Veteran is most versatile at possible valuable builds In Havok

[Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am]

Funny to read hymns to zealot OPness, while he literally comes to 2 builds for havok that can be consistently used. Book benediction relic blade crit and book beacon dueling sword crit.

Though ogryn has 1,5 working builds, shield-taunt-feel_no_pain and shield-rush-feel_no_pain

Psyker has really 1 working build, bubble cooldown warp syphon smite with slight difference in used staves.

I mean working - somthing that helps team to complete game and not burdens teammates to cover their arses all the time.

While veteran can literally play 2 keystones, 3 different grenades, 4 different playstyle ranged weapons, 3 major groups of melee (power sword, dueling sword or something else for easy self defence), mix everything as he want, and everything will work. Yeah, ultimate always same, voice, but this wasnt an issue before havok aswell.

[Poison]

So veteran has one working build with a variation of keystones, similar to almost any other class?

[Zsrai]

Zealot can also run just about any weapons they want, as long as they follow the build outline. More or less just like Vets can. Psyker are more limited with ranged options but most melee should work, while Ogryn are probably the most limited in those choices.

Also who is taking Kraks or Smokes to high Havocs? You don't get enough Kraks to manage the elites and smokes are smokes.

[Siphon2012]

Nah, Zealot seems like the only versatile one. I have played all three talents and they seem to work more than Vet.

[Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am]

Originally posted by Poison:

So veteran has one working build with a variation of keystones, similar to almost any other class?

Other classes have no variation even for keystones.

[Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am]

Originally posted by Zsrai:

Zealot can also run just about any weapons they want, as long as they follow the build outline. More or less just like Vets can. Psyker are more limited with ranged options but most melee should work, while Ogryn are probably the most limited in those choices.

Also who is taking Kraks or Smokes to high Havocs? You don't get enough Kraks to manage the elites and smokes are smokes.

On zealot only spoken melee "work" others are just worse.
Psyker's melee always placeholder. Range are limited to 2 - trauma and inferno.
And ogryn yes, he has shield, and everything else just very bad.

[Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am]

Originally posted by Siphon2012:

Nah, Zealot seems like the only versatile one. I have played all three talents and they seem to work more than Vet.

on havok "work" only toughest crit build with all damage reduction and ultimate generation for purpose of cast book in all needed situatioons. Everything else just thin paper, no matter if you played, it's bad for this mode.

[Ravs]

Zealot can use Revolvers, Bolter and Bolt pistol too, same as Veteran. Also flamer.
Zealot can run Crusher weapon, 2h, knife, duelling swords. So definitely about the same number of melee options as Vet.
Psykers use knife, duelling swords, force swords, 2h.
Teams with multiple Psykers often bring soul blaze purge build, as there's no reason to use more than 1 bubble shield in a premade of skilled players.

Never seen a good Vet player using smokes in Havoc (even in normal games, but let's not get there). My vet is lvl 700 and I play Havoc 40 all the time as Vet, Kraks and Smokes are waaaaay behind frag grenades in power for Havoc. People need to stop hyping up this trash blitz for real, so Fatshark can finally rework it or give it a major buff. Smokes only sound good in fairy tales from people on forums. Kraks are also only consistent on bosses, stunning all 10 Crushers and Bulwarks with one frag is WAAAAY better than killing only a couple of them with kraks (that is, if your teammates won't do it earlier, so you've wasted a nade).

I think all human classes are about the same. Vet has only one viable aura, but two keystones. Zealot can work with two auras, but only 1 keystone. Every Psyker staff is viable (with Surge being the weakest because of 2-target restriction), every Psyker aura is useful, brainburst and smite are both useful, but assail is too weak considering the amount of elites. Gunpsyker is basically unusable since they're a total ammo pit, even worse than Gunluggers.

Ogryn is the least flexible, he's extremely dependent on teammates. The worse your teammates are, the weaker Ogryn feels, because you get absolutely shredded by the shooters if your team doesn't use their cooldowns correctly.

[Zsrai]

Originally posted by Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am:

Originally posted by Poison:

So veteran has one working build with a variation of keystones, similar to almost any other class?

Other classes have no variation even for keystones.

Nah, even the Ogryn has some variation in keystones; left and center are both usable in high Havocs.

Originally posted by Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am:

Originally posted by Zsrai:

Zealot can also run just about any weapons they want, as long as they follow the build outline. More or less just like Vets can. Psyker are more limited with ranged options but most melee should work, while Ogryn are probably the most limited in those choices.

Also who is taking Kraks or Smokes to high Havocs? You don't get enough Kraks to manage the elites and smokes are smokes.

On zealot only spoken melee "work" others are just worse.
Psyker's melee always placeholder. Range are limited to 2 - trauma and inferno.
And ogryn yes, he has shield, and everything else just very bad.

So? We all know that everything is worse than the Dueling Sword, that doesn't mean you can't run other weapons and still do well. Other weapons being "A Tier" vs DS's "S Tier" doesn't mean the former are all ♥♥♥♥.

Originally posted by Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am:

Originally posted by Siphon2012:

Nah, Zealot seems like the only versatile one. I have played all three talents and they seem to work more than Vet.

on havok "work" only toughest crit build with all damage reduction and ultimate generation for purpose of cast book in all needed situatioons. Everything else just thin paper, no matter if you played, it's bad for this mode.

You can certainly use FotF on Zealot and do fine, but probably only as the 2nd Zealot (the first has Chorus, obviously).

People are running 4 Ogryn Havoc 40's, the limits are more player skill based than hard meta requirements.