How do I deal with Modern Zangief?

[lemstryz]

Tekken Refugee here. I'm currently learning the game and I struggling against modern Zangief online. I encountered so many that I looked up videos on counter play but I can't do anything still. I try to backdash his throws, I still get caught, I try to forward jump his throws and I'm immediately anti aired. This matchup is so hard

[Chewie]

Depends who you play. If you have fireballs, keep him out. Giefs usually get pretty frustrated when you can keep them out and they'll begin to make mistakes.

..... and respect the command grab range

[Revenant]

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Tekken Refugee here. I'm currently learning the game and I struggling against modern Zangief online. I encountered so many that I looked up videos on counter play but I can't do anything still. I try to backdash his throws, I still get caught, I try to forward jump his throws and I'm immediately anti aired. This matchup is so hard

depends on who you play 100%..... usually fireballs or crouch med kick drive rush works pretty welll same with DI..... also stand very far from him as 1 button spds are REALLY strong without motions.

[lemstryz]

Originally posted by Revenant:

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Tekken Refugee here. I'm currently learning the game and I struggling against modern Zangief online. I encountered so many that I looked up videos on counter play but I can't do anything still. I try to backdash his throws, I still get caught, I try to forward jump his throws and I'm immediately anti aired. This matchup is so hard

depends on who you play 100%..... usually fireballs or crouch med kick drive rush works pretty welll same with DI..... also stand very far from him as 1 button spds are REALLY strong without motions.

Thanks for the advice guys. I see now. It's best for me to zone. That was my issue, I was trying to play aggressive and get in this face a lot. Do I do the same thing for Manon as well?

[Revenant]

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Originally posted by Revenant:

depends on who you play 100%..... usually fireballs or crouch med kick drive rush works pretty welll same with DI..... also stand very far from him as 1 button spds are REALLY strong without motions.

Thanks for the advice guys. I see now. It's best for me to zone. That was my issue, I was trying to play aggressive and get in this face a lot. Do I do the same thing for Manon as well?

If your manon........ thats gonna be hard..... she doesn't really have zoning stuff...... or crouching medium kick drive rush. Your playing grappler vs grappler........ if your on classic controls your gonna struggle until you just play faster.

[lemstryz]

Originally posted by Revenant:

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Thanks for the advice guys. I see now. It's best for me to zone. That was my issue, I was trying to play aggressive and get in this face a lot. Do I do the same thing for Manon as well?

If your manon........ thats gonna be hard..... she doesn't really have zoning stuff...... or crouching medium kick drive rush. Your playing grappler vs grappler........ if your on classic controls your gonna struggle until you just play faster.

Noo I meant is it the same strategy when fighting against Manon as well because shes a grappler? I play Mai.

[kuaikukia]

Manon main here. I try to help with some basic vs Manon tips. If you ever play against Manon player,
1st tip is to avoid burnout as much as possible. Manon excel on dealing pressure when someone in burnout.

2nd tip is if you scare on her command throw, you can jab off to avoid mostly of her command throw. Her command grab active frame aren't absurd like Command grab Zangief or Lily. But this is not guarantee because she can mix with her poke as well to frame trap punish you or even mixing with drive rush frame plus so that's comes to 3rd tip

3rd tip is don't lazy to press jump or backdash. Every her command throw can be easily avoid through jumping and backdash. If you see Manon likes to command grab a lot, just jump a lot or backdash. Still also not guarantee because good Manon player always adapt and prepare counter against player who did too many jumping and backdash as well

Hope it useful. Good luck

[Danny DeVito with a Gun]

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Originally posted by Revenant:

depends on who you play 100%..... usually fireballs or crouch med kick drive rush works pretty welll same with DI..... also stand very far from him as 1 button spds are REALLY strong without motions.

Thanks for the advice guys. I see now. It's best for me to zone. That was my issue, I was trying to play aggressive and get in this face a lot. Do I do the same thing for Manon as well?

So that advice isn’t wrong at your level but I should warn you that strong Giefs aren’t gonna care about zoners. Gief has deceptively strong tools for dealing with fireballs and long pokes. He’s one of the best in the game at dealing with fireball zoning. Something to keep in mind as you keep playing

Modern Gief gets 1-button SPDs in exchange for losing some great buttons. He’s way worse in neutral. He actually gets bullied harder up-close since his SPD has no invincibility. If you’re gonna move in, I’d recommend looking into strings that won’t leave a big enough gap for him to use SPD between. It’s not as hard as it sounds but Mai can’t rely on her fan bounce mix against Gief like she can other characters

Some of this strategy still applies with Manon. Her command grab is slower than Gief’s so it’s harder for her to surprise you with it. Her anti-fireball moves are significantly worse than Gief’s. She has really long buttons you have to watch for but she also has pretty weak pressure without DR

[Inn3r-Demon221]

As a casual Ryu player this is how I fight a Modern Gief. 1st round I feel and watch to see if he has a flow chart. I usually stay far away enough to give me time to punish. usually they like to jump or use Cyclone Wheel Kick to get in. Usually if they Cyclone Wheel Kick I block it

reset my distance and wait for the next one if they do it again I punish DI it combo and stay away. Now i have life lead now they have to come to me. you have to lame them out. Cyclone Wheel Kick is just a example it can be a jump or Siberian Express.

they Jump just use any AA you have. Siberian Express you can see it a mile away just jump punish it and get away. its when Gief get life lead that going to make your life a living hell.

usually once you get life lead they start getting panicking to get in. usually abuse those 3 moves mixed with DI to try to hit you. so they can do there 1-2 button combo or SPD

If they are a good modern they have all the answers to punish you if you try to get in. Air SPD, Double Lariat, Level 1 super and level 3 super. I just don't even bother fighting them. I just get life lead and let them try to kill them self's. because as soon as you try to do a set up or punish you are going to get SPD or level 3 super done on you. 90% of them play the same.

but there are some good ones who use his tools very well and are a nightmare to fight

[The Main Character]

One and done, and block him.
Like all “Modern” players.

[Agoraphobic Meep]

-The big thing is that you can afford to play a much more aggressive neutral game against modern gief, 5MK is one of his most reliable pokes and is super helpful in a lot of matchups, same with 2MK. Without them gief has to rely a lot more on 5HP, which is insanely vulnerable to DI, and 5MP, which is strong but doesn't have quite the same range as his other pokes, and his also risky to use against DI.

-Learn what buttons you have that are safe to use and don't you leave -5 or worse, that's the threshold for what is SPD punishable. Ending blockstrings with something that's like -7 is asking to get grabbed. If you learn this properly, you can press your offense very easily against a very defensively lacking character.

-If a gief is constantly catching your backdashes and jumps, you're being predictable with your defense. Be unpredictable. Pay attention to when specifically in their pressure they like to grab you. Is it on wake-up the second you get up, or is it after specific moves during blockstrings? It doesn't hurt to DP after blocking a gief's meaty every once in a while to make them think twice about going for tick throws either. Good gief's mix it up often, but it's still good to pay attention to their habits, because they do have them, especially at lower levels, and you don't want to let a gief scoop you for free the whole set.

-Gief is weak to cross-ups, even modern gief. Gief has to actively be looking out for it and react with an air to air or a crosscut lariat, both of which are actually somewhat difficult for gief. They can get a pretty decent reward if they do read your cross-up attempt though so don't abuse this, but it is helpful for applying your pressure at close range.

[Revenant]

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Originally posted by Revenant:

If your manon........ thats gonna be hard..... she doesn't really have zoning stuff...... or crouching medium kick drive rush. Your playing grappler vs grappler........ if your on classic controls your gonna struggle until you just play faster.

Noo I meant is it the same strategy when fighting against Manon as well because shes a grappler? I play Mai.

Since your playing mai she has like one of the best fireball pressures in the game lmao....

Bouncy fan -> drive rush -> throw / jumping hk i think? maybe its punch its one of those 2/ crouching medium kick .... make sure you time it properly so that you actually hit instead of hitting them to constantly triggering a whiff.

Ex fan -> drive rush -> same thing..........

Randomly can raw drive rush -> crouching hp -> crouching medium -> qcb mp or ex ..... make sure they are standing though or this will miss... if they are crouching -> lvl 1.

These big clunky characters do have problems guarding low attacks from atleast diamond and lower...... potentially even low masters too, Even snake-eyez zangief loses to crouching medium kick drive rush.

Either way, you still have to be a little careful with fireballs at medium-close range because of zangiefs level 2 which basically eats fireballs and then kills you. On akuma, i've only seen 1 zangief actually lvl 2 me and im diamond 2 on akuma.

But because of the modern controls...... this actually breaks and who knows when they actually will start doing this.

[lemstryz]

Originally posted by kuaikukia:

Manon main here. I try to help with some basic vs Manon tips. If you ever play against Manon player,
1st tip is to avoid burnout as much as possible. Manon excel on dealing pressure when someone in burnout.

2nd tip is if you scare on her command throw, you can jab off to avoid mostly of her command throw. Her command grab active frame aren't absurd like Command grab Zangief or Lily. But this is not guarantee because she can mix with her poke as well to frame trap punish you or even mixing with drive rush frame plus so that's comes to 3rd tip

3rd tip is don't lazy to press jump or backdash. Every her command throw can be easily avoid through jumping and backdash. If you see Manon likes to command grab a lot, just jump a lot or backdash. Still also not guarantee because good Manon player always adapt and prepare counter against player who did too many jumping and backdash as well

Hope it useful. Good luck

Thanks man I just tried it out by taking control over my character in replays and you were right. Jabbing pretty much beat every scenario where I got grabbed. And jumping and backdashing works too just like Zangief.

[Wormerine]

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Thanks man I just tried it out by taking control over my character in replays and you were right. Jabbing pretty much beat every scenario where I got grabbed. And jumping and backdashing works too just like Zangief.

Yeah, getting a hang of frame data is key here. In general I like to switch between zoning aggression against against Gief.

My biggest struggle is that his model seems to me larger than his hitbox, and I have a bad tendency to wiff pokes and get exploded in return. That is especially true of his drive rush.

[kuaikukia]

Originally posted by lemstryz:

Thanks man I just tried it out by taking control over my character in replays and you were right. Jabbing pretty much beat every scenario where I got grabbed. And jumping and backdashing works too just like Zangief.

You welcome. Glad it helps

[Pikachu]

One-and-done and block-em-all is what works with "modern".