Mods should be banned.

[CedricO]

Bad experiences with the community are a rarity for me, i think ive only had like 2 bad encounters with other players in all my hours of playing this game. But its the latest one that had me thinking about the title of this discussion.

On a Auric Heresy Forge mission when i told somebody multiple times to stick with the team i got told that i should stay quiet since i had done the least dmg (i had no way of checking since i don't use mods) but the real kicker for me was that the team (mostly me) had have to bail him out on like 4 separate occasions. It led to an ugly situation in which the team (which had been doing extremely well up to that point) to just start devolving into "you should have left him to die" and general all around name calling.

The most important thing in this game (for me, subjective opinion) seems to be sticking together, knowing how to not get cc'd, general situational awareness. efficiently taking out Elites that threaten to destabilize the situation. And mods (in this situation) seem only to reintroduce things that were left out (again, in my opinion) for good reason. There is no point in having stat screens to show off your kills/dmg if your team comes out with 0 deaths and the mission dident drag on forever. There is not even a need for it when it does turn to s... since its usually quite obvious what is causing the issue, like somebody lagging behind, or going to far ahead solo, and being completely oblivious to the audio cues that point to -> you are about to get netted, dodge.

Which all lead me to believe that mods keep the wrong mindsets alive. And the whole argument of "i want to see if my build is any good and i need mods for that" is irrelevant since all that matters is what you do with your build, not how min maxy it is or how much "sick deeps" you can do with it. The only mod that somewhat adds to the game seems to be true levels which should just be part of the base game. Although it would be scary to see how many hours people have sunk into this great (but unstable) game.

[Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am]

agree with tocic starter

[Damage Case]

Originally posted by Haggis:

Originally posted by BigJ:

Adding to this, we had a time without scoreboard or mods and things weren't too different, you still had people chasing the killfeed.

This is a good point. Darktide has some of the most satisfying combat of any game. People enjoy killing in it. The enjoyment is going to make them want to kill more. The fact that killing enemies as quickly as possible improves the odds of your team surviving is just going to lead to those players who are able killing everything as soon as it appears doing so.

You cannot blame people for this. The game is all about killing, and from an objective perspective where you want to win a map; killing everything instantly is the best way to play.

AAAAAAAAAAANNNDDDDDDDD we found the speed runner knife killer that just kills the minions, while running across the map, leaving the rest of the team to deal with the really tough guys.

[No emaN]

Terrible take to automatically assume it is a mod that causes these issues, as players will still presume their "better than you" situation. Short story, I played with a Veteran (pre-nerf) a good while back running meta gear running mods, I'm talking a min/max build. I think I was running Trauma (Rending Shockwave + Warp Flurry) + Assail with a melee focus (cant recall melee) on Psyker. The guy chronically ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ about me "casting out of position with staff" when using staff despite I was getting my casts off without taking damage and not being tied to the team. At the end he tells me I'm a good Psyker but draws emphasis on how he dealt 75k more damage than me on a weapon that can easily deal 10k dps as I saw him farm kills. Let's be generous to say he dealt +100k more that'd be only a few seconds worth of dumping into a pack of enemies which is common in high end difficulties. Instead of constantly moving forward & clearing players will emphasize damage over pace & impact as statistics don't draw a simplified self-composed & constructed narrative for this. Damage is the easiest feedback loop to fall into. Another situation like this was a Veteran without stats bragging when he contributed nothing as he let enemies win fights & allowing for teammates to get suppressed.

The wrong mindset is blaming the one over the many, blaming mods for something you dislike. It's similar to shield Ogryn in beta without bleed, you simply lapse perspective and skill to understand what the game is about. Standing near each other has net gain & benefits but it's not always necessary to fulfill your roles but actively contributing to the fight and being at the forefront always simplifies encounters and team advantages in a push. Going back to instance of a shield ogryn in beta, some players are too busy ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ about an Ogryn using shield special yet it spans out gunner AI to be flushed through flank angles, gets gunners closer for a takedown & resets dodges. Instead, they focus on that the Ogryn isn't doing anything as they're complaining while accomplishing nothing. One player downs; the three headless chicken follow because they didn't do anything better as well. If you sit back & especially by the team, you're not as good as you think. You need to contribute outside of your team whether they extended or not; the difference is playstyle & mindset. You shouldn't need one player out of the four present to succeed.

[XLbuff]

As long as devs for some reason doesn't add basic features like hub hotkeys please don't even talk about mod bans.

[Cosmophase]

Originally posted by CedricO:

Bad experiences with the community are a rarity for me, i think ive only had like 2 bad encounters with other players in all my hours of playing this game. But its the latest one that had me thinking about the title of this discussion.

On a Auric Heresy Forge mission when i told somebody multiple times to stick with the team i got told that i should stay quiet since i had done the least dmg (i had no way of checking since i don't use mods) but the real kicker for me was that the team (mostly me) had have to bail him out on like 4 separate occasions. It led to an ugly situation in which the team (which had been doing extremely well up to that point) to just start devolving into "you should have left him to die" and general all around name calling.

The most important thing in this game (for me, subjective opinion) seems to be sticking together, knowing how to not get cc'd, general situational awareness. efficiently taking out Elites that threaten to destabilize the situation. And mods (in this situation) seem only to reintroduce things that were left out (again, in my opinion) for good reason. There is no point in having stat screens to show off your kills/dmg if your team comes out with 0 deaths and the mission dident drag on forever. There is not even a need for it when it does turn to s... since its usually quite obvious what is causing the issue, like somebody lagging behind, or going to far ahead solo, and being completely oblivious to the audio cues that point to -> you are about to get netted, dodge.

Which all lead me to believe that mods keep the wrong mindsets alive. And the whole argument of "i want to see if my build is any good and i need mods for that" is irrelevant since all that matters is what you do with your build, not how min maxy it is or how much "sick deeps" you can do with it. The only mod that somewhat adds to the game seems to be true levels which should just be part of the base game. Although it would be scary to see how many hours people have sunk into this great (but unstable) game.

What keeps the wrong mindsets alive is a bad attitude/personality. Mods not existing is NOT going to fix that.

"I joined a regular Heresy the other day, I told someone multiple times to drop an ammo crate as 3 teammates needed ammo but he didn't. He then proceeds to say it's not my problem you can't use your ammo properly, learn to play and as a result, one by one goes down until the team is dead and the guy who didn't drop the ammo crate leaves."

Now, what are you going to say in that situation? "Oh a mod must of caused this" no, its a bad attitude. At the same time, if you KNEW he was using the mod to show ammo count, you would INSTANTLY say it was because of the mod when in reality, mod or not, he wouldn't of dropped the ammo crate. Just like, mod or not, if you play bad you will get called out.

Do you understand my point? You guys sit here and complain about someone mentioning damage etc when you should be blaming the SOURCE of the problem I.e, the person themselves, rather than an outside source.

Also, why do you care if someone is complaining about low damage? I usually have the 3rd lowest damage on my team yet I have more special kills than 2 teammates combined, 80% of games. Amount of damage means absolutely nothing if you are hitting enemy breakpoints. The ONLY time damage will actually really matter is if you are doing any missions that have a few monstrosities.

[sinephase]

without scoreboard it's tough to know how well your build is actually doing. As for the toxic loser who can't stick together - block him and don't engage if it doesn't amuse you

[Haggis]

Originally posted by Damage Case:

Originally posted by Haggis:

This is a good point. Darktide has some of the most satisfying combat of any game. People enjoy killing in it. The enjoyment is going to make them want to kill more. The fact that killing enemies as quickly as possible improves the odds of your team surviving is just going to lead to those players who are able killing everything as soon as it appears doing so.

You cannot blame people for this. The game is all about killing, and from an objective perspective where you want to win a map; killing everything instantly is the best way to play.

AAAAAAAAAAANNNDDDDDDDD we found the speed runner knife killer that just kills the minions, while running across the map, leaving the rest of the team to deal with the really tough guys.

I say kill everything immediately. You interpret that as "leaving the rest of the team to deal with the really tough guys".

No, I mean: shoot every special as soon as it appears before it can get close and do any damage. I mean instantly drop krak grenades on crushers to eliminate the threat. If I end up getting all the kills then so be it, if I see a threat I'm almost never going to think: "I'll leave that one for you" (the common exceptions being if a vet has thrown a krak grenade or if a psyker is charging a brainburst, as I know that the special is going to die), because more of than you'd think the ally will not be able to deal with it, and that ally then ends up dead, and the special ends up escaping while I get pre-occupied with other enemies, and we end up having to clutch or risk losing. It's better that I, and everyone else on the team, just immediately tries to kill everything that is a threat if we have the opportunity to do so.

[BÆRD]

Thanks for your opinion, but friction between humans and being a d...head are not a result of mods existence. Now run along and play.

[Dr. Merkwürdiglieben]

I think all bait posters should be banned permanently.

[Damage Case]

Originally posted by Haggis:

Originally posted by Damage Case:

AAAAAAAAAAANNNDDDDDDDD we found the speed runner knife killer that just kills the minions, while running across the map, leaving the rest of the team to deal with the really tough guys.

I say kill everything immediately. You interpret that as "leaving the rest of the team to deal with the really tough guys".

No, I mean: shoot every special as soon as it appears before it can get close and do any damage. I mean instantly drop krak grenades on crushers to eliminate the threat. If I end up getting all the kills then so be it, if I see a threat I'm almost never going to think: "I'll leave that one for you" (the common exceptions being if a vet has thrown a krak grenade or if a psyker is charging a brainburst, as I know that the special is going to die), because more of than you'd think the ally will not be able to deal with it, and that ally then ends up dead, and the special ends up escaping while I get pre-occupied with other enemies, and we end up having to clutch or risk losing. It's better that I, and everyone else on the team, just immediately tries to kill everything that is a threat if we have the opportunity to do so.

Yeah, ok...I rest my case. Also, who are you to say that the others can't deal with the threats?

[LesserMagic]

Oh god, you're one of those people that gives orders via chat. No thanks, I'll keep my mods.

[Crukih]

I don’t use mods personally. I don’t see a problem with the scoreboard mid. A person like the one you described was likely to act that way with or without the mod. Just ignore those with small ♥♥♥♥ energy.

[namali]

I play on t5 auric all the time and never have problems with the community.

[Rodoto]

Despite the fact that this is another post blaming the scoreboard, I find it funny that you end your post saying that True Level is a great mod compared to scoreboard. People are just as likely to judge players by their total level as by their total damage.

[wesleyam123]

Chill dude, mods are more than needed when the devs can't even implement QoL features to their own game.
I use the scoreboard to know if the build I'm running acutally performs the way I want it to, if people choose to run after numbers its their business anyways, they bought the game and play however they want to, sticking to the team or not, everyone might want to experience the game their way.
It's very easy to identify if the player is helping or not, even tho they don't stick together...if you call out people you might end up hearing undisered responses.
Anyways, it's auric heresy, you're not even meeting the quality players yet, if you wanna play with better(or not) players jump to auric maelstorm, runs are much smoother then lower difficulty games.