They gave Zangief high SPD damage because he's terrible

[SeeNoWeevil]

Almost everything about Gief is bad.

Slow, non-cancellable buttons prone to getting blown up by DI
Punishing people jumping is high risk, low damage or costs lots of meter
He burns meter like crazy
Lariat hit box doesn't hit cross up (WTH)
His overhead is slow and minus 1 week on block
Tundra Storm is a meme (again)
Close running bear grab has no armour
Far running bear grab is slow, telegraphed and mostly useless
Both level 1 and 2 supers are terrible
No invincible reversal
No corner carry
He gets mauled in the corner
Absolutely no oki whatsoever, all his DR oki is fake
He has the worst matchups in the game (JP, Guile, Sim)
Bad walk speed
Big hitbox

[X]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Teddy Roosevelt:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από X:

Capcom hates Gief. Clearly this gane was perfectly made for greenhand and yet here we are, working twice as hard as the rest of the cast.

Dont need greenhand anymore. Zangief main for 6+ years here. Just parry until your close and then punish. once your close enough to jump in your still just far enough away to not be punished for parrying too much. then just try and make reads once your in.

It's not that simple. Flex was in 5 can you just walk foward and flex your way to W's? I have yet to see any high level Gief parrying thier way to victory either. Is it a tool to use, of course. But it is not some magical big brain strat that's going to work consistantly unless your playing lower skilled opponents.
I didn't say he needed greenhand perse, just that this game was the perfect fit for it. I would take 50% reduction in all SPDs for some tools so he could play the same game as everyone else instead of the hard read big damage struggle bus hes riding now.

[weirdkid5]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Observer:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Swampbunches:

I literally have no idea what you're talking about. Dhalsim and Gief (my opinion here, please don't get mad) are both very difficult to play characters. I mean the game lists them as difficult as well. I don't know of anyone that would call Dhalsim easy to play.

Anyway, you seem pretty confident, feel free to hit me up online, my name on CFN is Costco_Hot_Dog. Lets see what you can do.

you prove my point you think "I am skilled" not because dhal is a cheese character above Zangief on any tier list.
And who wants to play against a cheese character, do I have nothing to do. lol Whats wrong with people nowadays

Lets play a game against each other in which I put more hours in

Cheese character?

Just jump bro.

Plus on wakeup Gief literally can't do anything. Not our fault your blockstrings aren't true blockstrings.

[Teddy Roosevelt]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από X:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Teddy Roosevelt:

Dont need greenhand anymore. Zangief main for 6+ years here. Just parry until your close and then punish. once your close enough to jump in your still just far enough away to not be punished for parrying too much. then just try and make reads once your in.

It's not that simple. Flex was in 5 can you just walk foward and flex your way to W's? I have yet to see any high level Gief parrying thier way to victory either. Is it a tool to use, of course. But it is not some magical big brain strat that's going to work consistantly unless your playing lower skilled opponents.
I didn't say he needed greenhand perse, just that this game was the perfect fit for it. I would take 50% reduction in all SPDs for some tools so he could play the same game as everyone else instead of the hard read big damage struggle bus hes riding now.

works for me into diamond. which i think is like top 5-10 percent?

[X]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Teddy Roosevelt:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από X:

It's not that simple. Flex was in 5 can you just walk foward and flex your way to W's? I have yet to see any high level Gief parrying thier way to victory either. Is it a tool to use, of course. But it is not some magical big brain strat that's going to work consistantly unless your playing lower skilled opponents.
I didn't say he needed greenhand perse, just that this game was the perfect fit for it. I would take 50% reduction in all SPDs for some tools so he could play the same game as everyone else instead of the hard read big damage struggle bus hes riding now.

works for me into diamond. which i think is like top 5-10 percent?

Really? You hear that everyone? Teds got the answer, pack it up.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Teddy Roosevelt:

The game gives you hidden ELO. i havent played rank yet cause i dont feel ready but the game ONLY puts me against plats and diamonds in casual so it must think im good.

So whats this all about?

[SeeNoWeevil]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Swampbunches:

but people doing well with him would say otherwise

He's one of the most popular characters and yet has the lowest number of players in Master rank. He's fun early on but from Diamond rank he becomes a huge up-hill battle and every other character feels like they have so much sauce in comparison. The fact he gets basically zero oki just starts to feel ridiculous.

[Teddy Roosevelt]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από X:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Teddy Roosevelt:

works for me into diamond. which i think is like top 5-10 percent?

Really? You hear that everyone? Teds got the answer, pack it up.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Teddy Roosevelt:

The game gives you hidden ELO. i havent played rank yet cause i dont feel ready but the game ONLY puts me against plats and diamonds in casual so it must think im good.

So whats this all about?

the information pans out. THe game places me against diamonds so clearly i am that good based on hidden elo. Therefor the skill i was using works at least to that point right? Whats confusing to you?>

[Schizm]

This is modern grappler design, which is basically remove all agency from the character and make damn near every tool they have extremely niche or down right useless, make sure they don't get oki, they can't play neutral very well, and ensure their defense is worst in class.

But then give them the haha funny damage and call it a day. This is how Potemkin is in strive and its probably how devs are just going to handle grapplers from now on.

Make sure you can't play the fighting game but if the other player ♥♥♥♥♥ up they lose 50-80% of there HP. Its a miserable experience for all involved.

[Schizm]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από PK²:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από SeeNoWeevil:

Almost everything about Gief is bad.

Slow, non-cancellable buttons prone to getting blown up by DI
Punishing people jumping is high risk, low damage or costs lots of meter
He burns meter like crazy
Lariat hit box doesn't hit cross up (WTH)
His overhead is slow and minus 1 week on block
Tundra Storm is a meme (again)
Close running bear grab has no armour
Far running bear grab is slow, telegraphed and mostly useless
Both level 1 and 2 supers are terrible
No invincible reversal
No corner carry
He gets mauled in the corner
Absolutely no oki whatsoever, all his DR oki is fake
He has the worst matchups in the game (JP, Guile, Sim)
Bad walk speed
Big hitbox

lmao capcom never wants grapplers to be good

Manon, R Mika, and Laura.

No they want gief to fit this weird niche that doesn't function very well with how both SFV and SF6 are played.

His design needs to shift but they don't want to do that.

[Tourette's Guy]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από KungFuAndrewTV:

Look up any recent video involving SnakeEyez for ideas on how to properly play Gief.

He's on another level. The only player that comes close is Itazan.

It's extremely difficult to reach that gameplay level with Zangief.

[Schizm]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από SeeNoWeevil:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Swampbunches:

but people doing well with him would say otherwise

He's one of the most popular characters and yet has the lowest number of players in Master rank. He's fun early on but from Diamond rank he becomes a huge up-hill battle and every other character feels like they have so much sauce in comparison. The fact he gets basically zero oki just starts to feel ridiculous.

Hes c.lp and light spd the character.

He basically thrives on other people making mistakes and has very little options to actually force a win condition. Even when he is in his "win condition" because there is no oki its just back to losing more.

You either let grapplers play neutral so they dont eat ♥♥♥♥ 99% of the time or you give them oki once they finally do get in so they are properly rewarded. The problem is big body grapplers entire archetype has been flandarized into haha funny damage numbers and you can see a bunch of people think this is just how they always worked and its not.

Big damage is not a substitute for an active game plan and it just makes playing the character against anyone who knows what they are doing MISERABLE.

[Schizm]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Tourette's Guy:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από KungFuAndrewTV:

Look up any recent video involving SnakeEyez for ideas on how to properly play Gief.

He's on another level. The only player that comes close is Itazan.

It's extremely difficult to reach that gameplay level with Zangief.

I don't think people get snake eyes isn't doing something magical with gief, snake eyes just has the reaction times and game sense of a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ god. He would probably be more successful on manon or any other character if he put in the time. He just likes gief.

[wizard master結城晶子リ]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από SeeNoWeevil:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Motoko * * *:

He's supposed to be hard to use.

Yes, he's hard to use because he's terrible and lacking tools they gave to most of the cast.

hugo was slow also but he wasent bad if u know how to use him zangi has always been like that abigale was also slow but very tough to deal with someone who knows how to use them there grab characters diffrent fighting style slwo but lots of damage not every one nhas to be like ken or ryu if u dont like the character then use some one else simple cause zangi is far from trash

[Schizm]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από wizard master結城晶子リ:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από SeeNoWeevil:

Yes, he's hard to use because he's terrible and lacking tools they gave to most of the cast.

hugo was slow also but he wasent bad if u know how to use him zangi has always been like that abigale was also slow but very tough to deal with someone who knows how to use them there grab characters diffrent fighting style slwo but lots of damage not every one nhas to be like ken or ryu if u dont like the character then use some one else simple cause zangi is far from trash

No gief has not always been like that lol... This is the problem with newer players or people just do not pay attention. Gief typically has tools to let him have an active game plan.

In SF2 he was left close enough after SPD to threaten space and even get oki if you were in the corner.

Hugo in SF3 had pretty good buttons, anti air options, and pressure tools.

In SF4 once he got in he stayed in because suplex gave high low grab vortex.

It wasn't until half way into SFV life when capcom started to shift big bodies into the identity of a struggler we see now.

[jahlis]

isn't high SPD damage like THE feature of Gief since forever?
I enjoy playing against Giefs, 'cause they need to be smart. A good Gief will walk you into the corner and you're done. His crossup thing, the belly flop thing, easily traps you since his body is so big. One player killed me just with those today.
He has weaknesses, glaring ones, but those don't mean he's unplayable. those just mean you can't do a random yolo overhead and expect it to work.
Manon, btw, for all her strengths, is super minus on 99% of her normals as well, and if she didn't have the medals, she'd be close bottom tier too, imo.
Grapplers have to risk and/or play smart to condition the opponent. I can't play like that, so I don't pick em, but I respect those who can do it well. A good Gief player in 6 is scary.

[Call Sign: Raven]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από SeeNoWeevil:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από KungFuAndrewTV:

Look up any recent video involving SnakeEyez for ideas on how to properly play Gief.

I'm diamond 2, I know how to play him.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Orzeker:

Glad to see there's the usual "give him greenhand" comment to improve him.

I odn't think he needs green hand.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Dank Sidious:

he does manage to capitalize on that mistake, but that's the point of the character

Except he has to take big risks to be able to capitalise once in. That's my point. Grapplers need to first condition players to not jump, how are you going to condition someone if most of your normals are prone to drive impact? What is a Gief player going to do if you start jumping away? Jump air-SPD and risk eating a full combo if they don't jump? Air grab super and risk eating a full combo as you need to stop blocking to buffer it? That's assuming it doesn't whiff. His risk reward ratio is bad. Making yolo hard reads might work in Gold.

Congrats on Diamond 2, but I can guarantee that you're nowhere near this level:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEijXlPEfqY&ab_channel=STREETFIGHTERReplays

I've been saying this for decades: The character is only as good as the player controlling it.