dark fog feels weird/awkward/bad

[ciel]

the idea of having something to fight in this game has merit! new challenges for production and logistics! sounds great on paper.

but... after two playthroughs with the dark fog...

it feels jank! how am i supposed to believe that these robots are a highly advanced threat when they willingly deliver me resources via ineffective kamikaze attacks? how am i supposed to take advantage of those drops when the game's logistics tools are ill suited to sorting and supplying stuff out of the analysis base? why would i want to even bother sorting my drops when that requires constantly updating filters and the blacklist? it feels like the only way to actually take advantage of the drops is to build a "farm" which is entirely immersion breaking. they're not even challenging, either! my last run i completed the game with all of the dark fog's stats doubled. besides losing a few buildings early on, the threat level didn't feel any different than playing with base difficulty, just a tiny bit more work resupplying combat drones. if you don't mute it, the alert sound becomes almost constant once you're in midgame.

if your response to this is "then just disable dark fog!" then you really just don't get it. why would poor design suddenly become okay if it's optional? dark fog reflects badly on the design of the game as a whole and makes me doubt the direction the developers are taking. for the foreseeable future, new content is probably going to largely focus on dark fog, the base game ostensibly is designed to support the dark fog gameplay - its a gaping hole in the game design if you disable dark fog! I don't wan't to play without combat, I just want the combat to be good and worth playing for ♥♥♥♥'s sake.



"dark fog" is also just a really stupid name.

[dhitch89]

Combat is just another feature, same as it is for Factorio and Satisfactory; whether active or not, the base game is still that of automation and resource gathering with their respective flavors of such. Getting more resources from enemies is just a bonus.

^DSP's combat is currently incomplete and will be expanded further for the space side of things later in 2024, but they're never meant to be the main threat. That'd be the logistical variety of issues, such as how you approach bottlenecks, blockages, etc.

[Kyrros]

Originally posted by ciel:

"dark fog" is also just a really stupid name.

To be fair, I don't think anyone in this particular conversation knows enough mandarin to know whether or not it's simply a localization issue with that name - the native language name may be more meaningful.

... then again, maybe not. The name is basically a word that also describes what it does, over the whole galaxy. An "Exactly what is says on the tin" kind of name.

[boolybooly]

try 3000%, you will be grateful for those drops. I played and completed a 3000% game and now I am grateful to play a default game, happy in my retirement

[Nellvan]

At least it sounds better than "Grey Goo" imo. And if you don't believe that self-replicating, all-consuming robots are scary ... yeah well ok on default settings there really isn't much to them.

[Mylon]

Originally posted by boolybooly:

try 3000%, you will be grateful for those drops. I played and completed a 3000% game and now I am grateful to play a default game, happy in my retirement

Any tips? I attempted 3000% game and when the fog started sending about 80 units each wave, I couldn't keep up. I rushed missile technology and that helped, but I was pouring all of my resources into missiles and turrets and couldn't keep up.

I figure if I burned enough metadata I could get the tier 2 missile ammo, supplement with laser turrets, but doing it without metadata is part of the challenge.

[SKARDAVNELNATE]

Originally posted by ciel:

it feels jank! how am i supposed to believe that these robots are a highly advanced threat when they willingly deliver me resources via ineffective kamikaze attacks?

The advisor mentions that the Dark Fog are a product of the Mechanical Energy Program which was discontinued because it was inefficient. So lore wise they are an outdated threat at best. And they only warrant that much because they're doing things they weren't intended to, so the real threat level can't be accurately calculated.

[boolybooly]

Originally posted by Mylon:

Originally posted by boolybooly:

try 3000%, you will be grateful for those drops. I played and completed a 3000% game and now I am grateful to play a default game, happy in my retirement

Any tips? I attempted 3000% game and when the fog started sending about 80 units each wave, I couldn't keep up. I rushed missile technology and that helped, but I was pouring all of my resources into missiles and turrets and couldn't keep up.

I figure if I burned enough metadata I could get the tier 2 missile ammo, supplement with laser turrets, but doing it without metadata is part of the challenge.

Sure, I had the advantage of starting before the December patch and 140k Cu on the start planet but the strat worked.

My game plan was to try to out tech and reduce threat to stay ahead. Basic plan was to get laser and signal tower. Use laser to reduce ammo needs.

Obviously get turret ASAP and hand craft in the first wave to get this and Mecha shield and use Mecha where feasible to make stuff to delay the waves. Keep the factory small, power low but enough for turrets, core research and some production and use switches instead of sorters where possible.

You can put a small depot on top of a switch and turn it into a kind of storage mushroom which uses no power and does not upset the DF as much.

Surround the first base with gauss turret belt. 6 turrets wave 1, expanding per wave with emergency power for firing power peak from 2 thermal generators (not geothermal) but try to turn them off between waves.

Dont leave stuff running you dont need, collect from outside the base to depot inside and then disassemble collectors etc during waves, belts can stay. You have to work on staying ahead while you get laser and signal. Also max weapon upgrades and durability, focus and dont dilly dally with anything other than combat assisting tech.

Pre laser treat missiles as resource hogs as damage per copper is not as good as Implosion Cannon. Cannon give knockback and deliver good splash damage per shot to all in a group but can waste shots in overkill. Missiles split their weaker damage output and supply the coup de grâce to damaged DF more efficiently, pick off stragglers but are inefficient on their own as you discovered, I used about 6 of each before signal tower with hefty ranks of gauss turret to provide final fire line but they also waste copper. Aim to use implosion cannon range to do as much damage as possible before the other weapons fire.

ASAP put a signal tower firebase as far away from the DF bases as possible to reduce threat cycle. Do the opposite of turret creep. Have a back up tower behind the front one. Have BABs close by. Research drone speed for repair efficiency.

Get lasers and set up the final BAB farm, nest ranges carefully. ImpCannon remain useful with laser to break up dense groups but half as many needed, let lasers do the damage and missiles can be reduced and kept well back. Gauss are redundant. I think the new EMP might help lasers but I have not tried it yet, rounds are pricey.

Build anywhere which is not on a DF attack path, splash out on wind gens and accumulators to make sure the lasers have enough energy to fire continuously.

Tech up the firepower upgrades to lvl5 ASAP. Use proliferation. Use stone for Si early on and get Ti by hand mining boulder and deposits on other planets away from DF bases. That is tedious but you need to get Mecha drive warp as a priority while your fire base is farming drops. If you make a mine you get attacked sooner and dont get the Ti you need and will have to farm more. Swings and roundabouts.

Get warp and go exploring, firstly to hand mine more Ti, secondly to find vulnerable looking planets where you can either farm or eliminate DF bases so you can get Ti and Si in quantity. You will need shield and ideally plasma cannon or missile space defences ASAP if you take out a DF base relay.

That is what I learned, hope it helps. :)

[Shahadem]

There is nothing wrong with the name Dark Fog in English.

It follows basic English naming conventions. Take for example "dark matter".

A lot of directly translated Chinese names do not work in English because they are a long list consisting of four, five or sometimes more words.

[Horschdt]

Just because you have only a very limited understanding how to play the game, the game and/or elements of it are "bad" ? How about.. dont play it if its not ur cup of tea? Its not the games fault that u are incapable of managing drops (or disable them if u dont want em) or how to fight the bases without getting the alarm sounds at all? And no, you dont need reddit to find out how to do that.. well.. you maybe do. Just by telling me u did two "playthroughs" tells the story. U are probably one of those who think the game ends with the "mission complete" tech.
Thats the end of the tutorial for anyone really playing that game.

[vkobe]

Originally posted by ciel:

the idea of having something to fight in this game has merit! new challenges for production and logistics! sounds great on paper.

but... after two playthroughs with the dark fog...

it feels jank! how am i supposed to believe that these robots are a highly advanced threat when they willingly deliver me resources via ineffective kamikaze attacks? how am i supposed to take advantage of those drops when the game's logistics tools are ill suited to sorting and supplying stuff out of the analysis base? why would i want to even bother sorting my drops when that requires constantly updating filters and the blacklist? it feels like the only way to actually take advantage of the drops is to build a "farm" which is entirely immersion breaking. they're not even challenging, either! my last run i completed the game with all of the dark fog's stats doubled. besides losing a few buildings early on, the threat level didn't feel any different than playing with base difficulty, just a tiny bit more work resupplying combat drones. if you don't mute it, the alert sound becomes almost constant once you're in midgame.

if your response to this is "then just disable dark fog!" then you really just don't get it. why would poor design suddenly become okay if it's optional? dark fog reflects badly on the design of the game as a whole and makes me doubt the direction the developers are taking. for the foreseeable future, new content is probably going to largely focus on dark fog, the base game ostensibly is designed to support the dark fog gameplay - its a gaping hole in the game design if you disable dark fog! I don't wan't to play without combat, I just want the combat to be good and worth playing for ♥♥♥♥'s sake.



"dark fog" is also just a really stupid name.

you complaint than in video game and movie evil dude are bad

yes in halo covenant lost against humanity

in star war empire lost against rebel

in star trek borg lost against federation

i can tell you if they give better AI to dark fog we are dead

and like you say dark fog are only here to be farmed

also you need them to ulock last level technology and you cant retroengineer their technology, you are stuck with them