New towers opinion

[Protoz]

SR tower - Decent, but not good enough to be squeezed into pure laser tower defense which is stil the king mid-ultra late game. I can see a use for it to make a separate power grid in order to raise thermal power plants's load to burn off excess hydrogen, due to SR's tower high idle power consumption.

Jammer tower - Crazy expensive ammo, I feel it needs 100 additional range, and the amount of enemies each ammo can affect should be in the several hundreds and not 60.

My thoughts on these two new towers, welcome addition but not balanced. The new towers need tweaking and or lasers needs nerfs & enemies need buffs. These are my thoughts while on 3000% metadata.

[cainboy]

I've struggled to get lasers to work for me, I usually enjoyed using implosion cannons and Missile Turrets...
I'm excited for the SR tower.... and i was a little underwhelmed with the jammer. however once I saw the upgrade affects like 3 stats for the jammers, I think it will be usuable in the ultra late game. unless of course i've completely misunderstood how they work lol.

Also on a 3000% metadata run* but i'm still midgame ish. JUST getting into green science and going interstellar.
Gauss Turrets still feel pretty pointless. So I def agree balance will be needed before a 1.0 launch.

Do the Jammer towers only hit 1 enemy each attack? and the ammo has 60 (+prol)? or does each ammo shoot once and affect 60 enemies? I assumed its the former, but the latter would def sound too expensive.

[mike]

Jammer tower - range is way too short. HP is way too small for the short range. I can't fit them into my walls of guns.
SR Plasma Turret - range is way too short. HP is way too small for the short range. I can't fit them into my walls of guns. The damage is great, really great. But, A level 22 fog station ships seem to max at 185 HP. The gun does more than double this with early upgrades.

I have a wall of cannons/cannons/lasers/guns with 30 missile launchers and missile towers. The level 22 fog takes out a row of canons. I replaced it with a row of the new Short Range Plasma Turrets and a full box of ammo on mk3 belts on a loop. Fog took out the new turrets like a hot knife in butter and then the cannons. Somehow the lasers and machine guns seem to stop them sorta better, especially given the lower cost.

BTW, the text says the new SR Turret uses "Energy Capsule" but the name of the ammo is "Plasma Capsule".

IMHO, all of the towers need more/better hit point and range upgrades. (Or increase some HP and some range, like maybe cannons get more HP and lasers get more range?)
Maybe each level of fog drop can increase range and/or hit points 5-10%?

How are you doing 3000%? I'm on 651% and having issues.
Mainly - lack of titanium and copper. Ammo uses copper and yellow needs titanium. I didn't get to another planet quick enough and it got overrun and I can't get it back, so I'm still just on the one planet living off of fog drops.

[cainboy]

Originally posted by mike:

How are you doing 3000%? I'm on 651% and having issues.
Mainly - lack of titanium and copper. Ammo uses copper and yellow needs titanium. I didn't get to another planet quick enough and it got overrun and I can't get it back, so I'm still just on the one planet living off of fog drops.

I have an entire discussion about my adventures through 3000% in general... i think it was 3000% suggestions* or something to that effect.
The initial survival is what's rough... and then making sure to secure a 2nd planet before copper runs out, and then where I am; securing interstellar before silicon/stone runs out.
I also had a far rougher time than some other folks because even though I only started with 3 bases at lvl 10 on the starter world, within the first hour I had to deal with 6 bases. which imo is BS.

I've not touched either new tower YET* i'm too concerned with making sure I can secure silicon since i've got maybe 3000 in the entire system, and my stone is under 100k iirc.
I hadnt contemplated their fragility, mostly because I use signal towers to absorb the brunt of dmg.... but the effects seem lackluster to start... and godly with infinite research.

I'm near excited to try out SR turrets, but if they are doing that much dmg, then i'd imagine any situation where the DF dont have insane health* (forgot if this is in the sliders too) would be silly.
I'm also one of the few that have a hard time loving laser turrets :/ and i dont like gauss turrets beyond the beginning of the game.

For Turret offence, Missile Towers with Signal tower range booster is just too strong. Range is a killing factor for a line, if Gauss turrets had 50% more range, they could easily take down a lot more since more can fire at once. *(imo; a BAB should give a range boost to projectiles)
For Turret Defence, I'm impartial to Implosion cannons. AOE cant be mimicked, and their knockback power helps defend your lines. if they are focusing ground first, the slower units cant even reach your line.
For space: i want to use plasma... but missiles + shield just works. :/

After I secure my 2nd star system and have enough silicon to flush out pre white tech, I'll test out the SR turret and jammer... till then i need to be cautious with resource spending.

[mike]

thanks for the followup

[sANDY]

since i've already designed a polar fort to farm 21 df bases (3000%) with only laser turrets and 0 destroyed buildings in 10 hrs, i don't know what's the point of anything but laser turrets to farm and plasma turrets for space defense.
researched only few infinite techs to increase energy weapon damage and durability of buildings, so it is close enough to early end-game.
so I think it's just for fun, idk...

[Blaarg]

I like the idea of the SR tower. It gives farms some aoe bite, while still not consuming much in the way of resources other than power. The footprint also fits well into a bunch of laser towers. Given when these show up & the power requirements, these towers might be a bit of a luxury option.

When I first put down a jammer tower, I was hoping it would shoot at a target in its 40m range & then the 40m aoe would go from the shot target. Sadly, this is not the case. These might have some early game defensive line uses, but I can't see myself using these unless the ammo gets cheaper or they get better range.

That said, throwing the jammer ammo is fantastic.

[Protoz]

Originally posted by cainboy:

Gauss Turrets still feel pretty pointless. So I def agree balance will be needed before a 1.0 launch.

Gauss received a huge upgrade, 100% more ammo, 4->3 cost and 20->30 bullets. Before each copper was essentially 5 shots and now each copper is now 10 shots. But its still completely useless even with this change outside of early game.