed specific spots in factories so i can overcome the belt limitations.

[pat]

I don't think that underground belts will fix much. I do think that there are some things that could offer improvements.

For example, reduce the footprint of splitters. There's no need for them to take up that much room! They currently take the same amount of space as an assembler or smelter. If splitters were reduced to the same one-square footprint as a belt, you could design more interesting layouts.

In games such as these, graphical items on the screen are often ridiculously proportioned to accommodate gameplay over realism, and that's fine. Should a conveyor belt realistically be one third the width of a smelting facility??? No, but to be able to easily see it, they give it a larger size. So I don't see the problem with reducing the size of the splitter. It doesn't *have* to be larger than the belts.

[kris44dad]

Personally, I'd like to see some sort of elevator mechanism before underground belts but, they're both similar solutions.

[Dirkels]

If I understand OP correctly he just want built a tunnel entrance and a tunnel exit and the boxes just move between them without having to specify the path of the underground conveyor.

This is basicly how logistical towers work. Because of that and multi level belts, I don't see a need for tunnels.

[Dersh]

Originally posted by Arcane:

No need because you only need spaghetti in the early game. After early game there is no need for overlapping belt or any kind of complex belt layouts. Just ground level belts is more than enough.
The answer is Logistics Towers.

Even early game, Factorio has underground belts. Im just telling you all I am turned off by this game because of a gameplay mechanic that sucks and wastes my time. Otherwise I will wait until some modder brings underground belts to the game.

Originally posted by Regicide:

"Oh damn, I don't even need to cross the belts, if I set it up like he did" becasue it can make an huge impact how you handle input and output belts.

Im not sure who plays Factorio. Again I hate to compare this game to Factorio but in terms of running belts Factorio is much easier and efficient, Underground belts would be much simpler to use than above ground arches. Im not saying you couldnt keep the above ground junk for people that want it. Underground belts have a start point, then I can run another belt overtop before the end point where the resources keep coming out. It has a length underground of 4,6,8 spaces depending on the MK Number. Simple, clean, I dont have to screw around with height wasting my gaming time. As seen below.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2549632646

Originally posted by Xilo The Odd:

this is a neat concept. i could get behind that.
yeah underground belts... they work in factorio i dont see them being practical here. like above ground belts you would likely have to extend it a minimum distance anyway.

after logistics towers my only weird belt placements is me being lazy and cramming elevated belts out of tower ports to feed specific spots in factories so i can overcome the belt limitations.

Im just telling you what turned me off this game. Underground belts can work in Factorio with one space letting a belt through coming out the other side, see the picture, play Factorio. Its super simple and easy to use. Different colored underground belts can even cross each other. Plus two resources can be carried on each belt, logistically its more complex yet simpler. WIth this arching belts I had to have it atleast 4-6 spaces long before it would come down. It takes up more room, is a pain in the butt. So what if its fixed in mid or late game.

Originally posted by pat:

I don't think that underground belts will fix much. I do think that there are some things that could offer improvements.

Obviously never played Factorio. I have less space to work with than in factorio, allowing me to make belt arrays would simplify things immensely. Ive played Factorio, Satisfactory, and now Dyson Sphere Program. Satisfactory is a dream to set things up, Factorio is easier without the 3D aspect, Dyson Sphere Programs version is annoying especially considering I have less space to build on a planet. Im telling you it turned me off from the game, theres no waiting hours for late game, its not fun so I will move onto something else, write my feelings in a review which I did and move on to something that is fun.

Originally posted by dendriti:

hit <tab> when placing splitters to get the elevated splitter. but if you are doing this too often you should reconsider your Logistics setup.

This is great advice thank you. If I come back to this game I will try to remember to use an elevated splitter. But as you can see from the picture above I like my belt lines clean and lined up. Im usually streaming games so when it leads to 40 minutes of accomplishing nothing its boring to play and watch.

Originally posted by kris44dad:

Personally, I'd like to see some sort of elevator mechanism before underground belts but, they're both similar solutions.

Honestly man if you played Factorio youd see how simple and easy to use they are. You cant cross two red belts in the same square, but a red underground belt can go under a yellow, and finally a blue underground belt can cross under yellow and red. Its an awesome system. See the picture.

Originally posted by Dirkels:

If I understand OP correctly he just want built a tunnel entrance and a tunnel exit and the boxes just move between them without having to specify the path of the underground conveyor.

Yes thats exactly what I want to do.

Originally posted by Dirkels:

This is basicly how logistical towers work. Because of that and multi level belts, I don't see a need for tunnels.

Right but im not at Logistic towers or Bots yet. In Factorio I have thousands of bots that move things around in late game, but belts move more product and are available in early game, lastly second fastest is trains somewhat early-middle. Getting to late game is going to be a slog because of the belt system. Again Im not saying you cant keep the 3D aspect of belts, just add in one more way to do it so I dont have to screw around with a belt I should be able to slap down in less than 5 minutes.

So hopefully you can see my point in the screenshot above.

[Dersh]

Originally posted by dendriti:

Frankly if you're not even at logistics towers (there are no bots except what you start with and upgrade), you should probably hold off on game design suggestions. Pre-logistics is about 10% of the game. Play around with planetary and interstellar logistics and you'll see that very little time is spent on belts.

I dont make games, I play them. I am giving input based on what ive played. Thats why this game is early access duh. I have 1241 games in my library. Ive played a lot of amazing games. I will keep this one in my inventory but fixing annoyances sell more games dummy.

I bet you dont even own Factorio.

[Regicide]

Originally posted by Dersh:

Originally posted by dendriti:

Frankly if you're not even at logistics towers (there are no bots except what you start with and upgrade), you should probably hold off on game design suggestions. Pre-logistics is about 10% of the game. Play around with planetary and interstellar logistics and you'll see that very little time is spent on belts.

I dont make games, I play them. I am giving input based on what ive played. Thats why this game is early access duh. I have 1241 games in my library. Ive played a lot of amazing games. I will keep this one in my inventory but fixing annoyances sell more games dummy.

I bet you dont even own Factorio.

What he wants to say is that you are way to focused on Factorio. Give this game a chance, keep playing until Logistic Towers and you will truly understand

I really was in the same situation, cursing the fact that there are no Underground Belts (and before you ask, yes I played Factorio a lot). But after realizing how easy and fast you achieve those Logistic Towers in DSP (much much much faster and easier as in Facotorio, where bots are midgame/lategame) and how greatly they change how you need to play this game, I never had any problems again.

For the very start there are some easy rules and workarounds, it's not like as if you need to cross a belt every 2 minutes. So if it really comes to that annoyance, it's really you who is trying to play this game to much as if you play Factorio, but it's not Factorio. Give this game a chance and play it the way it's meant to be played.

There are even parts in this game where I'd say that Factorio could learn from. But you will never see that if you permanently compare it to other games while playing it.

IF you want to try it again, I can highly recommend the Starter Base Layout form Nilaus. No need to cross any belts and it will easy fulfill all your needs until you get the Logistic Towers. And as Factorio Fan I guess you know him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Db7qZp5VyE

[Dersh]

Originally posted by Regicide:

WHat he wants to say is that you are way to focused on Factorio. Give this game a chance, keep playing until Logistic Towers and you will truly understand

I really was in the same situation, cursing the fact that there are no Underground Belts (and before you ask, yes I played Factorio a lot). But after realizing how easy and fast you achieve those Logistic Towers in DSP (much much much faster and easier as in Facotorio, where bots are midgame/lategame) and how greatly they change how you need to play this game, I never had any problems again.

For the very start there are some easy rules and workarounds, it's not like as if you need to cross a belt every 2 minutes. So if it really comes to that annoyance, it's really you who is trying to play this game to much as if you play Factorio, but it's not Factorio. Give this game a chance and play it the way it's meant to be played.

There are even parts in this game where I'd say that Factorio could learn from. But you will never see that if you permanently compare it to other games while playing it.

I might try it again later thanks to the stacking sorter tips, now if only belts would stack.

[Regicide]

Originally posted by Dersh:

Originally posted by Regicide:

WHat he wants to say is that you are way to focused on Factorio. Give this game a chance, keep playing until Logistic Towers and you will truly understand

I really was in the same situation, cursing the fact that there are no Underground Belts (and before you ask, yes I played Factorio a lot). But after realizing how easy and fast you achieve those Logistic Towers in DSP (much much much faster and easier as in Facotorio, where bots are midgame/lategame) and how greatly they change how you need to play this game, I never had any problems again.

For the very start there are some easy rules and workarounds, it's not like as if you need to cross a belt every 2 minutes. So if it really comes to that annoyance, it's really you who is trying to play this game to much as if you play Factorio, but it's not Factorio. Give this game a chance and play it the way it's meant to be played.

There are even parts in this game where I'd say that Factorio could learn from. But you will never see that if you permanently compare it to other games while playing it.

I might try it again later thanks to the stacking sorter tips, now if only belts would stack.

They acutally do. You can lift belt up and down with arrow keys, and build them on top of each other.

You really should check out Nilaus Jump Starter base, you maybe know this guy from Factorio. I'm posting this here again, because it was a late edit on my last post, so you might have missed it. It's worth the 25 Minutes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Db7qZp5VyE

And one last thing, I think it got not mentioned yet. Splitters can also simply used as a crossings. You can set filters and prioritys in the splitter, this way you can easy cross a belt without mixing up content, should the need arise.

[Dersh]

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