Is shotgun bad?

[Garviel Loken]

I have multiple really OP builds so I feel like I know how to put a really good one together but for some reason I can do well enough with any gun that is not a shotgun.

Any suggestions or is the shotgun just a bad gun that is too hard to make work?

[Samurai]

Originally posted by Garviel Loken:

I have multiple really OP builds so I feel like I know how to put a really good one together but for some reason I can do well enough with any gun that is not a shotgun.

Any suggestions or is the shotgun just a bad gun that is too hard to make work?

double barrel is pretty nuts with vet

[unless specifically stated]

Short answer: yes;

Long answer: very class and build dependant.

DB shotgun is great for one particular build: Manstopper + Flechette on a Weapon Specialist veteran. You can get 100% crit after a weapon swap and quickly do two crits with insane cleave + 12 bleed stacks. Don't use braced fire. For Zealot it's pretty bad, because it's basically a worse second melee weapon.

Slug shotgun (Agri) is OK on the veteran since you can one-shot most specials with a body shot and elites with a headshot with the Slug. In addition, Slug shot also has very high stagger (can stagger Crushers out of their animations with a headshot and open up Bulwark shields) and has great synergy with Full Bore/No Respite blessings. Bad on Zealot because you don't have enough damage without crits.

Dragon Breath (Katael) is OK on the veteran as well (but worse than Agri IMO), but works much better on a crit Zealot builds. Scattershot + Flechette + special ammo spam can delete horders and heavily damage any elites and specials hit, in addition special ammo has insane supression for some reason and just shooting in the general direction of gunners/shooters will fully supress them (one of the few cases where supression is useful in this game).

Lawbringer is trash and not worth using on anyone.

[Garviel Loken]

Originally posted by Samurai:

Originally posted by Garviel Loken:

I have multiple really OP builds so I feel like I know how to put a really good one together but for some reason I can do well enough with any gun that is not a shotgun.

Any suggestions or is the shotgun just a bad gun that is too hard to make work?

double barrel is pretty nuts with vet

Haven't tried it yet. I will give it a look.

[Garviel Loken]

Originally posted by unless specifically stated:

Short answer: yes;

Long answer: very class and build dependant.

DB shotgun is great for one particular build: Manstopper + Flechette on a Weapon Specialist veteran. You can get 100% crit after a weapon swap and quickly do two crits with insane cleave + 12 bleed stacks. Don't use braced fire. For Zealot it's pretty bad, because it's basically a worse second melee weapon.

Slug shotgun (Agri) is OK on the veteran since you can one-shot most specials with a body shot and elites with a headshot with the Slug. In addition, Slug shot also has very high stagger (can stagger Crushers out of their animations with a headshot and open up Bulwark shields) and has great synergy with Full Bore/No Respite blessings. Bad on Zealot because you don't have enough damage without crits.

Dragon Breath (Katael) is OK on the veteran as well (but worse than Agri IMO), but works much better on a crit Zealot builds. Scattershot + Flechette + special ammo spam can delete horders and heavily damage any elites and specials hit, in addition special ammo has insane supression for some reason and just shooting in the general direction of gunners/shooters will fully supress them (one of the few cases where supression is useful in this game).

Lawbringer is trash and not worth using on anyone.

Thanks, I am sure I can use this. I was just surprised that this is the only weapon that stumps me. I remember it being OP before.

[Urinietszche]

Shotgun is about crit cleaving hordes. Zarona combat shotgun with weakspot dmg multipliers on veteran do the job. Tactical reload node helps you load special ammo faster (basic ammo is useless xd)

[Garviel Loken]

Originally posted by Urinietszche:

Shotgun is about crit cleaving hordes. Zarona combat shotgun with weakspot dmg multipliers on veteran do the job. Tactical reload node helps you load special ammo faster (basic ammo is useless xd)

Yeah I was getting the feeling basic ammo is garbage.

[Urinietszche]

Originally posted by unless specifically stated:

Short answer: yes;

Long answer: very class and build dependant.

DB shotgun is great for one particular build: Manstopper + Flechette on a Weapon Specialist veteran. You can get 100% crit after a weapon swap and quickly do two crits with insane cleave + 12 bleed stacks. Don't use braced fire. For Zealot it's pretty bad, because it's basically a worse second melee weapon.

Slug shotgun (Agri) is OK on the veteran since you can one-shot most specials with a body shot and elites with a headshot with the Slug. In addition, Slug shot also has very high stagger (can stagger Crushers out of their animations with a headshot and open up Bulwark shields) and has great synergy with Full Bore/No Respite blessings. Bad on Zealot because you don't have enough damage without crits.

Dragon Breath (Katael) is OK on the veteran as well (but worse than Agri IMO), but works much better on a crit Zealot builds. Scattershot + Flechette + special ammo spam can delete horders and heavily damage any elites and specials hit, in addition special ammo has insane supression for some reason and just shooting in the general direction of gunners/shooters will fully supress them (one of the few cases where supression is useful in this game).

Lawbringer is trash and not worth using on anyone.

https://youtu.be/a6z9m38S7nw?si=X-gzF3Bxh28m7Bif

[❛❛Vénttea❜❜]

Originally posted by Garviel Loken:

Originally posted by Samurai:

double barrel is pretty nuts with vet

Haven't tried it yet. I will give it a look.

It honestly is pretty stupid exclusively on Veteran because of their high crit value, faster reload, free 1 bullet auto-reload upon melee on Weapon Specialist upon weapon swap.

It's stupid on Zealot because of Anointed and that makes the fire both barrels very worth using.

[unless specifically stated]

Originally posted by Garviel Loken:

Originally posted by Urinietszche:

Shotgun is about crit cleaving hordes. Zarona combat shotgun with weakspot dmg multipliers on veteran do the job. Tactical reload node helps you load special ammo faster (basic ammo is useless xd)

Yeah I was getting the feeling basic ammo is garbage.

It is ok for the follow up shots if you proc Full Bore + No Respite. For example one slug headshot + one normal headshot will kill a Reaper. So generally speaking you should ALWAYS load up slugs to proc Full Bore and only then use basic ammo.

[Blazed_minD]

Originally posted by ❛❛Véntea❜❜:

Originally posted by Garviel Loken:

Haven't tried it yet. I will give it a look.

It honestly is pretty stupid exclusively on Veteran because of their high crit value, faster reload, free 1 bullet auto-reload upon melee on Weapon Specialist upon weapon swap.

Double barrel on Vet is a solid weapon, adds a nice play-style change too. Can't say I had as much fun using the combat shotgun though.

[Arani]

Originally posted by Garviel Loken:

I have multiple really OP builds so I feel like I know how to put a really good one together but for some reason I can do well enough with any gun that is not a shotgun.

Any suggestions or is the shotgun just a bad gun that is too hard to make work?

The single-barrel shotties are about the hardest to build into and use well. They used to be plain OP, especially Kantrael, but since the shadow nerf they're just strong. But even back when they were OP the community & meta thought they sucked. That's bc they had no idea how to use them.

Most guns are super simple: Use hip fire in super close quarters & panic situations, ADS to aim, that's all.

But for shotguns hip fire has higher spread and lower finesse dmg bonuses. Each shotty has a different level of extra finesse dmg on ADS but for all of them it's significant. For Agri & Zarona/Lawrbringer the relative finesse dmg in ADS is over 2x higher. Since all finesse buffs from talents & blessings apply to that portion of extra dmg only, that means on many shotty builds ADS does an insane amount of extra dmg over hip. They also have the special, which for every single one is an absolutely essential part of using the gun right. Finally ofc there's the whole reload system which requires constant management.

There are a plethora of talents that buff reloads, dmg, crit etc. some depend on your weapon being near full, or empty. For all of those shotties have a completely different level of control compared to normal guns. And the special speed is buffed by reload speed so that also plays into it (for example vets can easily buff the special speed to 50%+, which is just a straight +50% DPS).

Their blessing meta heavily favors Scattershot for crits and those crits for either Flechette (bleed) or Man-Stopper (cleave).

So to put it all together, using shotguns right means constantly changing between 1) hip shots for spread to stack Scattershot, 2) ADS shots to max the dmg & impact from those crits, 3) specials for single-target & penetration (Agri), perfectly horizontally spread cleaving headshots (Lawbringer/Zarona), or cleaving burn DoT's & CC (Kantrael/Accatran) depending on the weapon. Specials take time to load, so you need to anticipate them before you use them, and besides Agri if you guessed wrong you likely just wasted that shot. Bc Scatter stacks on # of targets hit ofc, your positioning and target prioritization is a big part of how to play.

Beyond that your build has to support the weapon with bonus crits, bonus finesse dmg etc. Vets have access to insane finesse buffs. They also have Deadshot which pairs fantastically with shotties, since now your hip shots both do the spread & Scatter for your gun as well as let your stamina recharge, while ADS then burn the stamina to near-guarantee those crits. Zelly stealth gives 2 autocrits with +100% finesse dmg per shot, letting you force them on-demand. Both have a whole plethora of other talents which massively buff shotties.

All in all, building into and using shotties is easily 10x harder than most other guns. But used well they're very good, and can deal with completely unique situations no other gun can.

[J.P.]

the double barrel is good, the combat shotguns suck terribly

[Zsrai]

Originally posted by Julius Robert Oppenheimer:

Originally posted by J.P.:

the double barrel is good, the combat shotguns suck terribly

Haha for me it's vise versa xDD

Combat Shotgun is like a 1-hit sniper.

Double barrel is so slow and unprecise with low amount of ammunition. And shooting both at the same time is always weak.

But in comparison to real weapons all shotguns suck in DarkTide.
Shotguns are more a fun-factor and less meta gameplay

That's because the double barrel is a sawed off and is best at close range. It's the opposite of the slug shottie, basically. The DB deletes enemies in melee range, especially with the double blast.

[ToucanSafari]

all weapons are usable, but shotgun is by far one of the worse ones. it's just a fun thing to mess around with when QPing damnations.

[Amadeus]

Originally posted by unless specifically stated:

Short answer: yes;

Long answer: very class and build dependant.

DB shotgun is great for one particular build: Manstopper + Flechette on a Weapon Specialist veteran. You can get 100% crit after a weapon swap and quickly do two crits with insane cleave + 12 bleed stacks. Don't use braced fire. For Zealot it's pretty bad, because it's basically a worse second melee weapon.

Slug shotgun (Agri) is OK on the veteran since you can one-shot most specials with a body shot and elites with a headshot with the Slug. In addition, Slug shot also has very high stagger (can stagger Crushers out of their animations with a headshot and open up Bulwark shields) and has great synergy with Full Bore/No Respite blessings. Bad on Zealot because you don't have enough damage without crits.

Dragon Breath (Katael) is OK on the veteran as well (but worse than Agri IMO), but works much better on a crit Zealot builds. Scattershot + Flechette + special ammo spam can delete horders and heavily damage any elites and specials hit, in addition special ammo has insane supression for some reason and just shooting in the general direction of gunners/shooters will fully supress them (one of the few cases where supression is useful in this game).

Lawbringer is trash and not worth using on anyone.

This