"tick throws" in this game are basically unbeatable

[ShadowSasuke2009]

Title kind of says everything but tick throws in this game are basically unbeatable. If your opponent gets a good enough knockdown and gets up close they can grab you, or jab and then tick throw, or do multiple jabs and then tick throw, or do a kick and then throw, or a kick and a jab and then throw, or basically just anything sets up a tick throw. It isn't even a 50/50 on if you will get grabbed, you just have to pray because of how many options the opponent has. In guilty gear strive the options for tick throws are pretty limited and a lot of the time you need to dash up so it is easier to react to so it is a lot better and not a problem. The saving grace in this game is that it is hard to get into a position where you are close enough to force the opponent to have to guess between all these things but it is still makes the game unplayable competitively because everyone is scared to approach and just spams projectiles and then if they mess up and they get stuck having to guess when they will get grabbed they lose. Just isnt fun for either side at this point the only way i can play the game is with friends where we dont use grabs/projectiles which makes the game actually play like a fighting game should play.

[pruitcake]

Almost thought this was a serious post til that last line lmao. Just tech the throw numbnuts

[BlueFunGuy]

Delay Tek

[Lunar Shower]

First time with a Street Fighter game, I take it? Also, what character are you playing that you both struggle with projectiles, AND struggle with tick throws this much? Maybe just break the throw, or jab out of it instead of eating all that pressure?

[Mememancer]

OP snaps finger.

Geif: "ого! Mr. Masters-- I dyon't feel soh gude."

[Shilly Clive]

Originally posted by BlueFunGuy:

Delay Tek

There is a built-in practice setup for this in the training mode, btw.

[ShadowSasuke2009]

Originally posted by Lunar Shower:

First time with a Street Fighter game, I take it? Also, what character are you playing that you both struggle with projectiles, AND struggle with tick throws this much? Maybe just break the throw, or jab out of it instead of eating all that pressure?

clearly you cant read. i said that if you want to win either you spam projectiles OR you try to get in to auto win with tick throw pressure (even though a lot of the projectile spam characters can also do a ton of thhings to make you guess if they are going to throw if they do get in close). thats why this game needs to be patched as soon as possible because having to choose between projectile spam or running at your opponent hoping to get the auto win by hitting them once isnt fun for either player or good competitively

[Rook]

ok

[nofaceuzu]

Don’t expect anybody here to actually look at this and go “maybe this is an actual issue within the game i kinda agree”. They won’t actually try to help you either, they just tell new players “get good and practice for hours everyday you’ll get use to it, ” or “ok and just tech???”. the majority of FGC don’t realize that no game is perfect and will have flaws that aren’t apparent until online play highlights them. These flaws should be fixed and we shouldn’t just get “used to them”.

Not everyone has 10 hours a day of free time to practice either, people have lives that don’t revolve around their ranking in a video game and want to be able to hop into a game for fun without getting cheesed to frustration. And you FG players wonder why these games be dying quick and why new players are scared to even try this genre or to ask for help.

Capcom could help by just putting an indicator that the other person is right about to throw (mysterious mod in V fixed this exact issue by having a subtle and quick glowing effect around the player who is throwing). When you don’t have an indicator, the average player is just guessing which leads to the bad throwing and mashing habits we see players adopt. Fighterz had this same exact solution, making the throws actually tech-able while still making it satisfying and not too easy to pull off. To any disagreeing, If you think a simple glowing effect is too helpful or ruins the integrity in the game than you should be having more issue with modern controls or drive rush being an all-in-one ridiculously cheap and no risk rush down mix up oki tool. Might as well be part of the V-System because some characters just have better drive rushes than others, which makes no sense for a “universal” mechanic.

[Samvega]

Originally posted by nofaceuzu:

argument against throw/strike mixups and the mindgames that result

I'm literally an incompetent noob, but even I know that SF is rock / paper / scissors, on multiple levels. Perhaps the simplest is (and I might phrase this wrong):

Blocking resists strikes, throws beat blocking, strikes (depending on startup frame data or spacing) beat throws.

You think they're gonna throw? Delayed throw tech (https://youtu.be/g8LYoF0S-Lo), it covers both meaty AND throw options.
They think you're gonna delay throw tech? They shimmy.
You think they're gonna shimmy? You combo them.
They want to bait out your string? They shimmy but then block or parry, hoping you end your string unsafe.
You know they're baiting out your string? You fake them out, e.g. by going into throw.

SF is about mindgames like this, that's what makes it amazing.

Also... why necro a thread after more than two months?

[Samvega]

Originally posted by nofaceuzu:

some characters just have better drive rushes than others, which makes no sense for a “universal” mechanic.

Some characters have better walk speeds.
Some characters have better normals (frame data and/or range).
Some characters have better lvl 1s, 2s and/or 3s.
Some characters have better oki.
Some characters have better (or more) throws.
Some characters have better costumes.

Diversity is, in general, a good thing to have - as long as there is balance. I wouldn't be against balancing some characters, but adding glows to throws or universalising all DRs is something I'd resist. If you don't want diversity between characters, there are some games with only one character (I believe these games each only have one character from screenshots, I might be wrong):

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1344740/FOOTSIES_Rollback_Edition/

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2366850/DAIR/

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1715850/NAIR/

[nofaceuzu]

Originally posted by Samvega:

Also... why necro a thread after more than two months?

I was looking for help for this issue as well but no one seems to want to help in good spirit (besides you). I disagree with some of your points, but overall you have a reasonable argument and honestly those games look cool but i personally don’t want to play place holder characters when SF characters exist (thanks for the rec man tho this might help others). Also Thanks for coming in this thread and giving advice, people need it for sure. Just wish the FGC was a bit more understanding to people who didn’t grow up with games like this.

[C1REX]

You need "delayed tech" to beat throws or neutral jump against command grabs.
YT is full of tutorials.

[Samvega]

Originally posted by C1REX-PL:

You need "delayed tech" to beat throws or neutral jump against command grabs.
YT is full of tutorials.

I gave a link to a delayed throw tech video, so it's all good.

[Ahriman]

Originally posted by SlopMaker2009:

Just isnt fun for either side at this point the only way i can play the game is with friends where we dont use grabs/projectiles which makes the game actually play like a fighting game should play.

So... you just stand there and parry for the entire game?

[Nichole24]

Nearly every light in this game is negative on block, just push your own 4f button and you'll beat both throws and jab blockstrings