Zealot Thunder Hammer v Crusher?

[pumkin1988]

I just (sorta) got my lvl 30 Ogryn to where I want him with gear and feel I am in a good spot. I am moving onto my lvl 30 Zealot.

I just got a purple Crusher. Before I was using a blue Thunder Hammer. I've played around with both of them but I'll be honest I don't really see or understand any difference other than maybe swinging patterns?

Can somebody please explain to me which is the better weapon of the two please? Or what the differences are?
Thanks

(For more info. I use my Flamer for hordes so I mostly need a weapon that is good on single target)

[NightWhisper]

The major difference is in their activate ability where the Thunder Hammer will deal major to a single target and the Crusher will deal damage to multiple enemies.

[EmDriver]

Yup like NightWhisper said. The crusher's aoe ability is a aoe knockback as well though, which is the primary reason to use the crushers activated power. The crusher has one of the best cleaving (stagger cleave) heavy follow up attack but it is even slower then the thunder hammer's attacks.

[dot]

Crusher Power attack makes a big shock wave. Try it, just charge it and with just a light attack you can stagger all trash mobs in a pretty large radius.

Other difference is that all attacks of the Crusher cleave but against heavy armored with which you need a heavy attack to cleave. Hammer can`t cleave through anything with light attacks or charged attacks.


"(For more info. I use my Flamer for hordes so I mostly need a weapon that is good on single target)"
For single target I would say the best weapons would be the combat axes imo.
But between Crusher and Hammer, Hammer is better against a single target.

[( °□°） ︵GAMBASadge]

Fun = thunder hammer, comfort all round= crusher

[Forblaze]

Thunder hammer is cooler. No stats or utility that the crusher brings to the table can compete.

[EmDriver]

I think they are both cool and fun.

[Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am]

Swing patterns mean a lot. For someone familiar with Kruber's hammer in Vermintide the Thunder Hammer will be pleasant and easy to use.
While Power maul has awful moveset in all measures.
While if you learn from zero, you may choose what you want.

Power hammer has purpose of deleting bosses. Second priority is bulwarks, which can be dispatched in 2 hits in face. Third - ultimate crowd control vs hordes of zombies, while staying mobile and healthy yourself.
Learn to cansel stun animation after powered strike by pressing 1 after hit connects.
Learn when better use light and where heavy powered.
Not suited to rush trenches and bound all shooters, but good for defensive playstile.

Maul has purpose of Ultimate++ crowd control. Spam specail+light or special+heavy to targets bigger and make untouchable territory of 10 meters around.
Low damage, but who cares of damage if noone able to hit you.
Including very dence hordes, mixed with shields and ragers.
Maul is weapon for teamplay. Despite you can stun the horde, it take ages to kill it alone.

Both weapons require good ranged weapon. Best option is agripina braced or agripina infantry.

[EastCLiff]

Hammer = Face to Face for boss fight with high damage
Power maul = easier and stronger area control

[EmDriver]

Originally posted by Eagle_I_am:

Swing patterns mean a lot. For someone familiar with Kruber's hammer in Vermintide the Thunder Hammer will be pleasant and easy to use.
While Power maul has awful moveset in all measures.
While if you learn from zero, you may choose what you want.

Power hammer has purpose of deleting bosses. Second priority is bulwarks, which can be dispatched in 2 hits in face. Third - ultimate crowd control vs hordes of zombies, while staying mobile and healthy yourself.
Learn to cansel stun animation after powered strike by pressing 1 after hit connects.
Learn when better use light and where heavy powered.

Maul has purpose of Ultimate++ crowd control. Spam specail+light or special+heavy to targets bigger and make untouchable territory of 10 meters around.
Low damage, but who cares of damage if noone able to hit you.
Including very dence hordes, mixed with shields and ragers.

I argue that the crusher gives you slightly higher survivability then the thunder hammer from a technical perspective. Because of how quickly you use the activated power from the crusher, and it staggers and knocks back everything except bosses, you can stay alive for much longer then the thunder hammer. The 2end heavy attack on the crusher (follow up to the 1st light attack) also has better cleave then the thunder hammer at the cost of being a slower attack. This means that the crusher has a higher skill ceiling then the thunder hammer.
The reason why things are generally called cheeze is because they are very powerful without having to be skilled or the need to practice a lot with it. The way that "cheeze" is balanced in this game is that it has a very low skill ceiling. This is why almost every zealot is basically the exsact same with the flamer, because their is very little room to improve how good you are with it. It just does what it does, if you know what I mean.

[Eagle_I_am | .tv/eagle_i_am]

Originally posted by EmDriver:

Originally posted by Eagle_I_am:

Swing patterns mean a lot. For someone familiar with Kruber's hammer in Vermintide the Thunder Hammer will be pleasant and easy to use.
While Power maul has awful moveset in all measures.
While if you learn from zero, you may choose what you want.

Power hammer has purpose of deleting bosses. Second priority is bulwarks, which can be dispatched in 2 hits in face. Third - ultimate crowd control vs hordes of zombies, while staying mobile and healthy yourself.
Learn to cansel stun animation after powered strike by pressing 1 after hit connects.
Learn when better use light and where heavy powered.

Maul has purpose of Ultimate++ crowd control. Spam specail+light or special+heavy to targets bigger and make untouchable territory of 10 meters around.
Low damage, but who cares of damage if noone able to hit you.
Including very dence hordes, mixed with shields and ragers.

I argue that the crusher gives you slightly higher survivability then the thunder hammer from a technical perspective. Because of how quickly you use the activated power from the crusher, and it staggers and knocks back everything except bosses, you can stay alive for much longer then the thunder hammer. The 2end heavy attack on the crusher (follow up to the 1st light attack) also has better cleave then the thunder hammer at the cost of being a slower attack. This means that the crusher has a higher skill ceiling then the thunder hammer.
The reason why things are generally called cheeze is because they are very powerful without having to be skilled or the need to practice a lot with it. The way that "cheeze" is balanced in this game is that it has a very low skill ceiling. This is why almost every zealot is basically the exsact same with the flamer, because their is very little room to improve how good you are with it. It just does what it does, if you know what I mean.

First, no reason to argue me, you said nothing contrary.
Second, when you started about skill ceiling and cheese - looks like you not understand what you are talking about.
In current state TH very high both join barrier and skill cap. While I personally see no better use for maul outside spamming powered attacks and facerolling keyboard.
About flamer - it hase average join barrier, but to be very good flamer user, you have to learn a lot. Not getting hit, switching to flamer and reload in crowd, ammo saving, fighting against ranged withou team help.

[EmDriver]

Originally posted by Eagle_I_am:

Originally posted by EmDriver:

I argue that the crusher gives you slightly higher survivability then the thunder hammer from a technical perspective. Because of how quickly you use the activated power from the crusher, and it staggers and knocks back everything except bosses, you can stay alive for much longer then the thunder hammer. The 2end heavy attack on the crusher (follow up to the 1st light attack) also has better cleave then the thunder hammer at the cost of being a slower attack. This means that the crusher has a higher skill ceiling then the thunder hammer.
The reason why things are generally called cheeze is because they are very powerful without having to be skilled or the need to practice a lot with it. The way that "cheeze" is balanced in this game is that it has a very low skill ceiling. This is why almost every zealot is basically the exsact same with the flamer, because their is very little room to improve how good you are with it. It just does what it does, if you know what I mean.

First, no reason to argue me, you said nothing contrary.
Second, when you started about skill ceiling and cheese - looks like you not understand what you are talking about.
In current state TH very high both join barrier and skill cap. While I personally see no better use for maul outside spamming powered attacks and facerolling keyboard.
About flamer - it haverage jjoin barrier, but to be very good flamer user, you have to learn a lot. Not getting hit, switching to flamer and reload in crowd, ammo saving, fighting against ranged withou team help.

I say argue as in the sense that I have a logical argument for something, not in the way that I am going to argue with you ;)
I guess I can explain instead of assuming you know what I mean.

Originally posted by Eagle_I_am:

Swing patterns mean a lot.
While Power maul has awful moveset in all measures.
While if you learn from zero, you may choose what you want.
Power hammer has purpose of deleting bosses.
Third - ultimate crowd control vs hordes of zombies, while staying mobile and healthy yourself.
Learn when better use light and where heavy powered.

These are all opinions (which is fine), but you do not explain why you believe any of this to be the case (which is fine as well). The way I constructed my argument uses logic has opposed to opinions, and while my arguments support my opinions, I am using non opinionated reasons for why this to be the case.
Having an argument for something is different then having an argument with someone.

[KTVindicare]

Originally posted by dot:

Hammer can`t cleave through anything with light attacks or charged attacks.

This is a lie.

Thunder Hammer Power Attacks will cleave everything except for Monstrosities or Carapace armored enemies.

You can still get interrupted mid swing though so taking Punishment or Thy Wrath Be Swift is recommended when running Thunder Hammer so you can keep the swings coming.

With both weapons in a horde your goal isn't to be killing enemies so much as just controlling them, stunning them and knocking them down so your allies can thin them out safely.

[EmDriver]

Originally posted by KTVindicare:

Originally posted by dot:

Hammer can`t cleave through anything with light attacks or charged attacks.

Thunder Hammer Power Attacks will cleave everything except for Monstrosities or Carapace armored enemies.

Really, did they change this? The last time I used the thunder hammer the activated special was a single target attack.

[Sen Tenshi]

Crusher = Control Zealot, you make things easy for your team. They are doing all the killing. It's really easy to use.

The Thunder Hammer is harder to master, landing those charged attacks on weakpoint everytime can be tricky. it's easy to hit some trash or your teammate suddenly bodyblocking your attack. It take forever to activate and hit something so if you're missing your target, it can be frustrating. But when you get good at it, it's quite deadly.
You have some control aswell but it's nothing like the crusher, even when you're good at cancelling heavy.
The TH kills faster tho...

I think both are really good, but the TH require more skills to really shine.

[Silverquick]

Originally posted by EmDriver:

Originally posted by KTVindicare:

Thunder Hammer Power Attacks will cleave everything except for Monstrosities or Carapace armored enemies.

Really, did they change this? The last time I used the thunder hammer the activated special was a single target attack.

No they didn't it won't Cleave if you charge it up.
I think he was speaking in terms of the Heavy Attacks, not the Charged attacks. There is confusion on this from Vermintide Players since Charged Attacks used to mean a full hold it down until it releases Heavy Attack in Vermintide.
VS Darktide where it means hitting the Special Attack Button to charge up the weapon.