How are people struggling with FPS?

[BundaBender]

i see forums where people with 4090 are getting stutters and below 60 fps, i run 3080 and have 58-60 fps consistently even in city??

[D. Flame]

Originally posted by BundaBender:

i see forums where people with 4090 are getting stutters and below 60 fps, i run 3080 and have 58-60 fps consistently even in city??

58 is also below 60.

[Kashra Fall]

Because the people with a 4090 are running or trying to run the game at native 4k. The 4090 is a strong card, but I don't think there is a processor strong enough to run 4k native with no frame gen and have no frame drops.

[BundaBender]

i know this is unoptimized garbage but how people describe it is like playing at 38 fps stutterfest with high tier card, my cpu isnt even all that so i guess im lucky?

[o0neza0o]

Originally posted by Kashra Fall:

Because the people with a 4090 are running or trying to run the game at native 4k. The 4090 is a strong card, but I don't think there is a processor strong enough to run 4k native with no frame gen and have no frame drops.

Its got nothing to do with the strength of the CPU, so basically there is an ancient "optimisation" trick that used to work for the old consoles when physics were tied to the frametime and that causes issues with sluggish movement and physics and tbh I have a feeling its also causing issues with high CPU usage which is mostly tied to their physics engine which seems like a simple fix but it depends on how they have tied their physics system...

In any case Bethesda have had this same thing in the past and was ridiculed for it and finally it was fixed in fallout 76 (yes the game has other issues) but Skyrim modders found a work around to patch that out and were able to make the game perform way better.

[BiggieJohn]

People seem to think 4k native is a reasonable goal. The truth is it's far better to just run at 1440P/ultrawide and crank frames.

[ThrillKill]

4080 super here with newest intel : i have no probs with stutters or fps, i have 8 cooling fans all maxed out when running the game because this unoptimised garbage melts my PC... also its as loud as a starting plane in my room when playing the game (yokohama AND outside of citys)

[Zaxxon]

no problem with stuttering, the real issue for me is the high CPU usage at 60fps, so even with a 4070 ti and a i5 14600K on 32GB DDR5 game on super fast SSD i'm playing locked at 30fps (like playing on consoles) because at 30fps CPU temps on average at 80C, but if i play at 60fps then CPU temps go beyond 90, 95C!

no other game (even stalker 2) uses so much CPU!

[Tomatokek]

its very heavy on the CPU. a lot of people probably are using old rigs with updated cards and are confused why it runs bad. they think all you need is a good card to run games well lol. I think it has alot to do with many people that have switched to PC within the past 5 - 10 years for the first time and do not realize how it works. That or they purchased a rig with a good card and ♥♥♥♥♥♥ CPU to save money not knowing the importance of a good CPU.

[D. Flame]

Originally posted by Tomatokek:

its very heavy on the CPU. a lot of people probably are using old rigs with updated cards and are confused why it runs bad. they think all you need is a good card to run games well lol. I think it has alot to do with many people that have switched to PC within the past 5 - 10 years for the first time and do not realize how it works. That or they purchased a rig with a good card and ♥♥♥♥♥♥ CPU to save money not knowing the importance of a good CPU.

A well optimized game doesn't need a super high end CPU. Until recently I was using a 4790K, a CPU that was 8 years old at the time, and it worked perfectly with a 3060.

So it seems like you are the uninformed one.

[HepatitisBean]

Originally posted by D. Flame:

Originally posted by BundaBender:

i see forums where people with 4090 are getting stutters and below 60 fps, i run 3080 and have 58-60 fps consistently even in city??

58 is also below 60.

Lol at this guy again, he's so adamant on that 2fps drop as if he's playing competitiv4 esports

[nightingale2k1]

yokohama is fine with Framegen I can get 60. Edo is worst ... just arrived and got stuttering, bugs. CPU almost 100% whole time in Edo.
RTX 4060 here.

[o0neza0o]

Originally posted by Tomatokek:

its very heavy on the CPU. a lot of people probably are using old rigs with updated cards and are confused why it runs bad. they think all you need is a good card to run games well lol. I think it has alot to do with many people that have switched to PC within the past 5 - 10 years for the first time and do not realize how it works. That or they purchased a rig with a good card and ♥♥♥♥♥♥ CPU to save money not knowing the importance of a good CPU.

Uhhh that isn't how that really works... Even with new games CPU usage isn't even that high on my 5800x3D the optimisation is bad regardless of how good the CPU is, this is due to using some old trick that no studio uses anymore due to the fact that when you tie physics with the frametime.

I spoke about this earlier and after actually doing a few tests I believe if they find a way to untie the physics from the frametime not only can they optimise the game better but the sluggish motion would also go away and you could get more frames without the physics going crazy

[DarugaX]

It doesn't matter what settings you're on you'll see frame drops.
Even those who have a 5090 struggle to get a consistent frame rate.
It may say you're getting 60fps but at some point the frame rate looks like its been cut to 30fps even though it states that you're still running the game at 60fps.

[While(true){}]

Originally posted by o0neza0o:

Originally posted by Tomatokek:

its very heavy on the CPU. a lot of people probably are using old rigs with updated cards and are confused why it runs bad. they think all you need is a good card to run games well lol. I think it has alot to do with many people that have switched to PC within the past 5 - 10 years for the first time and do not realize how it works. That or they purchased a rig with a good card and ♥♥♥♥♥♥ CPU to save money not knowing the importance of a good CPU.

Uhhh that isn't how that really works... Even with new games CPU usage isn't even that high on my 5800x3D the optimisation is bad regardless of how good the CPU is, this is due to using some old trick that no studio uses anymore due to the fact that when you tie physics with the frametime.

I spoke about this earlier and after actually doing a few tests I believe if they find a way to untie the physics from the frametime not only can they optimise the game better but the sluggish motion would also go away and you could get more frames without the physics going crazy

Nope, you are just guessing, but you can actually look up what the game is doing and see that it's much worse. Just hook up a profiler that supports native code and see exactly how the CPU is behaving.

From the readable names we can guess that the game is using a system to parallize all work by creating specialized groups of worker threads. So for example, they would create a group of threads for updating the movement, another for file loading, another group for collision, etc.. Pretty simple and straight forward.

On my 7950X I can observe a total of 400+ threads and if we look what they actually do, we can see that the majority are just sleeping. Your CPU is just kept busy by all those threads waking up for a very short amount of time and doing some minimal work. To be more specific, the vast majority of that actual work time (about 79%) is spend on calling synchronization primitives that send them back to sleep.

And if you look at those threads that actually do the most work, it's one called "game" and another one called "task scheduler" (way more work than those that indicate file IO / resource streaming).

In other words: the game is mostly single threaded and just floods the rest of your CPU in order to schedule and run loops that do nothing at all.

[o0neza0o]

Originally posted by While(true){}:

Originally posted by o0neza0o:

Uhhh that isn't how that really works... Even with new games CPU usage isn't even that high on my 5800x3D the optimisation is bad regardless of how good the CPU is, this is due to using some old trick that no studio uses anymore due to the fact that when you tie physics with the frametime.

I spoke about this earlier and after actually doing a few tests I believe if they find a way to untie the physics from the frametime not only can they optimise the game better but the sluggish motion would also go away and you could get more frames without the physics going crazy

Nope, you are just guessing, but you can actually look up what the game is doing and see that it's much worse. Just hook up a profiler that supports native code and see exactly how the CPU is behaving.

From the readable names we can guess that the game is using a system to parallize all work by creating specialized groups of worker threads. So for example, they would create a group of threads for updating the movement, another for file loading, another group for collision, etc.. Pretty simple and straight forward.

On my 7950X I can observe a total of 400+ threads and if we look what they actually do, we can see that the majority are just sleeping. Your CPU is just kept busy by all those threads waking up for a very short amount of time and doing some minimal work. To be more specific, the vast majority of that actual work time (about 79%) is spend on calling synchronization primitives that send them back to sleep.

And if you look at those threads that actually do the most work, it's one called "game" and another one called "task scheduler".

In other words: the game is mostly single threaded and just floods the rest of your CPU in order to schedule and run loops that do nothing at all.

Nope I wasn't just guessing, I did quit a bit of research and while you can look at the "task scheduler" that doesn't really say much, I used to use a lot of performance tools within game engines and they will tell you a lot more than task scheduler and in fact if you also do research as well part of the issue that is very common in games that tie physics with frametime is that CPU usage is also high, happens inside of skyrim, fallout 4, new vegas and thanks to some mods that have work arounds it actually helps a little (yeah there is a little more to it than that) but this isn't just guess work this is tests and comparisons.

You can also tell the physics are tied to frametime due to the motion being sluggish at 120 because the game tends to run too fast for the physics to catch up so the game has to slow down for it to catch up.

I also know Skyrim is also single threaded but again modded performs better than this so like I said I didn't just do guess work but one of the steps is to untie the physics from the frametime then they can start to really optimise the game because thats still a major issue.